Jump to content
Search In
  • More options...
Find results that contain...
Find results in...
Pann

Fly on the Wall: Harvesting - Official discussion thread

Recommended Posts

The major dilemma to my mind of building harvesting or crafting as really an alternative game-play style is the interaction between those players and those of us more interested in the PvP/PK side of things.  There seems like a pretty simple loop in supplying a demand, but I am talking more in line with: if harvesting is built around players who are relatively uninterested or even discouraged by PvP, then they will play a different game, right?  And if it's built around players who are interested in PvP, it will likely be shallow and become a source of tedium and, ultimately, burn-out.

 

I'm thinking, for example, about Albion: a game where, in my experience harvesting has got to be one of the most boring and unrewarding systems conceivable. With the increase in frequency of chest fights (FFA PvP on Points of Interest), our guild essentially logs on for that in order to get any resources.  If there are players out there who truly love the harvesting system in AO, good for them.  The developers, however, have chosen to essentially gate most of them behind a "you can't kill me" rep/flagging system, and therefore removed a great source of interaction for PvPers. 

 

tl;dr If harvesting is fun only if you are a "harvester" personality, then will that personality quit when they interact with PK and lost materials?

Edited by mctan

Mic MWH, Member of Mithril Warhammers since 2003,


Hammers High! http://www.mithrilwarhammers.com

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Is top of the hilt on that templar sword blurred?

 

jup since something is written on the white board. 


You get the wolves...lots of wolves...and sheep that wear armor and have developed an appetite for blood soaked grass - dubanka

Even insects smell good when roasted - a random confessor

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There's a huge pitfall here I don't hear anyone discussing.  It's great that alloys give different stats, but the demand will inevitably be imbalanced between desirable stats.  Everyone will care about Crit.  Nobody will care about Mana Regen.  There will be a huge variety of alloy bonuses and only a small handful that anyone cares about.  The materials used for useless alloys will also become useless.


Nazdar

Proud member of The Hunger

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The major dilemma to my mind of building harvesting or crafting as really an alternative game-play style is the interaction between those players and those of us more interested in the PvP/PK side of things.  There seems like a pretty simple loop in supplying a demand, but I am talking more in line with: if harvesting is built around players who are relatively uninterested or even discouraged by PvP, then they will play a different game, right?  And if it's built around players who are interested in PvP, it will likely be shallow and become a source of tedium and, ultimately, burn-out.

 

I'm thinking, for example, about Albion: a game where, in my experience harvesting has got to be one of the most boring and unrewarding systems conceivable. With the increase in frequency of chest fights (FFA PvP on Points of Interest), our guild essentially logs on for that in order to get any resources.  If there are players out there who truly love the harvesting system in AO, good for them.  The developers, however, have chosen to essentially gate most of them behind a "you can't kill me" rep/flagging system, and therefore removed a great source of interaction for PvPers. 

 

tl;dr If harvesting is fun only if you are a "harvester" personality, then will that personality quit when they interact with PK and lost materials?

If that harvester is gimp in combat and gets ganked often enough, he will quit the guild that leaves him unprotected and join one that will protect him. 


Honestly, you are the type of person that is much to competitive, has zero compassion for other people and think you are better than everyone else. You likely love to troll people on a day to day bases to get others angry and laugh about it. You make playing any online game unfun for everyone else.  -Kuroaka

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There's a huge pitfall here I don't hear anyone discussing.  It's great that alloys give different stats, but the demand will inevitably be imbalanced between desirable stats.  Everyone will care about Crit.  Nobody will care about Mana Regen.  There will be a huge variety of alloy bonuses and only a small handful that anyone cares about.  The materials used for useless alloys will also become useless.

 

We can hope if this happens there will be a flexible enough system that the stats and crafting recipes can be changed. It does seem we will be relying entirely on alloys to keep low end resources relevant.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There's a huge pitfall here I don't hear anyone discussing.  It's great that alloys give different stats, but the demand will inevitably be imbalanced between desirable stats.  Everyone will care about Crit.  Nobody will care about Mana Regen.  There will be a huge variety of alloy bonuses and only a small handful that anyone cares about.  The materials used for useless alloys will also become useless.

Excellent point and I think they might eventually use the seasons to balance out the usefulness of certain alloys over others. Critical alloys might be more in demand in the summer when base mana regen stats are higher, while mana regen alloys are more useful in the dead of winter when base mana regen is at a crawl. But it will just depend on how the seasons affect stats.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If that harvester is gimp in combat and gets ganked often enough, he will quit the guild that leaves him unprotected and join one that will protect him. 

 

I think this is the best case scenario.  In my experience, the more common scenario is that person quits the game.


Mic MWH, Member of Mithril Warhammers since 2003,


Hammers High! http://www.mithrilwarhammers.com

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There's a huge pitfall here I don't hear anyone discussing.  It's great that alloys give different stats, but the demand will inevitably be imbalanced between desirable stats.  Everyone will care about Crit.  Nobody will care about Mana Regen.  There will be a huge variety of alloy bonuses and only a small handful that anyone cares about.  The materials used for useless alloys will also become useless.

