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GeistBaoh

CrowFall player Population...1million, 5million, 10 milllion or under 750k?

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Just to clarify... I think last we heard league had 27million unique players a month or so?  Like 10million a day or maybe even concurrent?

 

Star Citizen isn't going to come anywhere near that.

 

People that don't understand that crowfall could have broken a million easily or had millions of players easily just don't understand the current gaming climate... Gaming is so big now... even h1z1 broke a million, dayz sold what 3million?  And those were super crude versions of games.  Archeage had like 2million in NA at launch, so much that they had to turn most of them away with crappy server options and long queues.

 

I read that Overatch has taken number one spot from LoL in Korea, first time LoL isnt number one in 4 years.

And Overwatch is buy to play and costs much money for an arena shooter.

Star Citizen is almost everything. Star Citizen is also a full blown shooter game. But its soo soo incredible much more at the same time, offering almost endless possibilities to gamers/customers.

It may be not a Blizzard hype game or a big F2P Korean E-sports title, thats what really made Overwatch and LoL successful. But its offering just so incredible much more than these games, that its ridiculous. If they can deliver.

Edited by Urahara

After EverQuest Next is gone, its Star Citizen for me.

 

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I read that Overatch has taken number one spot from LoL in Korea, first time LoL isnt number one in 4 years.

And Overwatch is buy to play and costs much money for an arena shooter.

Star Citizen is almost everything. Star Citizen is also a full blown shooter game. But its soo soo incredible much more at the same time, offering almost endless possibilities to gamers/customers.

It may be not a Blizzard hype game or a big F2P Korean E-sports title, thats what really made Overwatch and LoL successful. But its offering just so incredible much more than these games, that its ridiculous. If they can deliver.

Well overwatch took the #1 spot in korea at pc baangs, those kinda work different with their payment models.

 

There are all sorts of reasons star citizen wouldn't take off like those games did in regions like china and korea... because for example pc baangs don't always have the hardware to run the latest and greatest games. 

 

Blizzard games are generally pretty polished performance wise, Lol is easy to run too...


Skeggold, Skalmold, Skildir ro Klofnir

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Just to clarify... I think last we heard league had 27million unique players a month or so?  Like 10million a day or maybe even concurrent?

 

Star Citizen isn't going to come anywhere near that.

 

People that don't understand that crowfall could have broken a million easily or had millions of players easily just don't understand the current gaming climate... Gaming is so big now... even h1z1 broke a million, dayz sold what 3million?  And those were super crude versions of games.  Archeage had like 2million in NA at launch, so much that they had to turn most of them away with crappy server options and long queues.

 

Ironically I think CF could reach the million by marketing the game as if it was a multiplayer survival.

I really think people nowadays look at the "MMORPG" definition and skip the game entirely no matter what it is.


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Ironically I think CF could reach the million by marketing the game as if it was a multiplayer survival.

I really think people nowadays look at the "MMORPG" definition and skip the game entirely no matter what it is.

 

So true.

Survival took over the MMO genre, because it was promising what people expected and wanted from an MMO, but wasnt delivered from the MMO genre, but neither from the Survival genre yet.

A free open explorable world, where you have an impact and can change things and the world is reacting to what you are doing, and all of this.

Edited by Urahara

After EverQuest Next is gone, its Star Citizen for me.

 

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I would be happy with a player population that works like the secret world did.  it was a slow burn, a few at the start and then as more folks heard about it and gave it a go the population grew.  I would actually prefer a smaller player base where the devs can continue to be active and known, just so long as all the bills are being paid and talent isn't wandering off for greener pastures. 

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I read that Overatch has taken number one spot from LoL in Korea, first time LoL isnt number one in 4 years.

And Overwatch is buy to play and costs much money for an arena shooter.

Star Citizen is almost everything. Star Citizen is also a full blown shooter game. But its soo soo incredible much more at the same time, offering almost endless possibilities to gamers/customers.

It may be not a Blizzard hype game or a big F2P Korean E-sports title, thats what really made Overwatch and LoL successful. But its offering just so incredible much more than these games, that its ridiculous. If they can deliver.

