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goose

Testers
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  1. Like
    goose reacted to KanashiGD in Get rid of the passive skill system.   
    Even if the concept comes from another game how can you tell that they have not been thinking about it for the long term? It is not uncommon for design of systems in other games to find a home in a new game. I guess you speak so matter of fact without actually knowing what the developers "are thinking". Are you friends or associates with them talking to them on a daily basis about their designs? I can give you credit for being able to make predictions or use contextual information but I just don't see it as black and white.
    I agree that day 1 player will have an advantage but the skill trees are not infinite so the advantage falls off after so many months. The issue is that a new player may find investment to be difficult because they know it will take a lot of time to get to that "level."
    Honestly, you can think of the passive system as gear grinds. In GW2 you cannot just buy ascended gear, you have to craft it. That crafting can take time because there are gates of "daily" resets for specific components. In most cases the gear upgrades are small amounts of stat increases which can take a player a few months. It is literally a passive increase for the player being apart of the game that they would have to do otherwise. The difference is there is no convoluted system of grinding + crafting to get those.
    Look at it as a glass half full, it is a bonus to the game not a detriment.
  2. Like
    goose reacted to KanashiGD in Get rid of the passive skill system.   
    To be honest the most worrisome aspect of the passive skill system is the fact that it could provide significant bonuses to veteran players over newer players. That is not very different from current games, but the catch is that in most games a new player can grind up to equivalent based on their time investment. With the passive system that isn't the case. I'm still running over the numbers but at the moment I don't feel like the passive system is providing large gains, it seems to be providing more specialization, which I believe is the intention. 
    As stated before, I think this is just a niche concept that was developed for this niche game. Some people will not like it, some will.
  3. Thanks
    goose got a reaction from BarriaKarl in Slow Beginnings   
    This is actually still the case in modern MMOs, and it isn't going anywhere unless our brains stop wanting dopamine. This is a facet of psychology and marketing more than anything unique to MMOs - the first 20 minutes of gameplay are usually as rewarding as the next 40, and that first hour could represent some 10-20% of the next month of rewards. It's about giving your brain that endorphin rush, then slowing down the rate of reward so that you don't get bored of it, doling it out just often enough to keep you engaged so that the belief that the reward is still there and within reach doesn't ever leave.
    In a lot of ways, it's analogous to drugs - one of the things all successful MMOs AND all successful F2P games share is an addicting start. If you can keep butts in chairs (or faces on screens for mobile games) for a certain amount of time the first time someone plays, they are exponentially more likely to log back in, and if they log back in, they are exponentially more likely to log in regularly. These kinds of metrics are studiously tracked and there's endless research into them. It's an entire field of marketing in the games industry these days. So it isn't really that this has changed - game devs have just gotten better at it.
    So yes, a fun start is important, but so is a compelling game loop and worthwhile endgame content. Crowfall is certainly taking a risk by leaving the efficacy of the game loop and the endgame content up to other players, but...Minecraft did okay.
  4. Thanks
    goose got a reaction from KrakkenSmacken in Slow Beginnings   
    This is actually still the case in modern MMOs, and it isn't going anywhere unless our brains stop wanting dopamine. This is a facet of psychology and marketing more than anything unique to MMOs - the first 20 minutes of gameplay are usually as rewarding as the next 40, and that first hour could represent some 10-20% of the next month of rewards. It's about giving your brain that endorphin rush, then slowing down the rate of reward so that you don't get bored of it, doling it out just often enough to keep you engaged so that the belief that the reward is still there and within reach doesn't ever leave.
    In a lot of ways, it's analogous to drugs - one of the things all successful MMOs AND all successful F2P games share is an addicting start. If you can keep butts in chairs (or faces on screens for mobile games) for a certain amount of time the first time someone plays, they are exponentially more likely to log back in, and if they log back in, they are exponentially more likely to log in regularly. These kinds of metrics are studiously tracked and there's endless research into them. It's an entire field of marketing in the games industry these days. So it isn't really that this has changed - game devs have just gotten better at it.
    So yes, a fun start is important, but so is a compelling game loop and worthwhile endgame content. Crowfall is certainly taking a risk by leaving the efficacy of the game loop and the endgame content up to other players, but...Minecraft did okay.
