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fuggeroffuggington

City And World Building -- The Other Part Of The Pvp Scenario

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do you rub the ...horn...for luck?

 

you could...

 

and if it, Pleases, Blas..... he could see fit to dispense some lotion to anoint yourself with, and be Blessed...


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let the Code build the World and it's Laws....let the Players build the rest...

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Loved the OP's thread. Just thought I'd pop in to check it out.

 

I'm so looking forward to seeing more news! I can't begin to tell you how much it's dragging ... bit bored waiting in between.

 

It would be awesome to see the cities full of life. Monuments, hadn't even thought much about them. Sounds like SB was quite ahead of it's time.


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Great thoughts OP!

 

I think you could develop that a bit - besides player houses the mayor could also build NPC houses - which would influence the number of NPC guards for example, or having NPCs which move from the house to a central place (like the marketplace) - back and forth, to make the city more lifely.

 

Also i think it would be interesting to develop the idea of visiting traders - for example, starting on the concept of different realms, a city could develop a tiered "trading house" which would allow for trading with a town from another realm. If you have a player auction house in town, you could have "visiting trader" events, where, for a limited amount of time, you could buy from the visiting trader items which are listed in the auction house of the other town.


At least this way i learned that everyone in this game will kill you for an apple :)

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Allow people that log off to have their characters act as NPC for a chosen location and role based on the character. That alone would help keep the world looking populated and ensure it usually reflects to some degree how populated a region is...and by who.

 

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In Shadowbane cities we build to help defend the Tree of Life. Because losing the tree of life means u lost your city.

 

Will have to wait for them to reveal more information about Cities.

 

If they put in crafting stations, trading outposts into cities, I am sure more people will be staying in cities. The beauty if the cities are player made than this would be wonderful. What they can do is give the tools to the player to make the cities however they want to make them. 

 

Also there should be a technology tree to enhance the cities to make it better, similar to what they describe in make armor eg. different raw materials all alloy vs pure iron give different characteristics. Similarly, if the city is made of wood vs stone or granite the structures able to withstand hits from different types of siege weapons.

 

They should have different building structures, eg. cities, keeps, towers, forts, outpost etc.. all player made, than this game will truly be revolutionary.

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In Shadowbane cities we build to help defend the Tree of Life. Because losing the tree of life means u lost your city.

 

Will have to wait for them to reveal more information about Cities.

 

If they put in crafting stations, trading outposts into cities, I am sure more people will be staying in cities. The beauty if the cities are player made than this would be wonderful. What they can do is give the tools to the player to make the cities however they want to make them.

 

Also there should be a technology tree to enhance the cities to make it better, similar to what they describe in make armor eg. different raw materials all alloy vs pure iron give different characteristics. Similarly, if the city is made of wood vs stone or granite the structures able to withstand hits from different types of siege weapons.

 

They should have different building structures, eg. cities, keeps, towers, forts, outpost etc.. all player made, than this game will truly be revolutionary.

A perks tree for a city itself is an interesting concept. Perhaps having to choose between paths of trading and mercantile vs a more military route.


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Fugger of Fuggington - Shadowbane

SkippyBojangle - PS4

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There's been a lot of talk and speculation about PvP, but in a game of territorial conquest, I'd like to hear some details about world building. The devs have implied that players will change the landscape, but that's about all we've gotten.

 

Shadowbane's city building was impressive in 2003 --- it was a lot of fun to visit player cities. This didn't last because player's studied city building and came up with the most defensible templates within a fairly limited tool and asset set. Furthermore, I don't think the cities ever felt very alive.

 

I'd like to see:

1. Cities self-populate with NPCs and merchants based on size and region

2. Traveling merchants who visit cities with limited player influence on this. They could sell cosmetic changes.

3. A varied toolset to build assets with a regional art style.

4. Truly impressive monuments that can grow and change. I'm thinking the imperial tower in the capitol in Elder Scrolls Oblivion --- when you saw that thing in the horizon in Oblivion, that was impressive.

5. Far fetched --- but perhaps the ability of players to produce this content through a builder's app. This presents it's own host of issues, but it would be great. If it can't be, I'd like to at least hope for a vast set of monuments and styles ready for the players, and...

6. Certain monuments and buildings are limited in their use per world. As in only 1 city can have a certain monument --- once someone has built it, it's no longer in the toolset for other cities or players.

