facerip

Shadowbane 2.0

459 posts in this topic

On 3/3/2017 at 8:17 PM, facerip said:

Thank god for who ever is the driving force for all the Shadowbane similarities.  We have a home again!

That would be J. Todd Coleman. He founded Wolfpack and is now the creative director of Crowfall.

Edited by Pixelmancer

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On 3/3/2017 at 8:34 PM, VIKINGNAIL said:

Yea this game could end up being all the good from shadowbane without the low skill-ceiling from shadowbane.

Were you playing the same Shadowbane? I've been in quite a few badly outnumbered fights that we won anyway. SB had the highest skill ceiling of any non-action MMO.

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28 minutes ago, Pixelmancer said:

Were you playing the same Shadowbane? I've been in quite a few badly outnumbered fights that we won anyway. SB had the highest skill ceiling of any non-action MMO.

No... it had the lowest skill-ceiling of any pvpcentric mmorpg to date.  My guild was the best pvp guild in shadowbane, we've won the 10vs100+ battles, they required little mechanical skill and most of my guildmates from shadowbane were unable to even break 1800 in wow arena, and they were some of the best shadowbane players around.

I've seen maybe a handful of players that were good at shadowbane show the ability to adapt to new games and play them at a high level of skill, and none of them think shadowbane required very much skill. 

Shadowbane was slower-paced, most of the people that gravitate to that type of gameplay are the ones that get overwhelmed by the speed of competitive play in newer games.

Edited by VIKINGNAIL

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1 hour ago, VIKINGNAIL said:

No... it had the lowest skill-ceiling of any pvpcentric mmorpg to date.  My guild was the best pvp guild in shadowbane, we've won the 10vs100+ battles, they required little mechanical skill and most of my guildmates from shadowbane were unable to even break 1800 in wow arena, and they were some of the best shadowbane players around.

I've seen maybe a handful of players that were good at shadowbane show the ability to adapt to new games and play them at a high level of skill, and none of them think shadowbane required very much skill. 

Shadowbane was slower-paced, most of the people that gravitate to that type of gameplay are the ones that get overwhelmed by the speed of competitive play in newer games.

It took a different kind of skill in SB, but skill nonetheless. It took skill in character (and group) building, strategy and coordination, among other things. LoD basically diplomacy'd Colossa to death. If you put WhiteRa in Quake I'd curb stomp him. If you put me in Starcraft he'd own me. I have great aim and reflexes, but my APM is crap and I can't multitask. I don't see how skill at a completely different kind of MMO has any relevance to SB. And oh please. WoW is what took no skill. Name one time you're ever been outnumbered 10:1 in WoW and won? I sure can't. I've never even heard of someone else doing it. WoW was 70% gear and 30% RNG. I've beat people way higher level than me solely because I was on a battleground twink in purples and they were in normal leveling gear. And that's despite the game rigging all the rolls in the higher person's favor if there's a level gap.

Edited by Pixelmancer

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3 hours ago, Pixelmancer said:

It took a different kind of skill in SB, but skill nonetheless. It took skill in character (and group) building, strategy and coordination, among other things. LoD basically diplomacy'd Colossa to death. If you put WhiteRa in Quake I'd curb stomp him. If you put me in Starcraft he'd own me. I have great aim and reflexes, but my APM is crap and I can't multitask. I don't see how skill at a completely different kind of MMO has any relevance to SB. And oh please. WoW is what took no skill. Name one time you're ever been outnumbered 10:1 in WoW and won? I sure can't. I've never even heard of someone else doing it. WoW was 70% gear and 30% RNG. I've beat people way higher level than me solely because I was on a battleground twink in purples and they were in normal leveling gear. And that's despite the game rigging all the rolls in the higher person's favor if there's a level gap.

It wasn't a different kind of skill though, it was just a skill that only emphasized slow paced coordination and execution, there was no mechanical skill demand in shadowbane.  It would be similar to playing WoW battlegrounds with a slower paced game.