  5. Thanks
    goose got a reaction from Gummiel in Slow Beginnings   
    I mean, the reason the start of the game is boring in Crowfall is that that isn't the start of the game. You've been here since the beginning, I shouldn't have to make this distinction to you. A good tutorial is an integral part of a game's success, and it's also usually one of the last parts to be created, since you can't make a tutorial until all the systems it is supposed to teach you about are done. Dunno what to tell you about the "current system" in an unfinished game. o_O
  6. Thanks
    goose got a reaction from Gummiel in Slow Beginnings   
    This is actually still the case in modern MMOs, and it isn't going anywhere unless our brains stop wanting dopamine. This is a facet of psychology and marketing more than anything unique to MMOs - the first 20 minutes of gameplay are usually as rewarding as the next 40, and that first hour could represent some 10-20% of the next month of rewards. It's about giving your brain that endorphin rush, then slowing down the rate of reward so that you don't get bored of it, doling it out just often enough to keep you engaged so that the belief that the reward is still there and within reach doesn't ever leave.
    In a lot of ways, it's analogous to drugs - one of the things all successful MMOs AND all successful F2P games share is an addicting start. If you can keep butts in chairs (or faces on screens for mobile games) for a certain amount of time the first time someone plays, they are exponentially more likely to log back in, and if they log back in, they are exponentially more likely to log in regularly. These kinds of metrics are studiously tracked and there's endless research into them. It's an entire field of marketing in the games industry these days. So it isn't really that this has changed - game devs have just gotten better at it.
    So yes, a fun start is important, but so is a compelling game loop and worthwhile endgame content. Crowfall is certainly taking a risk by leaving the efficacy of the game loop and the endgame content up to other players, but...Minecraft did okay.
  7. Like
    goose got a reaction from Kraahk in Slow Beginnings   
    I mean, the reason the start of the game is boring in Crowfall is that that isn't the start of the game. You've been here since the beginning, I shouldn't have to make this distinction to you. A good tutorial is an integral part of a game's success, and it's also usually one of the last parts to be created, since you can't make a tutorial until all the systems it is supposed to teach you about are done. Dunno what to tell you about the "current system" in an unfinished game. o_O
  8. Like
    goose reacted to baerin in Slow Beginnings   
    I can't stop laughing. That is so ridiculous. I never played DF but I can't imagine the devs had that in mind while having emergent game play daydreams.
     
    Jokes aside, part of what your feeling is what I'd call "Open Development Growing Pains." The idea that the game must maintain a playable state throughout development lets players see game play mechanics in their most raw and unpolished forms. Pre-Alpha 5.3/5.4 is debuting many systems that are still in their proof of concept stage. That's where the name Pre-Alpha comes from. The 2h ramp up time without tutorials will improve as development continues and more time can be focused on smoothing out the transition from "I just logged in" to "I can compete."
  9. Haha
    goose got a reaction from Armegeddon in ACE Q&A for January - Official Discussion Thread   
    Honestly, that wasn't much of a criticism of you.  You pointed out valid flaws in my argument because I was too lazy to make it properly, and I was trying to explain that I had done a poor job of explaining my position and didn't have the energy or poorly made socksgivery to do a better one.
    Edit: poorly made socksgivery. Definitely what I typed. Gonna start using that in real life, too.
  10. Haha
    goose got a reaction from ClockworkOrange in ACE Q&A for January - Official Discussion Thread   
    Honestly, that wasn't much of a criticism of you.  You pointed out valid flaws in my argument because I was too lazy to make it properly, and I was trying to explain that I had done a poor job of explaining my position and didn't have the energy or poorly made socksgivery to do a better one.
    Edit: poorly made socksgivery. Definitely what I typed. Gonna start using that in real life, too.
  11. Haha
    goose got a reaction from Gummiel in ACE Q&A for January - Official Discussion Thread   
    Honestly, that wasn't much of a criticism of you.  You pointed out valid flaws in my argument because I was too lazy to make it properly, and I was trying to explain that I had done a poor job of explaining my position and didn't have the energy or poorly made socksgivery to do a better one.
    Edit: poorly made socksgivery. Definitely what I typed. Gonna start using that in real life, too.
  12. Haha
    goose got a reaction from entityofsin in ACE Q&A for January - Official Discussion Thread   
    Honestly, that wasn't much of a criticism of you.  You pointed out valid flaws in my argument because I was too lazy to make it properly, and I was trying to explain that I had done a poor job of explaining my position and didn't have the energy or poorly made socksgivery to do a better one.
    Edit: poorly made socksgivery. Definitely what I typed. Gonna start using that in real life, too.
  13. Like
    goose got a reaction from entityofsin in ACE Q&A for January - Official Discussion Thread   
    Honestly, the thing for me is that we've gone through this song and dance like four times before, and I just don't have the energy to give a detailed point-by-point response with more specific explanations of why I view almost everything on your list - at least in the context of your complaint - as "not a design choice," if not actually polish, because experience has taught me that the goalposts will mysteriously move if I address your concerns in a more specific and time-consuming manner, leading absolutely nowhere and wasting an hour of my time. So..I'll just leave it at this instead of defending my position and wait for the game to come out.