7. Outposts and sub-city groups that organically sprout around larger player cities. These can be player made, ie subguilds, or triggered NPC reactions once a city reaches a certain set of traits: like a parked caravan of gypsies, or a small fishing village.

 

Thoughts on world building?

 

Id like to see a MMO with no automatic NPC store vendors such as shadowbane . I'd much prefer things to be more player driven with player owned/rented stores like UO but  within guild city's . Have player owned towns be able to build/rent land inside and outside the imediate city grid and let open towns grow organically .

 

I can see Compact guild fortress's with rows of defence outside along side  sprawling open trade citys with rows of shanty player housing streching out from the inner walls .

Edited by maarvy

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Another point to make is that city building was an aspect of SB not experienced by most players.

 

You need away to have normal players participate in and have a stake in city building, be it giving them a slot of land or an asset to upgrade and modify, or allowed guilds to submanage sects/neighborhoods or outposts.

 

Larger cities can effectively sell/rent individual lots of land for anyone to buy.

Edited by fuggeroffuggington

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Fugger of Fuggington - Shadowbane

SkippyBojangle - PS4

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Personally I just really hope they can balance both the party attacking the city as well as defending during sieges. 

It would be pretty easy for the side that is protecting the city to come out with the upper hand simply because of the defenders advantage; walls, archer towers etc. This is fairly easy to fix though by giving the attackers some nice toys to play with.  ;)

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Defenders are supposed to have the advantage. It's a freaking stronghold.

 

True, but let's hope building impenetrable fortresses is a no-go. I mean, advancing the city must have its limits somewhere both in inhabitants and defenses.


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MA topics for recruitment.

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I'd like to see monuments and such awarded based on hitting certain milestones.  For example, successfully defend from an attack and the option to install a monument is unlocked.  City survives for 6 months straight, unlocks another grand structure.  So the best cities would become more grand over time as the guilds inhabiting hit certain milestones.

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Pretty sure this weeks updates are going to be huge on this part of the game ... few more days we should know more!

 

And I agree on the part cities felt dead and barren for the most part in SB. It never really felt a live and active.

It's hard to feel alive and functional when the doors work some of the times and every wall is an illusion that scrubs can still walk through.

Edited by mandalore

40 minutes ago, Andius said:

W/HoA were held up as like these mystical forces of highly skilled players with legendary theorycrafters chained to a desk in some deep dungeon holding all the arcane secrets we could use to win if only we knew them.

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It's hard to feel alive and functional when the doors work some of the times and every wall is an illusion that scrubs can still walk through.

My favorite is being able to jump 3 stories into the air from the ground onto a disconnected wall segment.

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Defenders should always get the advantage.  It should take more effort to destroy and sack a city than to defend it.  Makes actually taking a city that much more rewarding too.


"Darken the moon and conceal the stars; our Light will never be extinguished." - The Tome of the First Flame

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The Lantern Watch - A Crowfall-first guild. Welcome Home. Join us @ http://crowfall.shivtr.com

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Defenders should always get the advantage.  It should take more effort to destroy and sack a city than to defend it.  Makes actually taking a city that much more rewarding too.

Defenders did, it was a pain in the ass to take a city from a half way competent guild.  Defender's should have it in their favor.


40 minutes ago, Andius said:

W/HoA were held up as like these mystical forces of highly skilled players with legendary theorycrafters chained to a desk in some deep dungeon holding all the arcane secrets we could use to win if only we knew them.

wiDfyPp.png

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I hope that the relationship between crafting and conquest is that instead of SB's contract-based system, the actual materials to build walls, buildings, and cities in general, have to be carried.  I think the strength statistics on the ores and bars is evident that this might be the case.  The strongest evidence in favor of this method of building cities is in the concept art with the cart.

 

I think that this method of implementing crafted conquest is still better suited for defense, since instead of being able to summon in siege equipment contracts, people will have to carry the siege equipment - and risk dying.  This is realistic in terms of needing redundancies of material, so if only supply line gets run over, you aren't stuck with a bunch of 1/2 trebuchets.


Mic MWH, Member of Mithril Warhammers since 2003,


Hammers High! http://www.mithrilwarhammers.com

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Monuments are fine if they don't have inexplicable buffs attached, like in Civilization.

Even that's fine so long as the building in question took so many materials, it would take years to build. Such as in Darkfall.

 

Nothing better than sieging a city and destroying a wonder that took the enemy clan 4 years to get to.

Edited by cannibal man

Cannibal Man - Future serial killer

I can't even.  You win, I am done with this part of the discussion.

 

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