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Ready, aim, fire - Official discussion thread

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7 minutes ago, coolster50 said:

Don't really see how changing races are anything but cosmetic.

Different ability scores (Str, Int, etc), different racial powers, different passives, different movement speeds, different restrictions on class, different restrictions on disciplines, possibly different access to types of gear. It adds up to greater customization in all sorts of ways. That stuff sounds cosmetic to you?


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His Elvish tongue was silken, and while my language was clearly foreign to him, he infused it with an almost musical quality. “There is a vine in the deepwood,” he said, “which my people call iriolis. It roughly translates to ‘the creeping fingers’. This vine grows everywhere: over the land, up the trees, under the water – even up the face of stone. The problem is that it grows too well. The fingers are greedy; they drain the soil, taint the water and leave no sunlight for others. This is why we rip it up from the roots, for to let iriolis live is to let the forest die.”

“I do not understand,” I replied. “I thought iriolis was the Elven word for Humans.”

“Indeed,” he said, drawing the silver scimitar from the scabbard at his waist.

This is a great little short story--catches your attention.  However, being the spoilsport that I am, I have to point out that really interesting racial tension like this, that could drive on narrative--both overarching and individual--is almost meaningless with the Crows and Vessels system.  

This next reveal is exciting and I have high hopes.   


The Artist Formerly Known as Regulus

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18 minutes ago, Vectious said:

Thats not how SB was.

Pretty sure I read somewhere that most warriors were minotaurs because minos had the best stats for warriors, or something like that. So it wouldn't be far fetched to believe that if Minos had the highest base Str, they would be innately better with Str based classes than, say humans.

 

EDIT: Reading is Fundamental...

Certain races were best at certain playstyles, not necessarily the best at certain classes /EDIT

17 minutes ago, Jah said:

Different ability scores (Str, Int, etc), different racial powers, different passives, different movement speeds, different restrictions on class, different restrictions on disciplines, possibly different access to types of gear. It adds up to greater customization in all sorts of ways. That stuff sounds cosmetic to you?

Wasn't thinking about it in that light, so I will grant you that races might play a bigger role than I originally expected 

Edited by coolster50

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You Can't Be A Genius, If You Aren't The Slightest Bit Insane.

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12 minutes ago, Regulus said:

This is a great little short story--catches your attention.  However, being the spoilsport that I am, I have to point out that really interesting racial tension like this, that could drive on narrative--both overarching and individual--is almost meaningless with the Crows and Vessels system.  

This next reveal is exciting and I have high hopes.   

If they unlock class and race, maybe the vessel system will be changed.

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16 minutes ago, Regulus said:

This is a great little short story--catches your attention.  However, being the spoilsport that I am, I have to point out that really interesting racial tension like this, that could drive on narrative--both overarching and individual--is almost meaningless with the Crows and Vessels system.  

This next reveal is exciting and I have high hopes.   

Imagine if you could chose to enter a world as a character pre-crow, and when the world ended that you were "saved" and became part of your accounts "Murder" of crows.

Now I have gone wayyyy over the deep end.

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5 minutes ago, frozenshadow said:

If they unlock class and race, maybe the vessel system will be changed.

I dont think it needs to be. Thats the logic of it. You already get hamster arms/legs/heads. We would just stop calling them duelist parts. 


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1 minute ago, KrakkenSmacken said:

Imagine if you could chose to enter a world as a character pre-crow, and when the world ended that you were "saved" and became part of your accounts "Murder" of crows.

Now I have gone wayyyy over the deep end.

Actually, I thought that maybe all characters starting pre-crow when entering a world the first time would be a decent way to address the "ew!" of the C&V system, drive their story or even have a sort of tutorial. 


The Artist Formerly Known as Regulus

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1 hour ago, durenthal said:

 Separating race from class isn't a wow for me.  I don't care what race my knight is, frankly.  Gameplay > cosmetics.  That said, it'll thrill the race-based RP guilds.

So long as the races are meaningfully different I'd have to disagree, from my own perspective anyway.

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2 minutes ago, Regulus said:

Actually, I thought that maybe all characters starting pre-crow when entering a world the first time would be a decent way to address the "ew!" of the C&V system, drive their story or even have a sort of tutorial. 

I would love that to be the answer to alt accounts.  

Accumulate multiple crows by harvesting characters from dying worlds along with resources. Eventually your Murder count could rival all the ALT's some players have purchased.

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35 minutes ago, Vectious said:

Thats not how SB was.

Shadowbane each race had different min and maxes of the base stats, strength, intel, spirit, etc.