Overwatch has had the largest hype built up around it and as a result they've got the massive player base that they have today. Not only that but the way they developed the game draws in players from other games such as Counter-Strike due to its shooter elements and team based gameplay, TF2 (been dying for a few years now and many people have been waiting for its replacement) many Blizzard fanboys play it as well due to it being a Blizzard product. Hell, a huge portion of the League community plays Overwatch, with many of the big time gamers playing it as well which causes their stream viewers to gain interest in it as well because of its MOBA elements. 

 

Also, the success of League wasn't due to E-sports, though today that's a lucrative location of popularity and money for them. It was simply them taking what was done in DOTA: Allstars and refining it into something more modern and new. They were the first to create a MOBA that had wide-spread appeal and didn't have a ridiculously high learning curve that pushed away casuals just wanting to enjoy the game.

 

Can't compare Overwatch and League to Star-Citizen because they're completely different gaming markets. These two are specific types of games that are easily accessible to the general population, whilst Star-Citizen is very broad and not as accessible to most people because of things like hardware constraints and money. (which isn't necessarily bad because you'd have a larger population that would be more capable of taking in even more heavy tech. Would also be more willing to throw dough at the game as well)

Edited by EagleArcherz

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Ironically I think CF could reach the million by marketing the game as if it was a multiplayer survival.

I really think people nowadays look at the "MMORPG" definition and skip the game entirely no matter what it is.

 

I knew survival games were popular, but after checking Steam stats I realized how popular they were.  :huh:

 

Unturned: 23,000,000 owners - Left 4 Dead 2: 14,000,000 - RUST: 3,800,000

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Ironically I think CF could reach the million by marketing the game as if it was a multiplayer survival.

I really think people nowadays look at the "MMORPG" definition and skip the game entirely no matter what it is.

 

But, isn't CF an MMORPG with survival elements?

 

If they market CF as a Survival MMORPG instead of an MMORPG with Survival elements, I could see a lot of people dissenting that they were tricked into buying CF


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You Can't Be A Genius, If You Aren't The Slightest Bit Insane.

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Ironically I think CF could reach the million by marketing the game as if it was a multiplayer survival.

I really think people nowadays look at the "MMORPG" definition and skip the game entirely no matter what it is.

Well i don't think ACE will do much of their own marketing. I think word of mouth will be the best method for a game like this. When recommending to others I think players will describe the best parts they like and why they play it. It will also vary from player to player what they like most about it so i don't think the game will really be marketed as one type of game and won't get the stigma a lot of new MMOs get as well.

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But, isn't CF an MMORPG with survival elements?

 

If they market CF as a Survival MMORPG instead of an MMORPG with Survival elements, I could see a lot of people dissenting that they were tricked into buying CF

 

Any player that enjoys multiplayer survivals like H1Z1, DayZ, Rust, 7dtd (etc) will enjoy a similar game that has much bigger servers. Infact that's all they usually ask: "What's the player limit per server?". I don't think any of those players will be disappointed by Crowfall even if they think it's a simple multiplayer survival at first.

 

That will only happen if the skill system will allow new players to come in months after the release and still catch up with veterans at some point.

Edited by Fenris DDevil

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Not sure why you need millions to be successful. The devs cited 50,000 as a reasonable objective to keep the game up and running.

 

That's exactly it, you're don't. People look at League of Legends and WoW and think that's what success looks like. It's always been tilted like this. That's what mega-lottery-win-level success looks like and there's a very specific reason why they could dip deep enough to even get those numbers.

 

I think you were interpeting "Casual" for "Niche". But what is "Casual" and what is not, and what is "Niche" and what is not? I am Casual too I guess, but just not only Casual. Sometimes I play a certain game more casual and another game not. The world is always different from any moment to the other and from every point of view in the very exact same moment. Thats what is making life so interesting.

Only thing thats not interesting are 99,9% of the games and game developers nowadays. That was all totally different 20 years ago.

 

The gaming industry is a bad joke today and has really become the worst nowadays. No ambition, magnificence, artistic effort, striving for something great, something that isnt generic garbage from yesterday. Damn the games today are from a gameplay standpoint even much worse than the games from 20 years ago, only the graphics have improved, its a joke, this gaming industry today. Its all just about money... . Like the whole rest of the world has become.

No, casuals and niche are literally the opposites of each other. Crowfall is catering to PvP players, it's niche because PvP players only make up one slice of the pie and usually a small one at that. 

