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jtoddcoleman

02/02/15 - Hunger Week... It's About Time.

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I think the game will fail as an MMO.

It may technically be a massively multiplayer online game, but it's not an MMORPG and should carve out a new genre.

Throne War Sim is a fine label.

 

MMORPGs are about the hero's journey in a persistent world - living out Tolkienesque stories in a 3D virtual space.

The worlds need to be dynamic rather than static, yes, but still be persistent. The game has to be about hope not failure.

What's described here is not a heroic journey. It's reliving ultimate failure. And failure isn't fun.

We don't get to save these worlds - it's postponing failure for as long as possible.

And that's not why people play MMOs.

 

Might be why people play strategy games like Risk. But Risk is not an RPG.

I expect this game to die a quicker death than ShadowBane.

 

I understand how you feel. Sometimes when I think about how we're told the game will work, I am scared of getting lost in all those ephemeral worlds and afraid to lose what I will fight for and what I will like. If the universe in which I will progress disappear eventually, what's the point of doing all this? I dislike the idea of multiple destructible worlds (why would you create 1,000,000 different if there could be 1?). I'm confused with what is really the purpose of the Eternal Kingdoms, the only persistent region of the game : is its only purpose to make players feel like the whole universe is persistent?

 

Still, 2 important things : I have a huge confidence in the team behind Crowfall AND in my ability to adapt to all the innovative features Crowfall will propose. 

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I'm a little late to the party as there seems to be many active and senior members.  I just came across this tonight and the thought of breathing life back into the MMO world sounds promising.  The concept sounds of a mixture of a MOBA/MMO but in guild size and fought over an extended time. But I'll stick around and read for a while.  Maybe I am way off on that accusation. 

Edited by WarmongerSix

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No @WarmongerSix you are pretty close to it with that discription.  Welcome to the forums.  Keep your hands and feet inside the ride at all times! And please don't feed some of the members, they may bite.  :P


Tanom of the WhiteWalkers

 

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I'm a little late to the party as there seems to be many active and senior members.  I just came across this tonight and the thought of breathing life back into the MMO world sounds promising.  The concept sounds of a mixture of a MOBA/MMO but in guild size and fought over an extended time. But I'll stick around and read for a while.  Maybe I am way off on that accusation. 

 

The forum opened only a little more than one month ago, january 6th I think, so we are not too late!  :)

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Amazing! This is the kind of creativity we need in the MMO gaming genre. Big props to you man, only the creator of Shadowbane could come up with such a fresh new idea. I truly look forward to playing this game after reading this thread!

 

I love the idea of having multiple campaigns that your clan or kingdom can conquer and strategize over, instead of just team a vs team b.

 

Brilliant!

Edited by tempest

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Oh noes.

 

ESO has it and it is poorly made socks.

 

Persistant world is basic to any serious MMORPG. 

 

If you want to avoid "stagnation" implement other systems then instances. 

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sorry for another post but forgot to end my post that let down i am.

 

See it the opposite way then OP.

 

Don't want to be the eternal hero, i am one of many who fight for something bigger and THAT has to be of ETERNAL value.

 

If the worlds come and go i might not be intrested to conquer any of them, they simply aren't of value, because "changing the world" isnt of any persisnta value.

 

Hope crowfall change direction or i wont be part of it.    

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Sandbox means persistant world !

 

You do realize how hilarious this statement is right? I mean, the whole point of a sandbox is so little kids can build and destroy and build and destroy. Persistence is the last thing from a "sandbox". Sandbox means malleable, mutable, never the same twice, make it your own.

And Crowfall has persistence, in your character, not in the world. That's the entire concept. If you can't wrap your head around that, I don't think you're going to have fun here.


I'm in this for the Experience, not the XP.

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Don't want to be the eternal hero, i am one of many who fight for something bigger and THAT has to be of ETERNAL value.

 

If the worlds come and go i might not be intrested to conquer any of them, they simply aren't of value, because "changing the world" isnt of any persisnta value.

 

I agree with you on the apparent futility of being an Eternal Hero in Crowfall. I would prefer the world to be focused on a great goal rather than on the individuals who attained personal ones. Eternal Kingdoms, by me, shouldn't echo the glory of the heroes (trophies, ribbons, statues) but rather glorify the pursuit of the goal (books, songs, rituals).

 

As for your concerns about changing worlds not being valuable because of the lack of persitence, I would invite you to look around you and wonder what is different here on Earth.  :P

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You do realize how hilarious this statement is right? I mean, the whole point of a sandbox is so little kids can build and destroy and build and destroy. Persistence is the last thing from a "sandbox". Sandbox means malleable, mutable, never the same twice, make it your own.

