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Shadowbane 2.0

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Just now, VIKINGNAIL said:

Um, the people that were relevant when SB was at its most populated and competitive do know me.  It's the people that weren't relevant that are trying to revise history here, stumbling over made up numbers, arguing with each other about those numbers. 

There's no consistency because they do not have firsthand experience. 

I am legitimately curious though... what was your guild in SB? I never played SB, but I am curious.

Was your character name the same, VK?

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1 minute ago, PaleOne said:

Wow had the lowest skill ceiling of all time. It was and is a mass market blubie game.

There is zero risk.

I beta tested and played wow at release. I could and would go into Tauren Mill as a night elf rogue and kill everyone, by myself, over and over again. I would kill two or three people. Eventually get killed and go back and do it again. It was pointless, and i could grief everyone and had absolutely no consequences.

Thanks for your anecdote, but you clearly never played in the organized pvp leagues that top guilds participated in, or later on organized bgs of up to 40vs40 and later on arenas.


Skeggold, Skalmold, Skildir ro Klofnir

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Just now, VIKINGNAIL said:

Thanks for your anecdote, but you clearly never played in the organized pvp leagues that top guilds participated in, or later on organized bgs of up to 40vs40 and later on arenas.

We left wow for Darkfall because it was pointless...and Carebear..


www.lotd.org       pking and siege pvp since 1995

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1 minute ago, PaleOne said:

Hardcore PVP'ers don't play games where you can't kill people and take their stuff...

Well actually hardcore pvpers play the games with the highest skill-ceilings matched with the most amount of competition. 

Because taking stuff doesn't matter if you did it vs someone that took no skill to do it vs. 


Skeggold, Skalmold, Skildir ro Klofnir

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3 minutes ago, VIKINGNAIL said:

Thanks for your anecdote, but you clearly never played in the organized pvp leagues that top guilds participated in, or later on organized bgs of up to 40vs40 and later on arenas.

I played wow pvp bgs arena/leagues. It was a boring grind . Any half decent pvper would stand out like a titan. I beta tested wow and played it at release. It was a pvp guild killer because it was uber boring. WE had nothing true to fight over ... No loots... hell you could not even poorly made socks talk the other team because it was so carebear as to make the TWO faction combat garbbled to protect carebear feelings. I agree with a lot that you say at times VikingNail but I disagree there.

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2 minutes ago, VIKINGNAIL said:

Well actually hardcore pvpers play the games with the highest skill-ceilings matched with the most amount of competition. 

Because taking stuff doesn't matter if you did it vs someone that took no skill to do it vs. 

You keep saying skill ceiling but.. There are a multitude of skills in everygame. Not every skill is who can run around the fastest to avoid being hit . Or who puts on their headshot hack. Or who dupes the most gold in SB A good guid leader and good guild will make use of ALL of the skills of ALL of there members.

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There is nothing Hardcore about playing games with no risk.

 

and my goal is not to beat you with even numbers at a specified time, with a time limit and a rule set.

 

My goals is roll over you when you least expect it, take your stuff and then screenshot your salty tears when you say it wasn't fair you brought more players than we did.

 

and I will frame your tears and use it as wall paper on my laptop.  And I will also have your stuff :)

Did I mention I will have your stuff?

its Sun Tzu vs Leet Gamerboy :)


www.lotd.org       pking and siege pvp since 1995

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18 minutes ago, dolmar said:

I played wow pvp bgs arena/leagues. It was a boring grind . Any half decent pvper would stand out like a titan. I beta tested wow and played it at release. It was a pvp guild killer because it was uber boring. WE had nothing true to fight over ... No loots... hell you could not even poorly made socks talk the other team because it was so carebear as to make the TWO faction combat garbbled to protect carebear feelings. I agree with a lot that you say at times VikingNail but I disagree there.

What's more important, beating someone in something that takes a ton of skill, or being able to loot a player that wasn't much of a challenge?  In your next post you talk about skill, but hold on for a second, compare the organization of a top tier rbg team and their comms and tactics, vs a guild currently tryharding in CF tests.  What do you notice?  Very simplistic types of coordination in one comms, real coordination, tactics, timing in another. 

14 minutes ago, PaleOne said:

There is nothing Hardcore about playing games with no risk.

 

and my goal is not to beat you with even numbers at a specified time, with a time limit and a rule set.

 

My goals is roll over you when you least expect it, take your stuff and then screenshot your salty tears when you say it wasn't fair you brought more players than we did.

 

and I will frame your tears and use it as wall paper on my laptop.  And I will also have your stuff :)

Did I mention I will have your stuff?

its Sun Tzu vs Leet Gamerboy :)

The biggest risk of all, greater than any pixel leather belt, is the ego.  Dominating other people that are used to being the dominators is more gratifying than any psychological trick you play to make yourself think looting a leather belt was worth it. 

Sun Tzu is something a lot of esports coaches teach to their players. 

It's not something that a lot of late era shadowbane players utilized.

Edited by VIKINGNAIL

Skeggold, Skalmold, Skildir ro Klofnir

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1 minute ago, VIKINGNAIL said:

What's more important, beating someone in something that takes a ton of skill, or being able to loot srathor?  In your next post you talk about skill, but hold on for a second, compare the organization of a top tier rbg team and their comms and tactics, vs a guild currently tryharding in CF tests.  What do you notice?  Very simplistic types of coordination in one comms, real coordination, tactics, timing in another. 