  14. Like
    goose reacted to baerin in ACE Q&A for January - Official Discussion Thread   
    My objective in all this @ClockworkOrange is not to convince you that Crowfall's in a good place, but to be rid of the mindset that "it's bad and it will never get better." Crowfall is coming along at it's slow and steady pace, and we give feed back to keep it on track towards the vision we're all invested in.
  15. Like
    goose got a reaction from JamesGoblin in ACE Q&A for January - Official Discussion Thread   
    Honestly, the thing for me is that we've gone through this song and dance like four times before, and I just don't have the energy to give a detailed point-by-point response with more specific explanations of why I view almost everything on your list - at least in the context of your complaint - as "not a design choice," if not actually polish, because experience has taught me that the goalposts will mysteriously move if I address your concerns in a more specific and time-consuming manner, leading absolutely nowhere and wasting an hour of my time. So..I'll just leave it at this instead of defending my position and wait for the game to come out.
  16. Like
    goose got a reaction from JamesGoblin in ACE Q&A for January - Official Discussion Thread   
    I cut out the parts I'm not responding to directly. The TL;DR here is that, if these are your problems with combat, then you are talking quite exactly about polish. The design of combat is not implemented yet, and what I took away from "we feel like combat is in a good place" is that, mechanically, all the pieces of combat function.
    I agree that combat is kinda boring right now, but the distinct features and gameplay functionality that will make the game loop fun isn't what we're talking about - we're talking about "does combat flow feel correct" and "when I use 'stick it with the pointy end,' does the pointy end stick in it?"
    You're talking about features and class-specific functionality, which I thought it had been made pretty clear aren't in yet.
  17. Like
    goose got a reaction from KrakkenSmacken in Please, no advantage for $$$   
    Unless they backtrack severely, allowing the gear equipped on your vessel to be looted on death, which last I checked was a feature that was dropped and not planned to be re-implemented except in the more severe bands like The Dregs, losing extra gear for any other reason than that you decided to carry it around with you when you didn't need to is a non-factor.
    If you're going to extrapolate using hypothetical worst case scenarios, though, why not go all-out? Every time someone dies, they COULD be carrying a full inventory of top-tier crafted loot that then gets stolen, causing each death to cost "their guild" the equivalent of 5 full gear sets in addition to the decay on their vessel and equipped gear.
    OR you could make the more reasonable argument that the guild shouldn't be expected to foot every cost for every player, and that dying enough times to lose your body and every piece of equipped gear makes you a liability that having multiple roles you are effective at does not.
    Edit: though as a side note, if gathering remains as slow as it was last time I was on, this may be valid. However, if gathering remains as slow as it was, I personally would consider that a design flaw, 'cause gathering was pretty freaking tedious.
  18. Like
    goose reacted to entityofsin in Please, no advantage for $$$   
    With how gear alone is going to be looted, a single vessel is going to have multiple gear sets for it. In any pvp looting game that is what happens. Whether the loot is coming in the form of crafting mats or actual crafted items, it translates into sets of gear lost and time lost because of it.
    So this could mean more than 3 sets of gear. It could possibly mean 10 or 12 or even more depending on how much stuff is being lost in general. This is how it was in Albion Online except everything was lootable and if you died, you basically just had to accept you lost probably 3 or 4+ hours of gathering and crafting time for your armor, bag, cape, mount, consumables, and anything else you had on you, such as tools or crafting mats. Luckily gathering crafting mats accelerated a lot when you hit T4 to equip gathering gear.
    The point I am making is people in that game often had 3+ sets of extra gear to burn through if they decided to go out and pvp. I see the exact same behavior in Crowfall if not a largest emphasis of stockpiling full sets of gear, additional consumables, food items, possibly mounts, bags if they get put into the game, etc. If gathering mats remains as slow as it is in the current live testing, then those extra items being stockpiled is going to make a huge difference when it comes to winning campaigns.
  19. Like
    goose got a reaction from entityofsin in Please, no advantage for $$$   
    Unless they backtrack severely, allowing the gear equipped on your vessel to be looted on death, which last I checked was a feature that was dropped and not planned to be re-implemented except in the more severe bands like The Dregs, losing extra gear for any other reason than that you decided to carry it around with you when you didn't need to is a non-factor.
    If you're going to extrapolate using hypothetical worst case scenarios, though, why not go all-out? Every time someone dies, they COULD be carrying a full inventory of top-tier crafted loot that then gets stolen, causing each death to cost "their guild" the equivalent of 5 full gear sets in addition to the decay on their vessel and equipped gear.
    OR you could make the more reasonable argument that the guild shouldn't be expected to foot every cost for every player, and that dying enough times to lose your body and every piece of equipped gear makes you a liability that having multiple roles you are effective at does not.
