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Tinnis

Concerns and thoughts about multiple accounts?

  

155 members have voted

  1. 1. Do you own multiple accounts?

  2. 2. Concerned about the implications?

  3. 3. Should ACE *try* and stop it? (bans or system changes to discourage)



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started this here as general discussion does not allow polls

 

Do you already own multiple accounts?

 

Are you concerned many core systems will be undermined by players being able to do this?

  • makes a mockery of the Crow system with regards to skill training
  • bypassing the one general skill training limit
  • people will make crafter alts - destroying player interdependence, training choice and specalisation
  • people suggest the maths favors just buying multiple accounts instead of VIP in order to train multiple archetypes - making ACE lose money over time
  • will also likely bypass: campaign locks, faction locks, god locks, guild locks

(ACE appears happy to allow this in code of conduct)

 

Yes having bought multiple accounts help ACE financially...

 

And obviously there is only so much ACE can do to stop players having multiple accounts if players really want to

 

EDIT:

 

this is less about unenforceable ban hammers (not that i'd be against that approach as a baseline) - more about a suggestion of:

 

should ACE design the systems so multiple accounts do not give giant benefits over single account users which go against the spirit of the game's systems

 

currently the opposite of this from what we know

Edited by Tinnis

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p.s. i'm not talking about playing multiple accounts AT THE SAME TIME via macros, scripts and bots e.g. multi box automation
 
ACE already against that
 

Jess. Gordon and I discussed this policy. As Jess stated, we are in agreement that we will allow people to run multiple accounts in tandem. Regarding the legitimate concerns some of you voiced about people running bots and somesuch, those activities are against the TOS and will be dealt with regardless of how many game clients someone is running. We'll have measures in place for people to report suspicious activity and we will be sniffing around for it ourselves.

Edited by Tinnis

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There is no way to stop someone from having multiple accounts.  How can they tell the difference between me having two accounts and me having one and my wife having one?

 

I have an account that will have VIP.  My wife has an account that will have VIP.  If I find a need a crafter alt, I will buy an account for that purpose.  It could also serve as my son's account.  Or my daughter's.  

 

Why is this in the suggestion box forum?  It's not a suggestion of anything.

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I don't have a ton of time right now to think too much about the ramifications in terms of Crowfall and this particular game's mechanics, but in general I am definitely against it. I've seen it abused in several games in the past and there are just so many ways to take advantage (some of those were friends so I saw first hand exactly what they were doing and how immensely they were benefiting). I remember years ago TERA had to actually put a limit (edit: Solomon is the former Director of CS) on how many accounts a player could have and it was abused in so many ways - the crafting system, endgame gearing (mostly via the original Nexus event system), event login rewards, etc. If there's something to be exploited, players will find it and do it. I suggest reading through that thread a bit if you don't understand the sorts of things people can and will do in games when you allow multiple accounts. And multiple accounts doesn't always mean they're all actively playing at the same time, or even that they're all logged in at the same time, but it will always have it's advantages.

 

I really have to agree with Tinnis that this is a serious issue that needs further community discussion in terms of it's potential effects on Crowfall. Crowfall is not like other games, so the gameplay elements that people take advantage of with multi accounting in other games may not be the same here. But before we all just accept this as an ok method of play I'd like to have the discussion on what those elements could be here, if any. And let's also consider the potential CS nightmare post launch for ACE if they tell people this is an OK thing to do.

Edited by Leiloni

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Can't be stopped, and honestly, there are decent arguments not to stop it, such as further funding for CF so that we may all enjoy a strong, healthy game.  At some level, coming to a MMO (and other genres) with the ability to throw time and money at it beyond the mean will provide an advantage (even if it is slight). 

 

However, there are some potential problems when it comes to crafting--specifically, an strong advantage when it comes to a crafting account.  This will devalue crafting mains in someways, in particular because of passive training. While gathering and some crafting will have to be done in CWs, the easy work around is simply join the same campaing with both account and log in with the crafter when desired.  I suspect that dedicated crafters/gatherers will not be as influential as they could be.  This is not ideal.        

 

EDIT:

The main problem is that multiple accounts will decrease interplayer dependence and increase self-sufficiency.  This is a very bad thing in a game like CF. 

Edited by Regulus

The Artist Formerly Known as Regulus

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p.s. i'm not talking about playing multiple accounts AT THE SAME TIME e.g. multi box automation

 

ACE already against that

 

 

They are NOT against that. They said no scripting/botting. But you can still play both at the same time as long as you're not botting and/or don't get caught. That will likely raise big issues in terms of exploting without hacking (in the other thread Miraluna gave a very good example with the way Crow spirits might work the same as UO ghosts), but as others have said, there's really no way to police this. Which is probably why ACE is allowing it. 


