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UnleashTheKraken

An Open Letter to the Devs - 5/22/2017

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36 minutes ago, excelsias said:

Yeah that's not quite the same as an organized, official arena-based server though?  I'm thinking something that provides quick access to discs, weapons, armor, etc. without the need to craft, and a sanctioned format (again, like CTF).

But I see your point! :)

Now that we are talking about arenas. Will we have those in CWs?  A lot of rulesets (1x1, 2x2, etc.) and instead of giving rewards make betting possible. Make it so that we can have multiple acess points so that everyone can acess them.

This could be a fun time sink for people who complain "What can i do when my friends are offline?" and i can see the betting being some way to make some money while doing it.

Edited by BarriaKarl

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45 minutes ago, Tinnis said:

Well, that is already here.

EKs are online even outside of playtest windows at this point and you can enable PvP and invite up to 12 players for a 5v5 or 3v3v3v3. Or set your EK to open and public.

You can even build an interesting arena.....for awhile anyway.

Also @Anthragei beilive made a 2FORT map :P

I did indeed, and it was up for a while before EKs were wiped. I was in it for over 6 hours building it and pvping there in fact, but when the 'CWs' came up I started pvping there I crashed, and have since been crashing in EKs and the CWs, being stricken with the same issue everyone with ATI cards is. I will rebuild it however, once I can.

I do understand what the OP is saying. I posted something similar, and shortly thereafter the Bloodbath server debuted. I think ACE has shown now they are willing to try new things in this sense, and I have no doubt they will put up a few more server variants as we go forward. They may even accommodate some community requests, or help facilitate things like an arena or game modes like CTF, with particular asset additions if we ask nicely. :)

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16 minutes ago, Anthrage said:
37 minutes ago, BarriaKarl said:

Now that we are talking about arenas. Will we have those in CWs?  A lot of rulesets (1x1, 2x2, etc.) and instead of giving rewards make betting possible. Make it so that we can have multiple acess points so that everyone can acess them.

This could be a fun time sink for people who complain "What can i do when my friends are offline?" and i can see the betting being some way to make some money while doing it.

 

I'm not even suggesting that they be part of the long-term game.  I just think Arenas would be useful for combat / balance testing, and hope they make a comeback in some limited fashion.  Or even with a "CTF" type variant, to help test POI combat.  I don't think they belong long-term, actually, because you can't balance for them, but they could be modeled and designed in a way to replicate the type of fighting expected in the actual CW.  Again - like they did before with Siege Perilous and Hunger Dome testing.  They probably need to come back in some way to help with the balanced OP posted about?

 

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Healing wont need to be toned down once anti-healing mechanics become a common thing (like disease, shadow mantle, etc). Death shouldn't come easy, especially since your gear, vessel and disciplines are on the line and the amount of time to acquire that gear (at least atm) is > the amount of time it takes to lose it.

Edited by Helix

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10 hours ago, UnleashTheKraken said:

we also realize that this is pre alpha

we've found that some archetypes are just better than others.

You have your answer there mate. This is Pre-Alpha.

Quote

 

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3 hours ago, excelsias said:

I'm not even suggesting that they be part of the long-term game.  I just think Arenas would be useful for combat / balance testing, and hope they make a comeback in some limited fashion.  Or even with a "CTF" type variant, to help test POI combat.  I don't think they belong long-term, actually, because you can't balance for them, but they could be modeled and designed in a way to replicate the type of fighting expected in the actual CW.  Again - like they did before with Siege Perilous and Hunger Dome testing.  They probably need to come back in some way to help with the balanced OP posted about?

 

When its time for that stuff to be tested it'll be added to the already running CW testworlds. As more content and systems come online the current servers will start to look and feel like actual CWs. So theres no longer any need for separate game modes to test stuff.

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I think most people here missed the point of this post. This is meant to raise concerns about the direction some things are going as far as combat is concerned. It was mentioned that this was taken through the lens of early development. Even in Shadowbane, the amount of small scale combat was incredibly significant.

The earlier concerns are voiced, the easier it is to at least plant the seeds for future development. If no one voices any concerns and takes on the attitude of "oh it's just pre-alpha" then what's to say anyone has actually communicated those very concerns? The game is slated for a soft launch at the end of this year, and there's a lot to go. Given that, I believe the concerns are justified. I think everyone here can find common ground in wanting this game to be successful.

Edited by UnleashTheKraken

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A lot of great points made so far.  Legio is a decent kit, but he's not what I consider unbalanced. Especially compared to the unbalanced state the game has been in previously.

Healing reduction was very significant. The amount of CC flying (fessor still queen of the battlefield) around and the damage out of runes like troubadour are kicking out.  

Also generally agree 2v2 or even 3v3 is not the place to balance. Even in SB there were hard counters that would be unbalanced at that scale  (trying to jump a deflar, with a rogues for example).

Also... like vect said, massive new content dump. Stuffs going to be unbalanced.  Not like this is myrms one shotting people with instacast abilities like the good old days.

