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Nakawe

Targeting Mode Differences and Aiming Style Breakdown

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For GTA? For Crowfall? On PC? On Console?

Hmm, is that all you got out of the video?  It defines the different types of aiming styles.  last I checked we were discussing Crowfall on the pc in this forum...

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It's a lot harder to aim accurately with console thumbsticks than with a mouse, so I understand the need for assisted aiming in some games. On PC however, the mouse helps a lot to aim exactly where we want so there's no need for any aiming assistance imo.

 

If anything, I think that we could possibly need some kind of homing system for slower projectiles (if they make some spells slower than current confessor ones), but not something that guarantees a hit.

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This shows a very limited variety of targeting functions. Yet I don't support manual aim simply because it doesn't operate well with slower projectiles over large distances, or arced fire for tactical shots.

 

In a game where melee attackers simply mash out combos in the general direction of opponents, manual aiming a broad variety of tactical projectiles isn't fair.

 

It works well for games like Warframe with futuristic weapons that generate mostly bullet speed projectiles, but even on its best day, manual aim excludes a lot of interesting fire patterns.

Edited by bahamutkaiser

a52d4a0d-044f-44ff-8a10-ccc31bfa2d87.jpg          Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes... Than if they're upset, they'll be a mile away, and barefoot :P

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In a game where melee attackers simply mash out combos in the general direction of opponents, manual aiming a broad variety of tactical projectiles isn't fair.

 

Maybe I'm misunderstanding you, so if so, please correct me.

 

While a single Confessor (or any ranged character really) might have a slight disadvantage, a whole lot of them feels like a real threat to me. Crowfall will be a team based game after all. Imagine multiple Confessors or Rangers firing at a group of players at the same time. It will be very hard to avoid getting hit.


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Imagine a group of rangers and confessors sitting around doing nothing because their projectiles are intercepted by allied melee fighters crowding into melee range to participate, either blocking the projectiles with Crowfall physics, or killing their own teammates with friendly fire.

 

All of these manual aim assumptions made about gameplay overlook the scale and obstacles of combat, eliminating vast amounts of gameplay options with methods that don't work with a variety of features.

 

These methods totally fail in a medieval battlefield environment.


a52d4a0d-044f-44ff-8a10-ccc31bfa2d87.jpg          Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes... Than if they're upset, they'll be a mile away, and barefoot :P

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Imagine a group of rangers and confessors sitting around doing nothing because their projectiles are intercepted by allied melee fighters crowding into melee range to participate, either blocking the projectiles with Crowfall physics, or killing their own teammates with friendly fire.

 

All of these manual aim assumptions made about gameplay overlook the scale and obstacles of combat, eliminating vast amounts of gameplay options with methods that don't work with a variety of features.

 

These methods totally fail in a medieval battlefield environment.

 

Matter of learning how to position your forces on the battlefield I guess. I agree with you on the friendly fire thing though, this issue has been raised many times. I personally don't see it work in Crowfall with the current state of skills and spells.

 

If your projectiles get blocked by enemies, they are just playing well imo.

 

Currently ranged projectiles won't get blocked by allies or team members, so this isn't an issue (right now).


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Currently? They made it pretty clear that they intend for projectile to use physics, and even intend to implement friendly fire as long as a year ago. Building observations around work in progress and assumptions leads to bad conclusions.

 

The issue isn't, how do players operate in a system that isn't arranged to enable certain behaviors, it's whether it's fun to have allies running around and dashing on the battlefield, or large clusters of physically obstructing allies preventing you from attacking or accidentally moving into your firing path.

 

ACE made claims about projectile physics and friendly fire that they are expected to achieve, the targeting method should fit the kind of gameplay they advertised.


a52d4a0d-044f-44ff-8a10-ccc31bfa2d87.jpg          Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes... Than if they're upset, they'll be a mile away, and barefoot :P

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Currently? They made it pretty clear that they intend for projectile to use physics, and even intend to implement friendly fire as long as a year ago. Building observations around work in progress and assumptions leads to bad conclusions.

 

I'm not concluding anything, I was just telling you how it currently works. With friendly fire enabled this would obviously change.

 

The issue isn't, how do players operate in a system that isn't arranged to enable certain behaviors, it's whether it's fun to have allies running around and dashing on the battlefield, or large clusters of physically obstructing allies preventing you from attacking or accidentally moving into your firing path.

 
Executing proper positioning on the battlefield (with a large force) and winning battles because of that will separate the bad from the good. Do I think this is fun? Yes I do.

 

ACE made claims about projectile physics and friendly fire that they are expected to achieve, the targeting method should fit the kind of gameplay they advertised.

 

True. ACE already stated that friendly fire wouldn't work with the current state of combat and/or skills. They will adapt it/them where necessary.


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Proper positioning will be relative to the way the gameplay is implemented, the fact is, you'll be forced into different behaviors based on what is applied, and a game with a deeper projectile interaction will have more strategic applications than manual aiming bullet projections, resulting in opportunities to act more during battles.

 

The strategy of whatever you have to do because of a systems limitations is not a benefit that competes with a system with superior gameplay. Fact is, arcing projectiles will allow players more opportunities to attack in a friendly fire and projectile obstruction scenario, and slower moving projectiles allows for defensive reaction and ability throttling.

 

Just because some players are fine playing tetris doesn't mean it is a satisfactory game for others, especially when they've been advertised a different game. And make no mistake, Crowfall was advertised with physics applied to projectile obstruction, friendly fire, and large scale warfare like siege combat.

 

I suggest a method that delivers on those expectations.


a52d4a0d-044f-44ff-8a10-ccc31bfa2d87.jpg          Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes... Than if they're upset, they'll be a mile away, and barefoot :P

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Not even sure why this would be up for debate. First "GTA style" is hard lock ie can't miss, so no just nope. Next, Aim assist is well just a step below but still pretty much lock on targeting. So yeah free Aim is the only choice really with the type of game ACE is building here.

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Currently? They made it pretty clear that they intend for projectile to use physics, and even intend to implement friendly fire as long as a year ago. Building observations around work in progress and assumptions leads to bad conclusions.

The issue isn't, how do players operate in a system that isn't arranged to enable certain behaviors, it's whether it's fun to have allies running around and dashing on the battlefield, or large clusters of physically obstructing allies preventing you from attacking or accidentally moving into your firing path.

ACE made claims about projectile physics and friendly fire that they are expected to achieve, the targeting method should fit the kind of gameplay they advertised.

That was a year ago, have they said anything about it recently? If I see FF and projectile physics and all that working properly with the current combat system I'll be very impressed.

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