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karetyr

So, Tell Me About Shadowbane.

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I don't remember Shadowbane hardly at all, other than vague recollections of marketing.

 

What was it like? Why is everyone so keen on it?


Formerly Scin Karetyr, a native of Chilastra in Star Wars Galaxies

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Come find out.

 

Magicbane.com

 

Shadowbane emulator.com

 

At the moment SB Emu is more active but a lot of things have been changed from the original.


You are so incredibly helpful, CYT. I don't know how I ever managed to do anything before we met. I was just bumbling my way through life, all lost-like. Thank you. My blessing cup runneth over.

SWrkfdj.jpg

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Thanks for the link, headlight. That helps.

 

Alright, so then to avoid rehashing an old thread.... what was your favorite part of Shadowbane? The one thing that really made you love it, that you'd use to convince new people to try it?


Formerly Scin Karetyr, a native of Chilastra in Star Wars Galaxies

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The PvP system and in depth character creation. There a million different ways to take a character and discovering new things is fun.

 

Also the fact you absolutely get sucked in by guild, nation, and personal rivalries.


You are so incredibly helpful, CYT. I don't know how I ever managed to do anything before we met. I was just bumbling my way through life, all lost-like. Thank you. My blessing cup runneth over.

SWrkfdj.jpg

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Thanks for the link, headlight. That helps.

 

Alright, so then to avoid rehashing an old thread.... what was your favorite part of Shadowbane? The one thing that really made you love it, that you'd use to convince new people to try it?

To me there was no outside restrictions on how you PvP, no you can only kill these people, but not these over here because...We the Devs say so is why.

 

Shadowbane was my first MMO so that when I got to games like WoW and there was that troll that like to mouth off and be annoying in Ogrimar it drove me nuts I couldn't kill him. That was the thing, someone disgruntled you off on the boards or spouting off in game you could kill them even if they were in your own guild.

 

Everything was so wide open and the consequences to actions were determined by the players, so being a complete douchenozzle could have far ranging consequences. It could get you killed, it could get your guildmates killed, your city camped or even destroyed. 

 

Also the Character creation and diversity was the best, there was no one way to make Warrior or Priest or anything else.

Edited by gauis

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Non-stop yet organized war, politics, and poorly made socks talking. Fun, interesting, and unique classes.

 

Also tons of hacking, exploits, duping, game crashing when you move too much, game crashing when more than 20 people are on your screen at once, game crashing when you sneeze.

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Non-stop yet organized war, politics, and **** talking. Fun, interesting, and unique classes.

 

Also tons of hacking, exploits, duping, game crashing when you move too much, game crashing when more than 20 people are on your screen at once, game crashing when you sneeze.

The crash problems were fixed by the end of 2004, we had banes with multiple hundred of players at them. Which reminds me, there is no better feeling than winning a hard fought bane. After fighting for hours on end and that city you invested a lot of time and effort in was still standing or you took that away from someone else was the best.

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The crash problems were fixed by the end of 2004, we had banes with multiple hundred of players at them. Which reminds me, there is no better feeling than winning a hard fought bane. After fighting for hours on end and that city you invested a lot of time and effort in was still standing or you took that away from someone else was the best.

 

I distinctly remember them saying they fixed it, yet my client would still crash quite a bit. Not as much as before, but large fights were still causing me issues. I think it went from a SB.exe error to some other thing.

 

But yeah, long drawn out banes were awesome. That's exactly why sandbox PvP MMOs truly offer something you could never get out of any other kind of game. You could never replicate that exhilaration and emotional state in any other genre.

 

You feel like you're really part of something greater than yourself, like you actually accomplished a truly awesome feat. All of the high-level marketing for Crowfall suggests this is the kind of feeling the devs want the players to experience as much as possible. We can only hope they'll come close to achieving that.

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to the OP (and any others) if you played GW2 WvW you know that feeling of satisfaction of taking the Garri on that factions Borderlands or beating off the Zerg from your? Now imagine that you had to farm for days and weeks to actually build that structure from the ground up, that it wasn't a pre made low level structure you just inhabit each week. Now imagine how it would feel to take, keep, or lose it.

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to the OP (and any others) if you played GW2 WvW you know that feeling of satisfaction of taking the Garri on that factions Borderlands or beating off the Zerg from your? Now imagine that you had to farm for days and weeks to actually build that structure from the ground up, that it wasn't a pre made low level structure you just inhabit each week. Now imagine how it would feel to take, keep, or lose it.

That.... would certainly be more emotional.


Formerly Scin Karetyr, a native of Chilastra in Star Wars Galaxies

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Yeah... it was more emotional. That was one drawback that I don't think anybody accounted for. If you won in Shadowbane, it was a huge rush of an awesome feeling. If you lost, though... all your work of months was gone, your friends and fellow players were scattered to the four winds, you lost reputation and respect and the ability to continue playing. Many people stopped bothering to log in after their city was destroyed. 

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Yeah... it was more emotional. That was one drawback that I don't think anybody accounted for. If you won in Shadowbane, it was a huge rush of an awesome feeling. If you lost, though... all your work of months was gone, your friends and fellow players were scattered to the four winds, you lost reputation and respect and the ability to continue playing. Many people stopped bothering to log in after their city was destroyed. 

 

 

That appears to be a Lok-ri tag in your sig.

 

On another note, yes and no. Yeah, losing your city sucked but it was usually the hit to pride that caused most guilds to collapse after that. Wasn't a big deal later on because most had dealt with that and stayed with the game. Didn't make it less painful but people were definitely much more resilient.