 

Casuals are players with no specific tilt who are usually experiencing something for the first time. For a ton of people WoW was not only their first MMORPG but their only. Why? Because it had a huge kiddie pool. That wasn't meant as an insult or an offense, I'm simply pointing out smart business. It made the game safer and easier to waddle into and actually do stuff even if you played it in bite sized portions.

 

Catering to casuals is smart because by casting your net wide instead of deep you get a far larger variety of fish rather than a smaller amount of one kind of fish. When all the fishes are worth the same at the market, then only one choice becomes logically viable... and it works.

 

Overwatch is the perfect example. The game is built from the ground up to make people feel good and nothing more. Hitboxes are huge, snipers don't actually have to pinpoint aim, ults are easy to use and hilariously destructive, and you can't see anyone's KDA. In fact, you're only rated on how well you did and that's all that matters. Winning only adds a small xp boost...

 

But this makes it easy for someone who would never survive in the brutal world of Battlefield or Call of Duty to hop in and have fun... so the result is that Blizzard ends up with a huge amount of players, players who would never have played a shooter otherwise.

 

Star Citizen is doing none of that thus far, so it'll probably never hit those numbers. I'm sure after the initial glow wears off it'll be populated by a small but dedicated community and that's perfectly fine.


Wearily do I sleep eternity away.

Without fear or haste, on bedding made of solitude and silence.

 

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Bigger numbers are much better. Even if there will be dying unpopulated servers its easy to merge them in this game bec you got 1 Crow and 1 EK which has to transfer. So there is more than expected numbers according to ACE they can easily open new servers for the sake of the game future and they can reduce the number of servers when numbers drop. 

 

Since we got 123k backers atm, I am supposing this number will increase to 180k-200k before openbeta, Probably we will get 400k ppl at release. I expecting most of the ppl will start to buy game during OBT. (Almost same content as release, B2P model.)

 

But the subscription model can be dangerous as we saw previous game. PPl can quit because of long queues. If its B2P game, at least ppl can enter the server without waiting 1000 ppl. ( I saw 6900ppl queue in one game release most of the ppl left game because they refused to be sub and its end with decreasing enourmous number of ppl). 

 

CF is consist player driven economy, which needs large numbers. Furthermore, its based on PVP so if there is not enough ppl, same ppl kills same pp(after a while it wont be fun) which will end tears and quits.

 

Even 400k ppl can not be enough, when we consider regions+campaigns. I wish we get 1 milion player at start.

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I think lower hundreds of thousands will be a reasonable assumption. CF is competing with CU and while players here may lean towards CF over CU, you can be sure that they have numbers leaning towards CU over CF. If either one of them drops the ball the other will profit.

 

As for blizzard and Overwatch, that is what happens when your pockets are deep enough to splatter commercials all over TV and everywhere you look. Good advertising can work wonders, not to mention someone at blizzard sold their soul to the devil a long time ago so someone will eventually burn in hell for their success.

 

I'm guessing 200-300k, levleing out closer to 200k after the inevitable exodus that all games face at release.

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Today there are 63 million people with unique profiles for LOL. We live in  a world where people have the hobby of JUST watching Twitch streamers who don't even play the game they watch.

 

People are hungry for PVP games. The market exists. Esports DWARFS sports in terms of viewers. In Korea LOL teams give their football teams pep talks.

 

The reason that Overwatch is even holding a torch to LOL is because it's the first thing that has come out that is more or less doing enough of it's own thing with quality that feels different enough to be worth really investing in.

 

The tripple A game machine has learned that if they have slick animations and art assets that are quality all they have to do is build enough hype around an IP and they will sell enough copies that it will make a project a financial success.

 

This isn't the triple A game machine. This is a crowdfunded game that IS the main enchilada. This isn't a game that will fund future projects.

 

The only reason MOBAs took off was because the map makers who refined Dota into what Mobas have become had enough nuts and devotion to refine the genre into a literal sport. For those of you who were around for DOTA on the WC3 Map it went through an incredible amount of revisions and it was on the WC3 custom map maker.

 

These developers have enough sense and experience to realize that shiny and polish aren't the core ingredients that will make this game a success.. It will be getting the building blocks right. It's no easy talk to objectively look at a project like this in their circumstances (How can you not feel biased on a project you love and have put your own money into how they have) and be able to say you know what? The fundamentals need to be even better.