 

While I'm sure this is possible, I don't think ACE would design the individual values so poorly that it would actually happen to any serious degree.  In their old alloy chart, you have two wildly different alloys that use the same metals, but in different amounts.  People may not care at all about [Rose Gold] for LIfesteal (copper + gold), but a lot of people will want [Crown Gold] for Critical Hit Damage (copper + gold + gold).

 

Still, the information we don't know about crafting could fill an Imperial Palace, so I acknowledge your concern.

Edited by Hyriol

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

In their old alloy chart, you have two wildly different alloys that use the same metals, but in different amounts.

 

Yes, this is one strategy of mitigation.  That said, there will always be a plethora of low-value materials that have to go somewhere.  Other outlets include high-cost recipes and (very) fast decay.

 

Harvesting is the faucet of the economy.  Design choices now will have a huge consequences (some unintended) on every other feature of the game from now on.  There needs to be a comprehensive plan for creating a balanced ingress/egress equation before the big decisions are settled.


Nazdar

Proud member of The Hunger

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I haven't been following the progress closely I wonder if they have discussed group harvesting (3-4 harvesting on the same node increase the yield), Tree/rock monsters as an alternate source of harvesting, or camouflaged pack animals for solo harvesters. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I haven't been following the progress closely I wonder if they have discussed group harvesting (3-4 harvesting on the same node increase the yield), Tree/rock monsters as an alternate source of harvesting, or camouflaged pack animals for solo harvesters. 

Simple answer is yes to the group harvesting. The harvesting skills will include branches specifically giving bonuses to group harvesting.

 

I don't think there's been any talk about pets participating with you in the action of harvesting. And I don't know how pack animals will work. More importantly is what happens to the materials after they are harvested....junking locations, storefronts to sell them, and storage of mats.

 

Edit: I misunderstood your question about the trees/rocks. Yes, at least for the animal types. But it would be interesting to have mobile / migratory types of nodes.

Edited by Cordite

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The major dilemma to my mind of building harvesting or crafting as really an alternative game-play style is the interaction between those players and those of us more interested in the PvP/PK side of things. 

 

I don't think they intend for it to be an alternative playstyle as much as they acknowledge that for some people it will be. They are not asking people to decide between being a harvester/crafter or a PvPer. They are saying "if you want to focus on one of those things, that should at least be possible."

Edited by Jah

IhhQKY6.gif

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Design choices now will have a huge consequences (some unintended) on every other feature of the game from now on.  There needs to be a comprehensive plan for creating a balanced ingress/egress equation before the big decisions are settled.

 

Yeah, I can't wait to see it, either. :)  

 

I like to imagine Blair having one of those crazy conspiracy walls somewhere in the office to keep track of what connects to what in the Crowfall economy design.

 

Those first few campaigns are going to be very interesting since the only way to know these values will play out is to throw a bunch of players at it and see what falls out.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The major dilemma to my mind of building harvesting or crafting as really an alternative game-play style is the interaction between those players and those of us more interested in the PvP/PK side of things.  There seems like a pretty simple loop in supplying a demand, but I am talking more in line with: if harvesting is built around players who are relatively uninterested or even discouraged by PvP, then they will play a different game, right?  And if it's built around players who are interested in PvP, it will likely be shallow and become a source of tedium and, ultimately, burn-out.

 

I'm thinking, for example, about Albion: a game where, in my experience harvesting has got to be one of the most boring and unrewarding systems conceivable. With the increase in frequency of chest fights (FFA PvP on Points of Interest), our guild essentially logs on for that in order to get any resources.  If there are players out there who truly love the harvesting system in AO, good for them.  The developers, however, have chosen to essentially gate most of them behind a "you can't kill me" rep/flagging system, and therefore removed a great source of interaction for PvPers. 

 

tl;dr If harvesting is fun only if you are a "harvester" personality, then will that personality quit when they interact with PK and lost materials?

This is actually a big concern of mine from what I remember from back in my eve days most miners remain in high sec space but here that's a whole different ring of existence without economic connection to the lower rings. While group mining will still be in the dregs I worry many of the smaller mining groups that would go after lower tier of mineral copper lets say, wont risk it and remain in higher rings. This is equivalent to Eve Veldspar which makes tritanium a large part of for ships, is primarily mined by high sec miners. I wonder if there is enough incentive to get these  miners to the dregs to mine the copper we will need.


89W57Tu.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Simple answer is yes to the group harvesting. The harvesting skills will include branches specifically giving bonuses to group harvesting.

 

I don't think there's been any talk about pets participating with you in the action of harvesting. And I don't know how pack animals will work. More importantly is what happens to the materials after they are harvested....junking locations, storefronts to sell them, and storage of mats.

 

Edit: I misunderstood your question about the trees/rocks. Yes, at least for the animal types. But it would be interesting to have mobile / migratory types of nodes.

 

Think of pack animals like extra storage slots but when they get killed the loot they have is taken. You inventory, which generally is pretty safe ( this will vary based on the CW though) place to hold stuff is very limited in size and can only hold X amount of things. If you want to hold more you summon out a pack animal and give it a bunch of stuff to transport over to a warehouse/shop/guildmate/safe spot etc

 

If you need more about pack animals look at how Archeage does Trade packs and that pretty much is what a pack animal will be.

Edited by YouTubejasonwivart

Check out my youtube channel for testing gameplay https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCp-AgZ6mHOVObusemDVEXoA

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...