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Kith

Campaign Worlds with clear borders and safe zones

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I would love to see a CW that had safe zones established by PvP combat.  Those who controlled the safe zone wouldn't be targetable by hostiles unless they engaged first, bordering zones would be contested (everyone is flagged for PvP) with objectives that would shift control, making the neighboring zones contested.

 

It would allow those who want to get heavy into gathering/crafting worry less about getting ganked, while still maintaining a huge PvP focus.

 

Just think of the gatherers/crafters running for safety when a zone flips, or having advance scouts (ie assassins) already out there ready for the contested flag to drop!

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That's not something that I would want. Zones should not have clear boundaries. There should be a risk in solo gathering and venturing outside of your allied side's territory, whether accidental or intentional


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I can imagine that there might be faction safeholds in some of the RvR campaign bands, but I'd expect not such hubs in the Shadows or Dregs. If there were to be a sort of "safe harbor", I'd expect it to be a small town where the anyone can go to make trades safely.


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Yeah as above but also PvP flagging and zone flipping style PvP is just a small step away from boring grindy pointless PvP we've seen in other games. It doesn't actually create as much conflict as it does avoidance of conflict or avoidance of areas. Not fun IMO.

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Is it okay to laugh? Or would that be inappropriate?

 

The only "safe zones" we should see are EKs and strongholds when they are not in a siege window (PvB is the worst).

 

EDIT: if someone can get inside an enemy keep outside of the seige window they should be able to gank away!

Edited by destrin

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No. Just no. I prefer gathering and crafting and I want nothing to do with that. If I wanted to be nice and safe while I ran around gathering flowers, I'd play (insert name of run-of-the-mill MMO here). I want a different playing experience. That's what I want from Crowfall.

Edited by ZaphodBeeblebrox

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This is one of those dangerous topics that could very easily become a rage fest. 

Here are my thoughts:

  • Crowfall is a Throne War simulator. When you break that phrase down into its components it is for two things, the siege of Royalty (i.e Kingdoms battling each other, and battling from Within in the form of political intrigue and politics) And the core 'War' component. It is a game about waging war on each other.
  • Crafters have it notoriously hard. If Eve online taught us anything, it's that a game wherein you can be utterly destroyed, have all of your belongings taken, and be left to start over again is not only heart breaking - it's grotesque.
  • The Developers have taken great care to say that 'Corpse Looting' will only be possible in the Dregs or certain Rulesets.

I personally feel that the consequence of getting 'ganked' and having to walk back to a new harvest node is not the end of the world. If anything, it makes the concept of crafting parties, or mercenaries for hire a very cool thing. Knowing that you will have to improve in skill in order to be able to reach the Dregs, and properly farm high tier items is incentive to advance your soul, or become financially powerful enough that you can pay others. 

It gives depth to a system that, in games like FFXIV, wherein the crafters have impunity in most situations and can just farm like mad, can be monotonous and mundane. Because you're able to leave campaigns and join new ones, combined with the Embargo system, I believe you're going to see players have a lot more freedom to hunt in the season they prefer, around the people they prefer. I believe that talented crafters will fall into a category like information brokers. You'll see good ones rise to the surface based on their ability to competently navigate the system.

 

A reminder also, that the materials in the game are 'Generic'. As such, you'll see tiers of items, not 'Spiderweve' or 'Soulsilk'. I expect that gathering core items won't be as challenging as mastering the creativity of the crafting system itself. 

--

That said, I am sure that, should the Development team find that they've created a game in which the crafting players can't constructively gather materials, solo, without getting killed repeatedly, that some sort of skill line, impunity system, or negative penalty will be imposed. We've seen talk, and quick dismissal of the system which would brand a player as a vigilante, or PKer. So it's likely that some sort of cloaking ability would be employed.

 

Which brings us to another point. A reminder that your Avatar is NOT your character. All skills roll up to your Crow. If you decide that gathering is too hard as your primary Avatar, you can simply Buy, Craft, or Roll a new Vessel with the traits and skills you feel would better suit your playstyle when farming. If you simply need the ability to outmatch, roll a tank. If you're more concerned with not being seen, then roll a stealth character.