And Crowfall has persistence, in your character, not in the world. That's the entire concept. If you can't wrap your head around that, I don't think you're going to have fun here.

 

There are many connotations.

First i think we are not "Kids" in the sense "just have fun without knowing why". Unfortunately thats just goes for real kids <10 years or even younger.

Second as long as we build on the same server that stays forever "the same server" i accept that all things can change.

Alliances can change, guilds can change, owner of properties can change, all remember when and how it changes.

You right that i wont have fun if it stays that way.

ESO is crap because it follows same logic. meaningless end game combat.I left after 2 months and have already the experience with such a system.

 

 

 

I agree with you on the apparent futility of being an Eternal Hero in Crowfall. I would prefer the world to be focused on a great goal rather than on the individuals who attained personal ones. Eternal Kingdoms, by me, shouldn't echo the glory of the heroes (trophies, ribbons, statues) but rather glorify the pursuit of the goal (books, songs, rituals).

 

As for your concerns about changing worlds not being valuable because of the lack of persitence, I would invite you to look around you and wonder what is different here on Earth.  :P

 

Isn't one of the biggest value diving into a fantasy world that this world will follow diffrerent rules then the RL one and this world at least this one try to simulate something valuable that don't get wiped ever 7 days or a 1 month? 

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Isn't one of the biggest value diving into a fantasy world that this world will follow diffrerent rules then the RL one and this world at least this one try to simulate something valuable that don't get wiped ever 7 days or a 1 month? 

 

If I am looking for stability and security in this kind of environment, yes.

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Isn't one of the biggest value diving into a fantasy world that this world will follow diffrerent rules then the RL one and this world at least this one try to simulate something valuable that don't get wiped ever 7 days or a 1 month? 

 

Where are you getting the 7 days to 1 month timeline?  Last I had heard it was measured in Months to a Year.


Tanom of the WhiteWalkers

 

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Where are you getting the 7 days to 1 month timeline?  Last I had heard it was measured in Months to a Year.

 

Here, from original OP

 

 

Some Campaigns could last 1 week, or 1 month.  or 6 months.  or 1 year.

 

Also my experience with ESO was that pretty fast the playerbase demanded "quick" rewards and the month length campaign ended up being days long.

 

 

Also i believe strongly in the basic concept of sandboxes :                                                            

 

"A sandbox doesn't have a concept of a winning condition", you simply cant "beat" a sandbox game.

 

The Risk game example the OP is refering to cant be apllied to sandbox games because a game of risk is not a sandbox game. 

 

If you want to change stagnation and really want land ownership to change hands introduce some penalty system for longtime ownership for example.   

Edited by DarthRaiden

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You don't seem to get that they're trying something new. They never said they were making a sandbox game. In fact they say "More impactful than a virtual sandbox".

They don't want to do what you've already seen and done. They want to do something new, different.

 

This game will have permanence in the Eternal Kingdoms and in your character. Impermanence in the Dying Worlds and in loss of items. If you want to sit in the EK forever and never risk "impermanence" or the loss of your imaginary stuff, well, you can. But if you want to experience the entire game, you'll have to venture out, build things that you know will be destroyed. Risk your personal items and creations. Put it on the line. Live a little.

 

This isn't a sandbox, it's a Throne Simulator.


I'm in this for the Experience, not the XP.

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I think some of you are missing the point.  The flexibility of what is being designed here.

 

ArtCraft could create a world ruleset that never ends and is "persistent" as some of you are wishing for.  There is flexibility for that.

 

But I think you will find, after a certain amount of time when one guild has conquered that world it will become stagnant (i.e. eternal Risk game).

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ESO is crap because it follows same logic. meaningless end game combat.I left after 2 months and have already the experience with such a system.

 

Isn't one of the biggest value diving into a fantasy world that this world will follow diffrerent rules then the RL one and this world at least this one try to simulate something valuable that don't get wiped ever 7 days or a 1 month? 

 

I am not going to try and convince you (You have every right to completely turn the other way, maybe this game just isn't for you).

 

I will list some details about Crowfall which may or may not interest you.

 

1)  Campaigns will likely last a minimum of 6 months.

2)  Players can build and destroy structures.

3)  Crafting in Crowfall will not  be a secondary activity, but a necessary engine to fuel warfare and military endeavors.

4)  The Crowfall economy is a bartering economy (No official currency, no "standard gold")

5)  Physics.

6)  There's this black hole which is trying to eat the planets.

7)  Looks like the game is full loot for all rule sets.

8)  Item decay.

 

I also see no similarity between ESO and Crowfall.


How Can Mounts Add to the Crowfall Experience?  Caravans, Hunting Boars, and more.

 

How Complex can Mining be in Crowfall?  Mining difficulty, fatigue, infrastructure.

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