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xcomvic

Class or Classless System?

Class System or no?  

466 members have voted

  1. 1. What would you prefer to see, a class or classless(skill point based) system?

    • Class (Traditional Holy Trinity)
    • Class (Non HolyTrinity)
    • Classless (Skill point based)
    • Something totally different (please post what that would be below!)


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Classless, but with the option to go single target healer, group healer, tank, "crowd controller", buffer, single target dps, aoe dps, dot dps, summoner, ranged, melee, magic-based, or whatever combination you want.

 

My point is: roles must be there, but not just 3. That's why the game should create situations for everything, not just meta builds.

 

If I want to create some kind of Paladin, with sword/shield, some magic and heavy armor, I should be able to do it.

Or some kind of bard, just to improve my party performance and go here and there casting charms I should be able to do it too.


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I'd love to see a skill/class hybrid system. Nox Mage anyone? Seriously, as certain skills go up (1h blunt for instance) along with say "Hardiness" or "Heavy Shield" you would get certain bonuses and perhaps a class title to work towards more interesting skills for that particular combination of skills, thus - leveling up a particular class of skillsets.

 

I have a rather long design document laying about here somewhere... Seems I can't upload it here in any format...

 

Here is the link on my drive:

 

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6VsVZ2gdMY8Um1KdTk2Unl4Sms/view?usp=sharing

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True Classless, like they do in Project; Gorgon, where the more you use a skill the better you get at it and the only requirement being to find someone to teach you the basics and having the equipment necessary to practice. 

 

"Levelling" could be simulated through aggregate skill points, ie certain thresholds of skill points advancing you to a new tier of hit points, only if equipping items is gated by level dependency.

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Your starting 'class' would probably be your starting situation - the difference between starting out with a space fighter and starting out with a space truck.  Starting out as a warrior would not prevent you from switching to 100% wizardry later on...

 

I would let the player derp around and make mistakes early on without penalty - make the player realise that he should specialise if he wants to get anywhere while still give him a chance to try different things before settling on one.  Arrange the skill tree in such a way that if you want epic power, you will have to spend a lot of skill points in very specialised things.  Want to do epic damage with your melee attacks?  Pick a specific weapon to specialise in, and you lose your bonuses if you wield a different weapon type then the one you picked.  The really juicy perks lie near the top of that particular skill tree - don't spread it around!  (You sure you don't want to specialise in shields instead?)

 

I would also provide a way to make negative progress.  Nothing as extreme as Eve Online's escape pods, but even a modest 2% skill loss on death is enough to get your attention in a big way and provides people with a way of weakening otherwise-1337 players.  You'll only need to kill that 1337 player once to get that snowball rolling...no one is invincible...

 

And what with all the player interaction, charging into a certain-death situation might even be worth it if you think you can achieve something within that time...

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Your starting 'class' would probably be your starting situation - the difference between starting out with a space fighter and starting out with a space truck.  Starting out as a warrior would not prevent you from switching to 100% wizardry later on...

 

I would let the player derp around and make mistakes early on without penalty - make the player realise that he should specialise if he wants to get anywhere while still give him a chance to try different things before settling on one.  Arrange the skill tree in such a way that if you want epic power, you will have to spend a lot of skill points in very specialised things.  Want to do epic damage with your melee attacks?  Pick a specific weapon to specialise in, and you lose your bonuses if you wield a different weapon type then the one you picked.  The really juicy perks lie near the top of that particular skill tree - don't spread it around!  (You sure you don't want to specialise in shields instead?)

 

I would also provide a way to make negative progress.  Nothing as extreme as Eve Online's escape pods, but even a modest 2% skill loss on death is enough to get your attention in a big way and provides people with a way of weakening otherwise-1337 players.  You'll only need to kill that 1337 player once to get that snowball rolling...no one is invincible...

 

And what with all the player interaction, charging into a certain-death situation might even be worth it if you think you can achieve something within that time...

This. You can be whatever you want, but with specializations, it's logic that if you spent hours training or assigning points into a specific weapon you should be better at it!

For example if the skilltree has a node of "melee damage" should be a 10% one, and also has an "1handed sword damage" should be 20%, because it's specialized.


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Love Path of Exile, but then I also love Monster Hunter and Dark Souls.... sooooo yeah.

Exactly what I wanted to say : some kind of Monster Hunter mix where the weapon define your movement and skills but then I think of Guild wars and I didn't like it there  <_<

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This. You can be whatever you want, but with specializations, it's logic that if you spent hours training or assigning points into a specific weapon you should be better at it!

For example if the skilltree has a node of "melee damage" should be a 10% one, and also has an "1handed sword damage" should be 20%, because it's specialized.

Or have skill points themselves provide increases as you spend them in a tree, so not only do they unlock new abilities but each one provides a distinct bonus.

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Exactly what I wanted to say : some kind of Monster Hunter mix where the weapon define your movement and skills but then I think of Guild wars and I didn't like it there  <_<

Yeah, the problem I had with GW2 was it turned the idea of weapons have distinct move sets, into yet another button mashing, hotkey watching MMO.

It was bland and generic after a little while because everything was so casual and white washed you wonders what the point was.  There was really nothing to work towards to improve on in regards to it's skill system, it just gave the illusion that it did.

 

Path of Exile on the other hand is all about skill and how you use it.  Combining skills and support skills, unique equipment and passive keystones to create something unique an interesting, then testing to see if it actually holds up as the game grows progressively more challenging.  It's quite something.

Only problem is the incredible amount of time it takes to make a build, and if it doesn't pan out you essentially have to start over.  I realize this is essential so that players don't rapidly find the best build by testing every possible build, but still, not being able to back track and fix mistakes is frustrating.

 

But Monster Hunter and Dark Souls do show a side element that POE doesn't really have, which is timing and positioning.  Which you can only really do when you have a clearly fixed moveset.  It would be great if you could have the diversity of POE, with the clear move sets/timing and positional based play, but I'm just not sure how you would do that.

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