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The Big Reveal: Crows and vessels - Official discussion thread

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TBH all that shallow power curve poorly made socks is just for the "on the fence" peeps so they can feel froggy enough to leap. You and I both know once you factor in the in game knowledge of environment and use of vessel the curve gets much steeper so splitting hairs over gear curve is pointless.


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@destrin I don't care.

Really? Because I think invalidating the shallow power curve that's at the core of a PvP game is a pretty big custard deal. If high-quality vessels can provide a distinct advantage then you can bet money that any guild worth their salt will only want high-quality vessels.


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That would completely negate the "shallow power curve" they have been preaching.

 

there also needs to be a big difference between crafted vessels and graveyard vessels...

 

power curve wont be as shallow as most of you think...

we wont see WoW levels , but I'm sure we'll see vessels being 3x as good as others

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One thing I'm confused about,

 

Q&A says you can only train archetype skills when you are playing that archetype but, the vip says you can train 3 at a time.

 

So if I have vip am I actively training 3 archetype skills at a time or just the 1 archetype I'm playing.

 

If it's still just 1 at a time and you can change what you're training at any time how's it different than non vip.

 

VIP is 1(general) + 3(archetype). Those 3 trains must be in separate archetypes. For example you could have 1 skill training in Knight, 1 in Champion, 1 in Ranger at the same time in addition to your general skill. (There is a good graphic in the Video when Melissa is talking)

 

Promotion classes count as their parent archetype, so you can't have 1 Knight and 1 Crusader training at the same time NOR could you have 1 Crusader and 1 Swordsman training at the same time. (since they are both promotions off of Knight)

 

The additional training slots for VIP simply give you more options for archetypes you would be effective in. If you play Knight most of the time but find a really cool Ranger vessel in a campaign or have one crafted for you, and you have been training ranger skills you might be inclined to give it a whirl.


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One thing I'm confused about,

 

Q&A says you can only train archetype skills when you are playing that archetype but, the vip says you can train 3 at a time.

 

So if I have vip am I actively training 3 archetype skills at a time or just the 1 archetype I'm playing.

 

If it's still just 1 at a time and you can change what you're training at any time how's it different than non vip.

It confused me at first too, but I think what the FAQ is trying to say is that when using a knight vessel, I don't get the benefit of the confessor skills I have trained. However, I can still passively train confessor skills while playing the knight. In fact, for VIPs, we can't train more than 1 skill at a time in any archetype. So if I'm playing a knight, I can train 1 knight skill, 1 general skill, and the other two skills would have to be from 2 other archetypes.

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there also needs to be a big difference between crafted vessels and graveyard vessels...

 

power curve wont be as shallow as most of you think...

we wont see WoW levels , but I'm sure we'll see vessels being 3x as good as others

 

Hope not.  That'll be a good way to lose new players.


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VIP is 1(general) + 3(archetype). Those 3 trains must be in separate archetypes. For example you could have 1 skill training in Knight, 1 in Champion, 1 in Ranger at the same time in addition to your general skill. (There is a good graphic in the Video when Melissa is talking)

 

Promotion classes count as their parent archetype, so you can't have 1 Knight and 1 Crusader training at the same time NOR could you have 1 Crusader and 1 Swordsman training at the same time. (since they are both promotions off of Knight)

 

The additional training slots for VIP simply give you more options for archetypes you would be effective in. If you play Knight most of the time but find a really cool Ranger vessel in a campaign or have one crafted for you, and you have been training ranger skills you might be inclined to give it a whirl.

Thanks, I think I was confusing the part talking about cross archetype skills with confessor and frostweaver


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Very cool. Also makes it easy to add archetypes later without forcing people to reroll to play them.

 

My only concern is too much RNG in the vessel crafting process. If I and some other guy put in the same components to craft a Confessor, and he comes up 15% better than I do for no reason other than luck, that really sucks.

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For the sake of clarification how does this skill and vessel system work in relation to the passive skill training system from before with primary secondary and tertiary system.

 

 

We deprecated the multi speeds of training. At some point it just blows up into a huge management nightmare on the player's part. We were planning on using it as a cushion to train multiple characters faster in the old system. Since we no longer need to try and speed players through the same training for the 15th version of their Knight, we got rid of it.

 

There is 1 general skill slot + 1 Archetype skill slot both training at 100% speed for Standard accounts and 1 general skill slot + 1 Archetype skill slot both training at 100% speed for VIPs.


Thomas Blair
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Okay, we are immortal champions of the gods, but how do we choose a god? It sounds like we might be choosing a god at the account level. If that's true, is there any mechanism for changing it later?

 

Maybe your god doesn't really matter. If it is a permanent choice, I'd assume account level. There'll likely be a system to convert.

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there also needs to be a big difference between crafted vessels and graveyard vessels...

 

power curve wont be as shallow as most of you think...

we wont see WoW levels , but I'm sure we'll see vessels being 3x as good as others

Rather than a "big" difference, I'd assume it'd be the lowest tier vessel while crafted vessels will be customized with advantages and disadvantages and greater caps.

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So, concerning the skill system and "vessels". ACE has essentially copied EVE directly (instead of vessel = corpse, read it as vessel = Internet spaceship and crow = pod).

 

I have no new feedback to contribute since passive skills were announced. EVE failed to get it right and have spent years trying to hack together a new training / combat meta that relies on a lower Skill point threshold. To try to retain new players.

 

This choice of skill system is not without benefits, but I hope (as in have little faith in game devs generally [sorry, JTodd], but remain eternally optimistic) that ACE manages to square the circle that has bedeviled CCP.

 

Also,that line about being so many skills that everyone is unique and would take forever to train it all....is amusing and foreboding. CCP said the same thing about EVE.

Edited by angelmar

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Very interesting approach, I need to think more about it and watch the video.

I have one major concern though. Having a single crow kills roleplaying options unless you buy multiple accounts.

I wanted to have three distinct character personalities.

Please give us multiple crows!

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