The biggest risk of all, greater than any pixel leather belt, is the ego.  Dominating other people that are used to being the dominators is more gratifying than any psychological trick you play to make yourself think looting a leather belt was worth it. 

Sun Tzu is something a lot of esports coaches teach to their players. 

It's not something that a lot of late era shadowbane players utilized.

I am a martial arts instructor by profession and Sun Tzu is required reading )

In SB an understanding of strategy, and good intelligence was much more crucial than in wow battlegrounds.

In war you have to know enemy numbers, position, movement on a massive battlefield. Good Reconnaissance and knowledge of your own forces are a key to victory.

An understanding of politics, grudges, political history on the server were all important when guaranteeing victory.

I personally commanded over 50 instances of siege pvp/ Banes. We burned trees or defended our city sometimes twice a week.


www.lotd.org       pking and siege pvp since 1995

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3 minutes ago, PaleOne said:

I am a martial arts instructor by profession and Sun Tzu is required reading )

In SB an understanding of strategy, and good intelligence was much more crucial than in wow battlegrounds.

In war you have to know enemy numbers, position, movement on a massive battlefield. Good Reconnaissance and knowledge of your own forces are a key to victory.

An understanding of politics, grudges, political history on the server were all important when guaranteeing victory.

I personally commanded over 50 instances of siege pvp/ Banes. We burned trees or defended our city sometimes twice a week.

And if you had excelled at WoW battlegrounds and sat at the top of that competition then you would have a lot of credibility there, but you didn't, and it kind of shows, because you don't know what it actually took to win battlegrounds vs other top teams. 

I don't really care about WoW history or shadowbane history though, I care most that CF has a high skill-ceiling, and I pretty much consistently stand against those that are trying to soften the game. 

Edited by VIKINGNAIL

Skeggold, Skalmold, Skildir ro Klofnir

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10 minutes ago, VIKINGNAIL said:

What's more important, beating someone in something that takes a ton of skill, or being able to loot a player that wasn't much of a challenge? 

Looting you while your house is burning down around your corpse, regardless of your lack of a challenge, thank you very much.


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Just now, vandarr said:

Looting you while your house is burning down around your corpse, regardless of your lack of a challenge, thank you very much.

Yea, that's fine, everyone has their preferences, I myself would rather beat someone in something that takes a ton of skill. 


Skeggold, Skalmold, Skildir ro Klofnir

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1 minute ago, VIKINGNAIL said:

And if you had excelled at WoW battlegrounds and sat at the top of that competition then you would have a lot of credibility there, but you didn't, and it kind of shows, because you don't know what it actually took to win battlegrounds vs other top teams. 

To me the wow league battlegrounds were the same as guildwars 1 arena. You could lose a rateing. Not the years work. One night in darkfall, or Shadowbane could render you with nothing to show for that year. Risk vrs Reward. I put that as the same skill accept you have more to lose. All of those games were tab target. All of those games took coordinated planning of team make up . You just had much more to lose. in Shadowbane/darkfall.

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Just now, VIKINGNAIL said:

And if you had excelled at WoW battlegrounds and sat at the top of that competition then you would have a lot of credibility there, but you didn't, and it kind of shows, because you don't know what it actually took to win battlegrounds vs other top teams. 

I played the early ones and found them boring, I left for something closer to SB with real risk.

The only thing I enjoyed about WoW pvp was going into contested zones solo and killing whole groups by myself.

Wait for a bad pve pull, Sap the cleric, Ambush the mage, Vanish, finish off the Warrior, comeback and kill the cleric etc...

But without phat lewts I got bored.

 

Too Grindy, too many queues..etc

I


www.lotd.org       pking and siege pvp since 1995

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3 minutes ago, VIKINGNAIL said:

Yea, that's fine, everyone has their preferences, I myself would rather beat someone in something that takes a ton of skill. 

So would I. When you get good, let me know and I'll loot you then too.


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2 minutes ago, dolmar said:

To me the wow league battlegrounds were the same as guildwars 1 arena. You could lose a rateing. Not the years work. One night in darkfall, or Shadowbane could render you with nothing to show for that year. Risk vrs Reward. I put that as the same skill accept you have more to lose. All of those games were tab target. All of those games took coordinated planning of team make up . You just had much more to lose. in Shadowbane/darkfall.

I'd rather fight someone over and over in a skillful way and try to consistently prove dominance, than kick over a sandcastle in a game with a low skill-ceiling. 

It's why I hope CF has a high skill-ceiling.  It's also important to the success of the game.  The game will in fact dry up if they cater too much to bad players.


Skeggold, Skalmold, Skildir ro Klofnir

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Kicking over a sandcastle takes much more cordnation than beating someone in the open field duels. 5v5 10v10 .

I think what you claim as high skill is only what you see as high skill what you pride your self on. That's fine.

A skilled hooker gets the job faster than an unskilled hooker. But the unskilled hooker could be much cleaner. :)

perspective .

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2 minutes ago, vandarr said:

P.S. - Sun Tzu is entry level stuff. I prefer Carl von Clausewitz, Johann Ewald, William Biddle, John Simcoe, John Singleton Mosby, Reynel Martinez, and others.

I'm a big fan Col John Boyd, Miyamoto Musashi, Heinz Gunderian and Erwin Rommel..


www.lotd.org       pking and siege pvp since 1995

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