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Fly on the Wall: Castle Building, Part 3 - Official discussion thread


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 For the first set of CWs at launch maybe if not to big of an expense or time consumer they could release and let us play with the tools to build castles and have those used in those first CW's. Kind of like some games release a character builder before the game launches, release a castle builder.

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It sounds like what JTodd is trying to do is use the same memory space for the new castle. So, when a player pushes this castle to the servers it scans it, makes a copy of it and then puts that copy on the place of the original castle template and trashes the original. This is similar to the way a dynamically typed language like Python can change a variable.

 

dynamic_variable = 1

changes = 2

dynamic_variable = dynamic_variable + changes

 

print dynamic_variable

 

3

 

Of course there's a server load involved and if you allow offline objects being pushed to the server, you open the door to hacking. Your computer is making requests to the database. Things like SQL injection or even item modification become a worry.

 

May I suggest something easier? What if, you had monthly contests for best built EK castles (limited to certain sizes and decorator counts). Then the winner gets a prize and they have their castle copied into the permanent database for future CWs.

 

That would allow some quality control, fix the issues with dynamic objects and give people name recognition for building it.

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If you've not solved the issue of being able to delete/hide whatever rocks/trees etc are already on a particular cell of a parcel when you're trying to put a wall there, how about instead of baking the trees etc specifically in buildable areas into the terrain data, place them there like you would any other prop? So though the player can't see a difference, trees outside the build area are static, however the ones inside can be deleted/moved/added at leisure.

Not trying to teach my grandmother to suck eggs or anything :D

Edited by DoYouHaveAWaffle
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As Todd mentioned, we did have real time city construction in Shadowbane which worked amazingly well. It was was so dynamic that cities could be rebuilt after a Banestone was planted to optimize city defense depending upon the point of attack (much to the siegers chagrin). I don't see any reason that castle/city building couldn't be done offline and then used to simply "plant" the construction on the parcel. In SB, we had three types of game terrane: adventure zones, land for planting and water. Planting a seed could only be done on the land outside a certain radius of adventure zones. It actually deformed the land (raising the land from water or flattening the land on a hill, etc). City planting became an art in and of itself. My fear is that Crowfall will use a "ruin replacement" model which would strictly limit the number and locations of cities/keeps/castles/etc. I would much prefer a much more wide open sand box...but also understand that problems such freedom creates. As I've mentioned elsewhere...this is more than just aesthetics. The ability to construct your city/keep with siege defense in mind is an incredibly important element. It was one of the major draws of Shadowbane and could be one of he major draws for Crowfall. Giving us the tools to create optimally defensible cities/keeps/castles is not just incredibly cool...but adds to the level of skill, strategy, replayability, excitement, etc. To that end...give us wall mounted ballista...guard towers...moats...spiked pits...choke points...multiple wall sets (with different heights and widths and hps)...and I'll be a happy camper!

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I have high hopes for this game, everything I keep hearing is awesome.  March can't come soon enough, I don't like wishing time away, but damnit, I want to drive my Terminator and play CF :).

 

Also Shadowbane city building was sweet, placement of building was instantly seen to every one.  Which was cool and like Gradi said, really helped with changing up the city layout for defense against seiges.  Either way this game is looking cool, can't wait to play.

Edited by amazingtacoburito

 

Formerly known as - AmazingTacoBurito

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Isn't all of this discussion of static terrain meshes at odds with the physics-based destruction/deformation promised in the Kickstarter pitch?

 

Maybe, but I'm too tech illiterate to know for sure.

 

Could it just mean something like that particular bit of the game isn't sending data to the server and/or players all the time? 

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Isn't all of this discussion of static terrain meshes at odds with the physics-based destruction/deformation promised in the Kickstarter pitch?

 

I don't believe so.  That video was basically just about castle building in the EKs, not in the CW.  Plus, I believe the destruction / deformation of terrain in the CWs is temporary and not permanent.

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In most of the voxel engine games I've played, there's often the problem of reusing templates and dropping them on top of generated terrain. Often times you would have houses that are floating with one corner at the slope of a hill. It's like there needs to be filler that gets put in if there is a gap or the base of the structure needs to have so much extra depth that those wouldn't exist.

I'm not sure if the same idea could be applied here and how/what gets generated with the EK terrain. If there will be a lot of rolling hills, that becomes really problematic with building even with modular pieces. I envisioned that overall, the terrain would exist in height-tiers or wouldn't have a huge ranges in elevation but that probably isn't the case.

 

Is it possible to put a layer of dynamic terrain over top of the static terrain so that it can be modified? Still couldn't have trees sticking through that though.  :)

Then with the middle layer it could be made flat and easy to base build on top of but some destruction could still be possible.

 

Would love to make some early prototype fortress or city. :D

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In before we start seeing castles and keeps in the shape of giant genitalia.

 

But seriously, this is pretty cool. Not sure how great of an idea it is to give players too much freedom with their keep layout, though. Gamers are going game the system, and trolls are going to troll it. Either of which can be detrimental to immersion.

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This is seriously cool.  The ability to design and build your own castle that can then be placed in CW.  Sweet! and here I was thinking that we would be choosing from a selection of premade castles.  Years of visiting and studying old castle layouts might actually come in handy. 

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Wrathmane - Remnant of Ascendance

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 For the first set of CWs at launch maybe if not to big of an expense or time consumer they could release and let us play with the tools to build castles and have those used in those first CW's. Kind of like some games release a character builder before the game launches, release a castle builder.

 

I second this proposal, ACE. This is how you get free development help for the first several campaigns :)

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         http://crowfall.shivtr.com/  The Lantern Watch - A Crowfall-first guild. Welcome Home.

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  • 4 weeks later...

...this is more than just aesthetics. The ability to construct your city/keep with siege defense in mind is an incredibly important element. It was one of the major draws of Shadowbane and could be one of he major draws for Crowfall. Giving us the tools to create optimally defensible cities/keeps/castles is not just incredibly cool...but adds to the level of skill, strategy, replayability, excitement, etc. To that end...give us wall mounted ballista...guard towers...moats...spiked pits...choke points...multiple wall sets (with different heights and widths and hps)...and I'll be a happy camper!

 

Completely agree with you. And aside from what you've mentioned here (and something I heard mentioned in one of the videos), was flattening the area where the wall sections will go. I hope they don't forget about this, because uneven terrain in Shadowbane sometimes led to 'gaps' between wall sections, which allowed opposing forces the ability to breach city defenses without actually having to knock down walls.

~ A man shows who he is... by what he does... with what he has ~

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