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Shadowbane

 

I. Ingenious charater creation system

 

Pros:

  • Initial trait and attribute point selection affects also endgame via restrictions based on required stats and useful traits.
  • Attributepoint expenditure complicated by conditional requirements for maxing stats and diminishing returns for final points
  • Focusskill and skill selection with skillpoints provides a large number of different ways to select skills, esp. with alternative baseclass options
  • Wide range of race, baseclass and promotion class combinations with disciplines as a topping
  • Races are distinct with feature differences
  • Almost all characters can benefit at least to a certain degree from Constitution and Intelligence, usually also a 3rd stat.
  • Gargantuan number of different ways to build a character (Even today not all builds are/were solved by the players nor on a general level by the community)

Cons:

  • Optimization problem of attribute point expenditure often simplifies to maxing out two key stats and ignoring the rest
  • Extending content curve slightly more difficult when additional attribute points would simplify the attributepoint expenditure problems
  • Many beneficial spells of some classes made completely obsolete by access from alternative sources (Buffspotions, Buffbots)
  • Content curve prior to endgame equipment very short and endgame equipment pool rather narrow (Partially linked with character creation)

II. Persistent world of warfare with largely a player driven economy

 

Pros:

  • Players and communities would have the access to owning their own cities
  • City building a collective campaign for guild participants, creating also a socially oriented goal for players
  • City locations of their choosing with consequences to gameplay via access to worldly resources like special equipment/discipline droppers, mine locations.
  • Players to some extent could exploit their access to resources altering the server economy even by monopolizing them.
  • Warfare between guilds and city capture or destruction, sieges and siegestrategies.
  • Track and stealth systems in a persistent world

Cons:

  • PvE content lacking (Control of territory largely about the control of PvE resources + Mines)
  • Environmental interaction non-existent, thus despite slight graphical differences in appearance, the gameplay is largely the same regardless of environment (Assumably largely due to buggy client and engine)
  • Buildings which would provide environmental factors to PvP or otherwise encounters would mostly cause bugs for players to exploit

PvE & PvP

 

Pros:

  • Flight nicely incorporated into combat
  • The very large pool of different characters and character creation process makes PvP interesting by making preparation for the upcoming battles interesting
  • Knowledge of different characters valuable through choosing the correct strategy for defeating opponent
  • Considerable number of tactical & strategic elements available from mechanics and abilities (Flight, Stealth, Track + Powers)
  • Track and stealth systems in a persistent world

 

Cons:

  • Melee & Ranged combat system mostly lacks opportunity costs and players hardly make any decisions
  • Both track and stealth systems could be improved upon (See also my suggestion thread here. Track resembling omniscient clairvoyance rather than track (Also discourages player encounters and encourages quit exits))
  • Hardly any access to co-operative PvE content reducing social gameplay value (Except for r8s and generic leveling)(Note though that player driven economy could be broken by instancing and sandboxes could hurt the persistent world, so it makes sense this content was missing, but it's still a defect)

* Cutting comment here*

 

Maybe I could come up with more points or refine those already made, but for now I'll post this and maybe come back to edit it later. ^_^

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That.... would certainly be more emotional.

The other thing about those fights was how long they could take. I personally fought in more than 1 bane (siege warfare) that lasted for over 6 hours. I have heard of some that lasted for over 12 hours.

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So I was didn't read all of what Kaiho had there but I did see the first con on your character thing being about maxing out 2 stats.

 

Sorry, but if you were doing that you were bad at building characters. Yes, some could be simplified that way but most were actually much better with a more efficient stat spread.

 

Then again, a lot of people were really bad at building characters in SB.

Edited by phylor

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So I was didn't read all of what Kaiho had there but I did see the first con on your character thing being about maxing out 2 stats.

 

Sorry, but if you were doing that you were bad at building characters. Yes, some could be simplified that way but most were actually much better with a more efficient stat spread.

 

Then again, a lot of people were really bad at building characters in SB.

I think (or hope he was) talking about the 5 main stats: Strength, Dex, Int, Con and Spirit and in some builds that was all you need such as my Con/Int Scout that wasn't defensive based so didn't need Dex or Strength and it had enough spirit for my Runecaster.

Edited by gauis

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So I was didn't read all of what Kaiho had there but I did see the first con on your character thing being about maxing out 2 stats.

 

Sorry, but if you were doing that you were bad at building characters. Yes, some could be simplified that way but most were actually much better with a more efficient stat spread.

 

Then again, a lot of people were really bad at building characters in SB.

 

It's true that not all characters could be built in a such simple fashion, but in my opinion it often is the case. If you look at all the possible race and class combinations a very large chunk out of them is competitive following such a simple pattern. Perhaps I could demonstrate this to you a bit further, but I don't think it's necessary as you pointed out that you didn't actually read the comment properly, and among the pros list there's a point which helps to interpret the con, quote: (Pros:) "Almost all characters can benefit at least to a certain degree from Constitution and Intelligence, usually also a 3rd stat."

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I think (or hope he was) talking about the 5 main stats: Strength, Dex, Int, Con and Spirit and in some builds that was all you need such as my Con/Int Scout that wasn't defensive based so didn't need Dex or Strength and it had enough spirit for my Runecaster.

 

I'm aware of what he meant. The point I made still stands. Yes there are some situations where it was a mostly max out type of things. I cringed when I heard people using 40 runes on most things though. I was always a stickler for efficiency on builds though.


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