 

We are in good hands.

 

When people have enough passion to develop something out of pure love they will get it right. They will dive as deep into the rabbit hole as it goes. Thank God we have people courageous enough to pioneer new genres and not have to wade through to drole of WOW clones and shiny new industry clones.

 

Shadowbane was far ahead of it's time and it didn't get a fraction of the recognition it deserved. It never got a true spiritual successor and it was way ahead of it's time as a concept and sadly (even though the game was fundamentally flawed due to no restart mechanic and lack of further developed systems ie crafting and a real player economy vs merchants) didn't have the market to support it's refinement.

 

In reality initial investment is the catalyst but it's time and experience with refining a genre that is what's the true element that makes the game quality. For that you have to have people who are a trifecta of perspective.. Experience, the ability to be objective and execute your perspective in such a way that you can produce results as far as tweaking things with the resources you have available.

 

There aren't that many people who have the kind of experience that Koster, Gordon and Todd have. That's not me fanboying.. it's the truth.

 

I remember growing up in the late 90s and early 2000s and having very limited choices as to what we could play as far as MMOs.. Anything of quality was Age of Camelot  and EQ.. And eventually SWG before it got bastardized. Before that Asheron's call and Meridian 59.(MAYBEE The Realm) There may be more options these days but that's a good thing. It means the market is big enough to entice people to continue making games.. In 15 years the potential customer base has grown 100 fold or more. Just think about that.

 

There are certain ingredients involved when a new genre defining game is produced and released. As far as one could surmise it's looking like Ace has a winner on their hands.. It looks also like they are being very careful with their money and have enough to be developing for a good while.

 

I have been a fan of this genre since before it got big back when Meridian 59 was the first of it's kind.. I have seen many games come and go and I believe this game is going to hit it big.


“There is a savage beast in every man, and when you hand that man a sword or spear and send him forth to war, the beast stirs.” -Jorah Mormont of Bear Island

George R.R. Martin

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Shadowbane's biggest flaws were how buggy the game was and how low the skill-ceiling was. 

 

If you look at all the most popular competitive games, what can we notice?  Easy to learn, hard to master... and they all give players room to use great mechanical and tactical skill. 

 

There's really no point in having a competitive pvp game that takes place with real time decisions if the mechanical skill ceiling is low, it might as well be turn based at that point.

Edited by VIKINGNAIL

Skeggold, Skalmold, Skildir ro Klofnir

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After reading some of the posts in this thread it seems I should point out that I don't think ArtCraft will have any money to put towards marketing the game. It means this game will only be marketed through ''word to mouth'', exactly like the kickstarter was. The population will be around 100k on a daily basis, but even that might be slightly too generous. Depending on how well they can optimize and perfect their game before launch will determine how much cash flow they will initially create. After that it comes down to how fun combat is and what the options for the ''throne wars'' are, since these seem to be the main elements of the game.

 

Talking about launch figures seems a bit redundant because basically every MMO launch I've seen has its player base lowering extremely after the first few months. 

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Star Citizen is doing none of that thus far, so it'll probably never hit those numbers. I'm sure after the initial glow wears off it'll be populated by a small but dedicated community and that's perfectly fine.

 

I guess people are totally underestimating the whole lot of endless possibilities Star Citizen is going to offer them. It will be sheer endless possibilities for you to play the game, to have a unique experience in a persistent, dynamic and gigantic universe.

 

Star Citizen is by far the most ambitious and important game project in history and by far the largest Crowdfunding project in history.

Star Citizen will be a phenomenon like World of Warcraft, Minecraft or League of Legends, it is already.

If they really can make it.

Edited by Urahara

After EverQuest Next is gone, its Star Citizen for me.

 

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Star Citizen isn't going to make it though... It will come out many many years from now because it bit off more than it can chew.  By the time Star Citizen comes out there will be newer tech, newer potential. 


Skeggold, Skalmold, Skildir ro Klofnir

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Star Citizen isn't going to make it though... It will come out many many years from now because it bit off more than it can chew.  By the time Star Citizen comes out there will be newer tech, newer potential. 

 

Thats indeed the by far biggest problem of Star Citizen.


After EverQuest Next is gone, its Star Citizen for me.

 

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