 

 

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its in suggestion section 

 

so it can have a poll

 

and ultimately a suggestion:

 

should ACE design the systems so multiple accounts do not give giant benefits over single account users which go against the spirit of the game's systems

 

and yes i meant bots / macro side as panns statement in that above quoute

Edited by Tinnis

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and ultimately a suggestion: should ACE design the systems so multiple accounts do not give giant benefits over single account users which go against the spirit of the game's systems

 

That is how I would go about it. The devs need to keep in the back of their mind that some people will multibox when they design all the systems. Any design that assumes people will use one account will likely lead to problems.


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Can't be stopped, and honestly, there are decent arguments not to stop it, such as further funding for CF so that we may all enjoy a strong, healthy game.

 

If you read my first post, this is not even necessarily true.

 

People have argued that it is more cost effective for the player to:

 

- buy two accounts for a one off cost for multiple training FOREVER

 

versus

 

- buying one account for a one off cost, then paying a monthly VIP fee to ACE for arguably less effective multiple training

 

ACE would lose money in the long term with option 1

Edited by Tinnis

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Well.... I have 7 accounts... So I am totally for allowing them to let us own multiples.  I doubt i will ever have two accounts logged in at the same time and wont be doing any key cloning or crap like that.


"Float like a Butterfly.... Sting like a Misplaced Decimal Point" - Xarrayne 2018

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If you read my first post, this is not even necessarily true.

 

People have argued that it is more cost effective for the player to:

 

- buy two accounts for a one off cost for multiple training FOREVER

 

versus

 

- buying one account for a one off cost, then paying a monthly VIP fee to ACE for arguably less effective multiple training

 

ACE would lose money in the long term with option 1

 

Then they could manipulate the costs to encourage subscription over additional account purchase.  However, the crow/passive leveling systems make multiple accounts very attractive currently.  


The Artist Formerly Known as Regulus

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This issue has been on mind for quite some time now.  I don't believe they should limit how many accounts you can have.  However, if a crafter alt is anywhere near as effective as, say, IdeaMatrix's main (who has dedicated himself to crafting from the very beginning) then there would be something very wrong with the game.  Whichever play style you choose, you should be rewarded for spending time on it; not just for shelling out a bit of extra cash and picking the correct passive training.

 

ACE has hinted in the past that they had ideas regarding this.  I hope Blair and the design gang are able to come up with the right answers on this one.

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Oh and another one:

Travelling INVENTORY MULES / static safe 'player banks'

 

How will logging on and off work - will you appear magically where you logged off?

 

Can you stash your precious gear, resources or food on your secondary account character to keep it safe from player looting? (caravan under attack? log out my mule!)

 

Can you bring along your second player on 'auto run / doing it manually' behind you to let you carry more resources from A to B?

 

Your castle is being sieged and your group is low on food? Well I parked my FOOD BOT here yesterday don't worry *pop* "Hellcat brisket delivery sir?" *vanish*

Edited by Tinnis

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This issue has been on mind for quite some time now.  I don't believe they should limit how many accounts you can have.  However, if a crafter alt is anywhere near as effective as, say, IdeaMatrix's main (who has dedicated himself to crafting from the very beginning) then there would be something very wrong with the game.  Whichever play style you choose, you should be rewarded for spending time on it; not just for shelling out a bit of extra cash and picking the correct passive training.

 

ACE has hinted in the past that they had ideas regarding this.  I hope Blair and the design gang are able to come up with the right answers on this one.

 

Yes, because it will be a major problem.  In SWG, crafting was rewarded because you had to dedicate yourself to it--it took time actively pursuing the goal of making and selling the best weapons, for example.  If many players have second crafting accounts leveled passively as they do other things, which can pop into a CW as needed, it will really hurt the game.  Someone who is a dev contributor needs to be nagging ACE about this.  


The Artist Formerly Known as Regulus

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i'm sure i'm only just scratching the surface of possible abuse ideas. its fun.

 

[e.g. i did this pondering druid appearing in SP - i bet people are going to suicide druids on full essence at key doorways, before wall breaches or stairs to abuse the death orbs too - does damage based on essence on death. make a minefield...]

 

:P

Edited by Tinnis

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i'm sure i'm only just scratching the surface of possible abuse ideas. its fun.

 

[e.g. i did this pondering druid appearing in SP - i bet people are going to suicide druids on full essence at key doorways, before wall breaches or stairs to abuse the death orbs too - does damage based on essence on death. make a minefield...]

 

:P

 

I fully expect timers to be on orbs/wisps. Otherwise, it is just silly...


The Artist Formerly Known as Regulus

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