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Hasil

"Catch-Up" Skill Leveling for Players Who Start After Release?

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I was going to post a suggestion but wanted to ask the community first.  Has there been any discussion -- actually I'm pretty sure there has been -- of how new players will catch up to people who have been playing since release, in terms of skills, since skills level over time?

I was thinking that after a certain point, people who start the game should maybe level up their skills faster for a period of time in order to catch up?  Otherwise, catching up for players that start after release will be harder than in other games, where you can invest time to try to catch up.  This could act as a real disincentive for players joining after release.

Edited by Hasil

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9 hours ago, Tark said:

This has already been discussed multiple times. Its an issue that will be addressed later down the road.

Future Todd, and Blair problem as they put it.

If it turns out to be a problem soon after release, I figure they will move the status of "future" to something more imminent.

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4 minutes ago, BarriaKarl said:

I believe diminishing returns in skill training will minimize the problem. Even though veterans will be ahead of noobs (as they should) we wont see them one shotting new players based on stats difference.

Depends on what you care about as a player.

For players that are more interested in crafting and not fighting, "one-shotting" really doesn't mean much.  Having to invest a year before being able to contribute meaningfully to your chosen profession does.

Edited by KrakkenSmacken

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Character skill caps are based on the vessel. It doesn't matter how good your crow is, if your vessel lacks. The advantage of a veteran players is they'll be at vessel cap no matter what vessel chosen. 

Veteran players will have depth and versatility, while new players will only be at cap for one or two vessels types. 


Kickstarter Backer #1070

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12 minutes ago, KrakkenSmacken said:

Depends on what you care about as a player.

For players that are more interested in crafting and not fighting, "one-shotting" really doesn't mean much.  Having to invest a year before being able to contribute meaningfully to your chosen profession does.

Well, diminishing returns could probably adress that too but the skill tree is just not good. There is a lot of issues about how long it takes to start seeing results when talking about gathering and crafting. There is also the fact that crafting as we see right now wont be in game so we shall wait and see...

Waiting anxiously for the skill tree revamp they promised.

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1 minute ago, Pleonast said:

Character skill caps are based on the vessel. It doesn't matter how good your crow is, if your vessel lacks. The advantage of a veteran players is they'll be at vessel cap no matter what vessel chosen. 

Veteran players will have depth and versatility, while new players will only be at cap for one or two vessels types. 

You sure that's still a thing?

I'm not, because that just seems like double dipping on the importance of a vessel.  You NEED it for the parts buffs, AND you NEED to use skill training.  

That just seems like too much power and effectiveness dependency on the Vessel system.

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1 minute ago, KrakkenSmacken said:

You sure that's still a thing?

I'm not, because that just seems like double dipping on the importance of a vessel.  You NEED it for the parts buffs, AND you NEED to use skill training.  

That just seems like too much power and effectiveness dependency on the Vessel system.

Not certain. But it fits with their paradigm of pvp and crafting. Those high-cap vessels will require rare resources from the Dregs and very skilled crafters. 


Kickstarter Backer #1070

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59 minutes ago, dolmar said:

You know the skill tree is messed up when in leadership the first  training gives you range for the buff and nothing in the buff lol. " I got great range on this nothing buff I give you bro!"

No doubt.  Why even have a base range where it is at when the first thing you MUST train is an increase of it, making the trained range the de facto real range anyway.

That makes it literally just an empty time sink.

Edited by KrakkenSmacken

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3 hours ago, dolmar said:

You know the skill tree is messed up when in leadership the first  training gives you range for the buff and nothing in the buff lol. " I got great range on this nothing buff I give you bro!"

Have you tested to see if it works with Bard buffs or any other skill that gives the whole group a buff?

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7 hours ago, KrakkenSmacken said:

You sure that's still a thing?

I'm not, because that just seems like double dipping on the importance of a vessel.  You NEED it for the parts buffs, AND you NEED to use skill training.  

That just seems like too much power and effectiveness dependency on the Vessel system.

Reason #... many... C&V is not great.   

ACE has, perhaps, been overly dependent on crafting to create social interdependence/interaction (and has even recognized that this is a potential problem).  That being said, ACE will address vessel concerns at some point.  When they do, it is my hope that they focus their efforts balancing out the (probable) over dependence on crafting starting with the vessels system.   


The Artist Formerly Known as Regulus

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Holy crap, a calm and rational discussion about potential future issues! Sure would be a shame if someone...deris dragged away violently

For serious, though. Non-sarcastic clapping behind my monitor. Usually any mention of catch-up mechanics or lack thereof devolves immediately into a pointless flame war. This thread gives me hope that maybe we can adult our way through to launch day without burning the gripe to the ground.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Software_release_life_cycle#Pre-alpha <--this is where we are. If your complaint is that the game don't not works good, come back later.

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13 hours ago, Kyranleskil said:

Have you tested to see if it works with Bard buffs or any other skill that gives the whole group a buff?

No, but I think the point still stands.  

If you train a skill, but need a specific discipline to use it, it seems off to me. I don't know of any other discipline that works this way, where the skill is only useful if you train something further up the skill tree, or have a very specific discipline equipped.

It still seems like a nearly pointless time sink.

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it should be switched out with something further down the line imo.

Leadership skill is fairly meh atm.

The crit damage increase is not bad but you have to have been training for 34 days "in the leadership tree" in order to get to start training crit damage.

The 5 months of training in the other trees to get to the leadership tree not counting.

Yes it will effect 5 people and give them a solid 25 support power and 25 attack power which will give a grand 1 point more to your average damage and heals. after 6 months of training.

But, I did get them to confirm that they are going to look at it in one of the live streams. Their statement was they did not want to make it to powerful. But, Someone that sacrifices a year training in the general tree and a passive and only works in a group... Well imo it should be pretty good return for that investment. Considering it will take around 3 years to get the leadership tree fully completed. That's a lot of dedication to a group..

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If there are roles for newbies to play quickly, and competes or plays with veteran roles then there won't really be a need for catching up. Overall the trees are simply vertical progression, exactly like leveling up. An overhaul is planned, what exactly will change is unknown.

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1 hour ago, KrakkenSmacken said:

No, but I think the point still stands.  

If you train a skill, but need a specific discipline to use it, it seems off to me. I don't know of any other discipline that works this way, where the skill is only useful if you train something further up the skill tree, or have a very specific discipline equipped.

It still seems like a nearly pointless time sink.

Well they did say you could gimp your guy if you train him wrong. If your role is not going to be a buff support of some kind it's not going to be a good skill line to go down in the first place. IF disc power that give you group buffs do not work with that skill then HELL yes it is a waste.....at this point I am just going to say it's a placeholder with in an Alpha testing that will be worked on at a later date.

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1 minute ago, Kyranleskil said:

Well they did say you could gimp your guy if you train him wrong. If your role is not going to be a buff support of some kind it's not going to be a good skill line to go down in the first place. IF disc power that give you group buffs do not work with that skill then HELL yes it is a waste.....at this point I am just going to say it's a placeholder with in an Alpha testing that will be worked on at a later date.

Of course we know it's going to be worked on. So now is the time to point out these inconsistencies to bring them to their attention. 

It's called feedback.

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4 minutes ago, KrakkenSmacken said:

Of course we know it's going to be worked on. So now is the time to point out these inconsistencies to bring them to their attention. 

It's called feedback.

Sorry...it sounds like you have been giving alot of feedback.....and not getting any answers. I understand were you are coming from. I was just saying it would nice if group buff powers could be effected by the leadership skill.

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