But also had access to race only starter runes, sometimes powers, access to weapons by default, some could fly, and bonus to some skills, base movement speed, and some item restrictions. An example is shade get access to the ability to hide (stealth as long as you stand still) no matter what class you ended up being, this gave fighter and clerics the potential of a type of stealth.

And some discipline runes were completely race restricted. So you would take a elf race for a fighter even though they didn't have the best strength/con stats but they had access to blade weaver discipline rune, a elf only discipline rune,  that could make up for it. So there was no 'BEST' race for a class, it was playstyle. The elf fighter would focus on evading attacks instead of taking the hit. 

So race could potentially have A LOT of impact on gameplay.

Before WoW and their 'single ability' difference between races and class restriction that they ended up removing, races had huge impact in games. Hopefully we will see a revival of that type of customization. 

So i can see how people who are use to WoW's version of different races may not be very impressed, but for other gamers who have played games that the race is a significant, gameplay changing choice, its potentially huge news. 

Exactly. Assuming Todd understands how SB worked, and I believe he does, IF they are separating race and class, I fail to see any reason to believe it would be merely cosmetic. That wouldn't make much sense, would it fellas?

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3 minutes ago, KrakkenSmacken said:

Well if he was lying on his back with that shield it would look a bit like an end table.

Dave Greco did say "These guys will be much taller than it appears on the illustration," so maybe that was a clue that Dwarves tower over ordinary tables in Crowfall.


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1 hour ago, durenthal said:

an image of one partial row?  That's more of an insult than a tease.

Well, you sold the tease pretty well last week.  Under-delivered on the tease this week, which reduces expectations for the reveal next week.  Hopefully the reveal wows.  Separating race from class isn't a wow for me.  I don't care what race my knight is, frankly.  Gameplay > cosmetics.  That said, it'll thrill the race-based RP guilds.

 

Passives, disciplines, guild support, POIs, win conditions, servers with 1000+ concurrent players.  These are things that will thrill me and mine.

Hey bro, we all care about Passives, disciplines, guild support, POIs, win conditions, & servers with 1000+ concurrent players. We just want to do it as 20 strong stoneborn hammering your southern regions without being too gimped ourselves. 


Hammers High !!  Master Brewer of the Dwarven Hold Mithril Warhammers

 

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1 minute ago, barab said:

Hey bro, we all care about Passives, disciplines, guild support, POIs, win conditions, & servers with 1000+ concurrent players. We just want to do it as 20 strong stoneborn hammering your southern regions without being too gimped ourselves. 

Now there's some hate crime I can get behind.

No more of this cats sleeping with dogs nonsense. Death to the Elves! Or something.

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1 hour ago, durenthal said:

an image of one partial row?  That's more of an insult than a tease.

Well, you sold the tease pretty well last week.  Under-delivered on the tease this week, which reduces expectations for the reveal next week.  Hopefully the reveal wows.  Separating race from class isn't a wow for me.  I don't care what race my knight is, frankly.  Gameplay > cosmetics.  That said, it'll thrill the race-based RP guilds.

 

Passives, disciplines, guild support, POIs, win conditions, servers with 1000+ concurrent players.  These are things that will thrill me and mine.

All the things you just listed are literally already expected/promised. Its almost like you are asking for them to give you the completed game and are now complaining that its not looking to be that. 

But don't worry you will get your thrills soon™. They aren't going anywhere. 

And race selection could be potentially huge, but i suppose its easier to dismiss something by not putting some thought in to it because you want to be disappointed. 


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2 hours ago, coolster50 said:

Sooo the icons were the design table?

Icons or the "racial" weapons? Could be the third tab of inventory too


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Thelanas Kar'Pal Membre fondateur de l'alliance Naerth en 2001 - Ex Shadowbane European Advisor Damnation/Carnage/Vindication/Corruption http://www.twitch.tv/gorwald/profile

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Another interesting thing to consider: let's assume classes being opened to more races is simply cosmetic. There will still be major differences in the game, because the Lore involved (even when many do not care) will bring in more players. Not just more players, but different players, with different attitudes. And all of that matters a great deal to the health and survival of MMORPGs that try to construct a social universe.

In my experience, guilds with collective Lore identities survive the longest and add a ton of flavor to the games they play. That's why I joined one, personally. Any group of people willing to "gimp" themselves to stay committed to their story adds to this world. But, I am definitely with Barab - we simply don't want to be too gimped.

To make a big reveal that is universally loved is essentially impossible. To make a reveal that is loved by some people and trivial to others is a good goal.

Edited by mctan

Mic MWH, Member of Mithril Warhammers since 2003,


Hammers High! http://www.mithrilwarhammers.com

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