    Edit: though as a side note, if gathering remains as slow as it was last time I was on, this may be valid. However, if gathering remains as slow as it was, I personally would consider that a design flaw, 'cause gathering was pretty freaking tedious.
  20. Like
    goose got a reaction from entityofsin in Please, no advantage for $$$   
    Even if they implement vessel decay, being bad at the game will cost your guild more than playing multiple classes.
    Playing two classes requires two vessels and two gear sets.
    Dying 21 times requires three vessels and three gear sets.
  21. Like
    goose got a reaction from APE in Please, no advantage for $$$   
    ..presumably, if you take your assassin, DON'T die, and swap to Templar, this remains true. After all, an Assassin and a Templar are both separate physical objects that need separate runes and potentially gear loadouts. But then again, dying in a game where gear degrades and can also potentially be stolen off your corpse means that this is an expense that will exist regardless, so I posit that being bad at the game will cost your guild more than using multiple classes.
    Not really going anywhere with this, just a casual observation of a turn of phrase I found odd. >.>
  22. Like
    goose got a reaction from JamesGoblin in Please nix the term "early access", for our sanity.   
    I also haven't had to interact with the purchase options since Kickstarter, but my understanding is that they added several additional clarifications about what you were buying before the option to pay them money. The issue as I see it is that no amount of information provided by ACE will help someone who doesn't read it, even if they just add an entire page that just says "The game is in early access. That means it isn't done yet, so the thing you're paying for now is not the same as the finished game. Click CONTINUE if you understand." People will click CONTINUE and then immediately take to the forums, asking for a refund because what they got wasn't the finished game.
  23. Like
    goose got a reaction from JamesGoblin in Please, no advantage for $$$   
    As of right now, bodies don't decay, though.
  24. Like
    goose got a reaction from baerin in ACE Q&A for January - Official Discussion Thread   
    I cut out the parts I'm not responding to directly. The TL;DR here is that, if these are your problems with combat, then you are talking quite exactly about polish. The design of combat is not implemented yet, and what I took away from "we feel like combat is in a good place" is that, mechanically, all the pieces of combat function.
    I agree that combat is kinda boring right now, but the distinct features and gameplay functionality that will make the game loop fun isn't what we're talking about - we're talking about "does combat flow feel correct" and "when I use 'stick it with the pointy end,' does the pointy end stick in it?"
    You're talking about features and class-specific functionality, which I thought it had been made pretty clear aren't in yet.
  25. Like
    goose got a reaction from Silisquish in Please, no advantage for $$$   
    This, yes, thank you. Game companies have to walk a razor's edge when it comes to real money influencing their game's economy, because it's a much more complex issue than most people are willing to acknowledge. Blizzard decided to take the more aggressive approach, and it worked out - they had a lot of botters and gold farmers, and in an effort to stop them, they decided to implement an extremely invasive anti-cheat program called The Warden. This happened more than a decade ago, some of its earlier iterations actually predating WoW, since it was originally implemented to stop the rampant hacking in Diablo 2 and Starcraft. There was a bit of a poorly made socksstorm over how invasive it was - it required access to your task manager and reserved the right to examine what tasks were running as a way of ensuring that you weren't running any blacklisted programs, among other things.
    If this sounds like DRM, that's because it is exactly DRM, but unlike so many other implementations, it worked, resulting in a massive reduction in botters and the near-overnight destruction of maphacks.
    However, just because there were so many fewer hackers didn't mean that the cash economy that had utilized them disappeared - places like D2JSP exist even today, allowing you to indirectly exchange cash for in-game items through a secondary market. Basically, you "donate" money to the site to help keep it running, and in exchange you get a currency that can be traded around the forums. That currency is traded between account holders in exchange for in-game trades, and there are various security measures you can utilize to prevent scamming if you so choose. However, as a result of the game preventing easy farming of valuable resources, they became less common and less relevant.
    At the time, though, Blizzard took issue with this secondary market, and as a result attempted to implement their own version of it in Diablo 3. You may have heard of the Auction House debacle, but if not, let me describe it for you in one sentence: Blizzard tried to do that thing I just described all official-like and it was a dumpster fire.
    At the end of the day, Blizzard - and every game company - has to make a decision. They can either find a way to prevent people from cheating by force, or they can find a way to dissuade them from cheating by making it easier for them to get what they need in-game through various means. The alternative is just letting cheating run rampant and hoping it doesn't tank the game's economy.
    The reality, though, is that most game companies opt for somewhere in the middle of the two, because neither of those options is a good one in the eyes of most gamers, and most game developers realize this. But the common thread is that, no matter what game developers do, if a game is popular enough, people will try to make money off of it, and how a developer chooses to limit this is always going to offend somebody's delicate sensibilities, because this is the internet where everybody is equal and no opinion is invalid.
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