I understand the point you are trying to make with whitera, but whitera was not good at starcraft either, and if you could really stomp him at quake (for all you know he is actually good at quake) then you would understand, as a quake player, that shadowbane had very little mechanical skill required. 

I can see that you are inexperienced with WoW and especially the competitive pvp in WoW.  As someone that dominated both SB and WoW I can tell you that WoW arena players had way more skill than shadowbane players on average.

Shadowbane was literally like a slowed down version of WoW + no mechanical skill requirement.  WoW's mechanical skill was not immense, but it was much greater than shadowbane. 

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VN was so dominant at SB that no one remembers him and the glorious 6-ish weeks he played. We're all suppressing the memories of his leetness as a coping mechanism just so we can survive. Even the message boards were so emotionally devastated that they purged all recollection of him in fear of being beat down. 

Frykka and mourne like this

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Ehh for all that VN is he has sorta got a point about SB here. Shadowbane was slow slow slow. Like others have said, the majority of fights in SB were decided before you left your town's walls. TTK was fairly long and combat was more about comp counter play. Even roguebane was like this.

 

Not to say that SB wasn't awesome.

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8 hours ago, VIKINGNAIL said:

It wasn't a different kind of skill though, it was just a skill that only emphasized slow paced coordination and execution, there was no mechanical skill demand in shadowbane.  It would be similar to playing WoW battlegrounds with a slower paced game.

I understand the point you are trying to make with whitera, but whitera was not good at starcraft either, and if you could really stomp him at quake (for all you know he is actually good at quake) then you would understand, as a quake player, that shadowbane had very little mechanical skill required. 

I can see that you are inexperienced with WoW and especially the competitive pvp in WoW.  As someone that dominated both SB and WoW I can tell you that WoW arena players had way more skill than shadowbane players on average.

Shadowbane was literally like a slowed down version of WoW + no mechanical skill requirement.  WoW's mechanical skill was not immense, but it was much greater than shadowbane. 

I do understand Shadowbane had little mechanical skill involved. I'm just not pretending that mechanical skill is the only kind there is like you are. And now you're saying a pro player isn't good at the game people were willing to pay him to play or buy tickets to see him play. I just lost all ability to take anything you say seriously.

2 hours ago, vandarr said:

VN was so dominant at SB that no one remembers him and the glorious 6-ish weeks he played. We're all suppressing the memories of his leetness as a coping mechanism just so we can survive. Even the message boards were so emotionally devastated that they purged all recollection of him in fear of being beat down. 

To be fair though nobody probably remembers me either. Guilds I was part of or played with? Sure. Me? I'd be surprised. The closest I came to being Shadowbane famous was being friends with a few class advocates and forum mods, and I talked to Ashen in Ventrilo once. So basically if you saw a screenshot of someone notable there's a chance I'm one of the nameless peons in the background. Then again I'm also not bragging about how I'm the best SB player ever so...

Edited by Pixelmancer

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15 minutes ago, Pixelmancer said:

I do understand Shadowbane had little mechanical skill involved. I'm just not pretending that mechanical skill is the only kind there is like you are. And now you're saying professionals aren't good at the games they make a living being good at. I just lost all ability to take you seriously.

To be fair though nobody probably remembers me either. Guilds I was part of or played with? Sure. Me? I'd be surprised. The closest I came to being Shadowbane famous was being friends with a few class advocates and forum mods, and I talked to Ashen in Ventrilo once. So basically if you saw a screenshot of someone notable there's a chance I'm one of the nameless peons in the background.

I've never pretended mechanical skill is the only skill out there, but shadowbane completely lacked mechanical skill, and it wasn't all that tactically relevant either.  Great video game players understand that mechanical and tactical elements enhance each other. 

What kind of living has whitera made?  He played sc2 a ton in beta and early in launch and then got completely phased out by much better players shortly after.  His mechanical skills had declined and his decision making late game was never that great in the first place. 

Shadowbane may have been enjoyable for the vision it proposed, but it had a low skill-ceiling, and I guarantee that anyone that has found success in any major competitive games since then would agree. 

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