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Scree

Choices No Longer Have Consequences

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Just now, pang said:

Time since launch should be the smallest factor in determining combat effectiveness. Player skill, how they build their class, how they prepare etc should be the driving factors. 

Just seems arbitrary that when you start playing the game should have any significant effect on how you play. 

sorry pang my message should have said, "willing to bet its NOT always". I'll edit that

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41 minutes ago, Jah said:

Seems a bit of an over-reaction.

This.

Edit: There is a simple solution for the Tome problem, I said it a few times during the stream. Just don't allow people to be trained more than how long the game has been live. If that's added there can't be any abuse and the system still works as a catch up mechanic.

Edited by BDr

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1 minute ago, chodie said:

The premise of your complaint is inherently flawed, scree; choices do have consequences as any time spent going down the wrong path is time you'll never get back, regardless of how many tomes you pump in to it, time lost is never regained...so choose wisely. 

Those choices/consequences are diminished significantly though. There is still a price to pay for choosing a bad path, but now you can correct that error much more quickly, if not completely. If you have the resources, diminishing returns be damned, you can not only correct the error but completely overcome it.

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25 minutes ago, scree said:

I'd be fine with this system if they had imposed a restriction; that as the game ages a timer goes up with it. The max effective threshhold. 

I think this is needed so the tomes are strictly a catch up mechanic and NOT a way to power level. 

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Is there a full write up on all of this yet for someone who didn't watch the stream?

The one thing I'm getting is that now everyone can train 1 crafting profession, 1 race, and 1 class tree at a time... and VIP can do 2 of each?

This is a massive disappointment. Pure crafters is like... 70% of the reason I backed this game on Kickstarter, and definitely the reason I jumped in for so much money. Everyone being able to do both crafting and combat makes me really sad.

And VIP is just a straight up power boost now? 

EDIT: Just looked at Tinnis' link and I may have misunderstood partly. "Profession" is the old "general" training? So you still need to choose between combat/crafter? That's fine then.

Edited by Svenn

Guild Leader of Seeds of War

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15 minutes ago, Caenth said:

I predict people will now reach the end of a skill tree line a lot faster than Todd anticipated before.

That's not too bad, considering some skill lines take an obscene amount of time as it is.

Quote

Those choices/consequences are diminished significantly though. There is still a price to pay for choosing a bad path, but now you can correct that error much more quickly, if not completely. If you have the resources, diminishing returns be damned, you can not only correct the error but completely overcome it.

I still haven't heard a convincing argument as to why this is a bad thing (unless, you're advocating FOR it). The game doesn't offer alternative character slots; having everyone locked into one thing was madness. Being able to course correct is a good, but I do think there should be some caveats.

Wait a minute. I thought this game was supposed to be based on skill and not who has the most free time and money, with skills and gear having a minor affect.

Define, "skill".

Edited by Helix

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3 minutes ago, blazzen said:

I think this is needed so the tomes are strictly a catch up mechanic and NOT a way to power level. 

I tackled this in a different thread while scree was posting this.

 

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Slap in some sort of hard cap and limit the use of tomes with a global cd and then you should be fine. I didn't watch the stream yet but just because they announced something doesn't mean they implement it exactly like that. Also.... this thread. Judging by the pace I guess we'll reach a few pages for them to understand that the community is concerned. 


You get the wolves...lots of wolves...and sheep that wear armor and have developed an appetite for blood soaked grass - dubanka

Even insects smell good when roasted - a random confessor

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23 minutes ago, moneda said:

A non-VIP account will be able to create tomes worth 24 hours and a VIP account will be able to create tomes worth *72 hours.

I don't think this answers my question.

Let's say I have a VIP account. We are 3 months into live. I have 3 months worth of training in combat and 3 months worth of training in harvesting. This is the max the account can have on its own in this amount of time. Is it possible for me to buy tomes and use them on a crafting profession, thus giving me more training than possible with just a vip account?

Edited by Yoink

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4 minutes ago, Svenn said:

Is there a full write up on all of this yet for someone who didn't watch the stream?

The one thing I'm getting is that now everyone can train 1 crafting profession, 1 race, and 1 class tree at a time... and VIP can do 2 of each?

This is a massive disappointment. Pure crafters is like... 70% of the reason I backed this game on Kickstarter, and definitely the reason I jumped in for so much money. Everyone being able to do both crafting and combat makes me really sad.

And VIP is just a straight up power boost now? 

EDIT: Just looked at Tinnis' link and I may have misunderstood partly. "Profession" is the old "general" training? So you still need to choose between combat/crafter? That's fine then.

You can still specialize in Crafting as you advance through the tree to training 2 different crafting trees at once.

edit:

Not 2 nodes in the same tree, but as an example lets say after Basic Crafting, it unlocks 5 new trees Armor, Weapons, Vessels, Socks, Jets. Now you could train both Armor and Weapons.

Edited by Verot

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3 minutes ago, Yoink said:

I don't think this answers my question.

Let's say I have a VIP account. We are 3 months into live. I have 3 months worth of training in combat and 3 months worth of training in harvesting. This is the max the account can have on its own in this amount of time. Is it possible for me to buy tomes and use them on a crafting profession, thus giving me more training than possible with just a vip account?

As far as I can tell, yes, you could do that. 

I think there needs to be a cap that grows with the game post launch so that tomes are ONLY for catch up, NOT for power leveling. 

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1 minute ago, Yoink said:

Is it possible for me to buy tomes and use them on a crafting profession, thus giving me more training than possible with just a vip account?

Yes. You could buy a 72 hour tome for Basic Crafting or whatever the preliminary skill is and use it to fill that first T1/3-day skill. Every subsequent tome for that tree will suffer diminishing returns.


Hi, I'm moneda.

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5 minutes ago, Verot said:

You can still specialize in Crafting as you advance through the tree to training 2 different crafting trees at once.

Yet, you can now also train combat and crafting at the same time. Removing a huge chunk of specialization.

9 minutes ago, Svenn said:

This is a massive disappointment. Pure crafters is like... 70% of the reason I backed this game on Kickstarter, and definitely the reason I jumped in for so much money. Everyone being able to do both crafting and combat makes me really sad.

I hear you through the waterfall made of my tears.

Edited by Caenth

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THE most active European Crowfall community. Join us now!

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Just now, Caenth said:

Yet, you can now also train combat and crafting at the same time. Removing off a huge chunk of specialization.

I hear you through the waterfall made of my tears.

The only difference is the time it takes. Hybrid is hybrid.

Lets say under the old system it took 2 years to reach equal levels in both Crafting and Combat. Now it will take you 1 year. However the player that trains Crafting/Crafting is still a year ahead in crafting compared to the player who trained Crafting/Combat.

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Is the sky falling? No.

Did JTC destroy Crowfall? No.

Does the tomb mechanic need a bit of tweaking? Likely.

Is the concept of a catch-up mechanic good for Crowfall (with a passive skill system copied from EVE)? Yes. See EVE skill injectors.

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