Crowfall is a game in which every player SHOULD get very good at something. That thing may not be what you expect. Nor may it be what you thought it would be. But the concept of every player being able to log in, roll a crafter, and get that crafter to 'Max' does not belong in a game like Crowfall. Becoming a prominent crafter should require a Solid Eternal Kingdom, Good Connections, Hard Work, Cleverness, and Diligence. 

 

From God's Reach on down to the Dregs, the Arch of the Five Heavens is an escelatingly dangerous place. You will have to be the best of the best to brave its depths.

 

--

 

Again, I appreciate all of the opinions. And I can understand frustration at this suggestion from several players. Let's try not to flame each other. The fact is, all suggestions get us talking, exploring, connecting concepts, and one never knows from whence an amazing suggestion might come. Nuff said. Good Question Kith. I hope that gave you a bit more perspective.

If this dissuaded you from the crafting potentials in the game, I recommend that you take a look at Everquest Landmark. It's live now, and was 10$. It takes the Voxel Crafting in more of the direction you have suggested. And has the Minecraft building system (though admittedly much more beautiful). It will also give a sharp contrast to how Crowfall (And Camelot Unchained) are handling their crafting systems.

I expect that, the closer we get to the Throne War (World, Campaign, and Embargo) content launch that you will get a clearer, and more positive view of the crafting system. If not, and you're still ready and raring to play, you're welcome to join my EK. ALBION will have a warm place for folks just looking to craft.


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The joy of CWs; if it's a flop and everyone hates it, it won't happen again.  I still would like to see it happen at some point.

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The EK is the safe zone, you can get meager materials there already, the whole point of a campaign world is threat, and an immersion of exploration, resourcing and challenge.


a52d4a0d-044f-44ff-8a10-ccc31bfa2d87.jpg          Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes... Than if they're upset, they'll be a mile away, and barefoot :P

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here is the thing with safe zones, i used to run with one of the top gvg guild in BDO everytime we fought a enemy guild all they did was shoot at us from their spots within the safe zones. Which i was never a big fan of.

I can realate to that. Same thing happend to my guild in BDO every time again and again.

 

Both guilds fights -> loosing guild runs to safe zone to not die. Range chars stay in safe zone while tanky once act as bait.

 

A safe zone in Crowfall should only be the fortress of an ally and said safezone is only safe as long as its defendet. Not some kind of sever magic saing "um you can not attack here cuz i dont want that"

 

It shouldnt be to hard to ask some random PVPers to Protekt you while gathering for a share of the profit. Make a network of people who you can trust for the job. Even other gatherers are fine. fighting a group of 5 bandit players alone is impossible but fighting a group of 5 bandit players with 10 gatherers might secure you a good victory.


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here is the thing with safe zones, i used to run with one of the top gvg guild in BDO everytime we fought a enemy guild all they did was shoot at us from their spots within the safe zones. Which i was never a big fan of.

 

To talk about this a little bit more, I think that no safe zones is also better because it makes the game (And to a certain extent) the throne wars a lot more interesting, politically. The developers have said that guilds will play a major role in Crowfall, this means that there will be certain guilds running around in other peoples territory. Since political intrigue is also important, it will be interesting to see what kind of repercussions this could have diplomatically.

 

If one guild declares a certain area as theirs and only allows ''allies'' and traders into their territory, what would it mean to have a non-recognized guild running around claimed territory? The prospect of this makes me very excited and I think that safe zones would take away from that. 

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I agree with most of the posters here that Crowfall shouldn't have safe zones, but only in a narrow sense that the game system shouldn't create artificial, absolute safe zones.  If safety is enforced by NPCs or targeting rules, that's what I call artificial.  Another form of safety is a region where potential attackers are at a severe disadvantage, such as if they have no source of food within a long distance or combat penalties due to their enemies controlling nearby magic nodes, etc.  A crafter or trader operating in such an area can still be attacked in theory, but has better odds at defending themselves even if they aren't the game's most powerful character.

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