Edited by angelmar

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Pretty sure when we signed up for the alpha and beta we were asked to give input.  Kraken gave input. 

Now why he's talking a big ole pile of socks about my class is another story i'll have to kick his butt for.

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I would like to agree to one of Clockworks superficial statements: Don't let critical feedback cause you to not give critical feedback anymore. And also don't take it personal. If you criticize (as constructive as it may be) it's very likely that others will answer with critique themself. And if only in order to balance. Thats normal. Be aware that voicing an opinion against a criticism doesn't necessarily mean that one really believes that the opposite would be best. Just stay with your point if you believe in it. Reflect yourself, but stand for what you believe and share it with others - as long as you are not extraordinarily obtrusive, though. ;) 

Every Feedback is important. In the end what counts is that we give it and that ACE will take it. They will build their own opinion and all we can do is trying to help to make the game as good as possible for as many people as possible. You've done your part. The rest of this discussion is, well, 'part of the game' ... soddasay. ;)

(Btw: Personally I don't think that the centaur is overpowered. Practice doesn't provide prove. If so, i think, there would be a lot more of Centaurs in the worlds. And thats not the case. But thats just my (current) point of view.)

Edited by Kraahk

2W1ZHpA.jpg

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Ugh guys whats up with this hostility out of nowhere? I wont re-read the thread but i am pretty sure nobody shot down OP because of his post.

Saying "it is pre-apha" is a pretty solid reason. Not a helpful reply but right none the less. In the phase we are right now balance is secondary.

Continue giving feedback but remember that those probably wont be read until later in developtment.

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I don't mind if you have feedback about the state of a class, or a power, or a discipline. They create weekly threads for just this type of feedback.

What I'm ridiculing is that this type of feedback (Specifically the issues he cited) deserves some sort of special "open letter to the developer". I have no idea what warrants it, nor why an open letter was drafted _by him_ (someone with a whole 27 posts to his name). 

Nothing is so critically important in his message that it deserved its own thread, outside of the normal forum threads of feedback given during tests. THAT is the only issue I take with this thread. His comments are nutty though; demanding balance passes this early on. Seriously still missing 2 classes, and 2 completely revised ones (lego>cleric, stalker+ranger merge). Until those are done, and the disciplines arent a buggy mess of mostly not-working, balance is irrelevant. Anyone who thinks "because pre-alpha" is a cop out, is really misunderstanding the scope of what happens during a pre-alpha.

Hint, it's not balancing.

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3 hours ago, Clockwork Orange said:

Ignore these people. I used to comment on these forums, now I basically just check news updates. We used to only have to deal with one forum troll who loved to tell us how we were wrong "because future mechanics will change everything so you should say nothing right now". His name is Vikingnail and he still trolls this forum.

Keep challenging things you don't like about the game, it will make for a better game. Also, make sure you put down Vikingnail every chance you can. For some reason he believes he is gods gift to gamers and shares his insightful wisdom with us simpletons whenever he has the chance.

 

Those that focus too much on balance in pre-alpha and do not consider how things will play out in the future may not be able to project ACE's intent with certain design decisions because of it. 

They are building a game with long term goals in mind, to try and judge something based on its pre-alpha state without considering what the desired end state is, is going to lead to inaccuracies.

If I recall many of your complaints revolved around the knight class, if I also recall I said those complaints were premature and you weren't considering how things play out with fixed-point objectives. 

Edited by VIKINGNAIL

Skeggold, Skalmold, Skildir ro Klofnir

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15 hours ago, yoink said:

I know what you mean. There are certain classes that are just basically unkillable. The fessor, druid, and to some extent the lego can just choose not to die in open field PvP if they chose to just run away. But this really only matters for small scale, non poi combat, so it really might not matter. But center the PvP around a stationary poi and it should be different, I think. Also, give time for builds to readjust with all these new disc.

I think once battles get larger in scale you might have a kill group with disciplines that focus on slowing down a target to finish them off.


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15 hours ago, scree said:

I don't mind if you have feedback about the state of a class, or a power, or a discipline. They create weekly threads for just this type of feedback.

What I'm ridiculing is that this type of feedback (Specifically the issues he cited) deserves some sort of special "open letter to the developer". I have no idea what warrants it, nor why an open letter was drafted _by him_ (someone with a whole 27 posts to his name). 

Nothing is so critically important in his message that it deserved its own thread, outside of the normal forum threads of feedback given during tests. THAT is the only issue I take with this thread. His comments are nutty though; demanding balance passes this early on. Seriously still missing 2 classes, and 2 completely revised ones (lego>cleric, stalker+ranger merge). Until those are done, and the disciplines arent a buggy mess of mostly not-working, balance is irrelevant. Anyone who thinks "because pre-alpha" is a cop out, is really misunderstanding the scope of what happens during a pre-alpha.

Hint, it's not balancing.

This especially.. Op has 27 posts currently. He is telling others to help give feed back, when he hardly does it himself. That alone makes this thread harder to take serious. Well, that and pre alpha...

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