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PsychoBob

Ability trees are overused

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I think that ability trees (where secondary and tertiary abilities are only usable after the first ability has been triggered) are way overused in Crowfall to the point of being detrimental to the combat/abilities system. 

 

I don't see the need for every ability that I have to have 2-4 followup abilities, especially when they seem to often be very similar to the primary ability. 

 

Specifically, I don't like throwing UI infront of the player and then having them try to read, is it E, is it Q, is it 2? What is the point of having players memorize these arbitrary key-combos just to get to the ability they want to cast. Simplify for the sake of the player and for the sake of balance!

 

And I don't see the gameplay value in burying niche abilities under other abilities. The abilities should simply be placed on their own timer (which can be balanced better anyways), on their own hotbar slot (we need more slots anyways) and let the player decide when to trigger it. Give the players FREEDOM to use abilities without spamming other abilities

 

Take the champion's Leap for example. I press it once to leap forward and do some damage. That's a great ability. However, now I have 1 second (of UI on my screen) to press it again to leap forward and do some slightly different amount of damage. What is the purpose of this system? The ability would be much more user friendly if the following changes were made:

1) the second leap should do the identical amount of damage/leap etc.

2) it should use the "charges" mechanic instead (where they can leap twice, but at their own pace).

3) don't throw UI on my screen

 

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This is kind of a key concept to the Crowfall combat.

One of the biggest reasons it exists, and is good for the game, is that it allows counter-play based on what you see in the game.  By playing, you quickly learn the animations of certain skills.  That way, when you see someone start the skill chain for their stun, you are able to react and avoid it.  That is not true of other games, so it is a unique feature that brings a lot of skill based game-play.

I understand the slight learning curve associated with it.  But it is not really intended that you read and make decisions based on those UI pop-ups.  Instead you should have memorized that Disarming Shout is 3-3 and that Rend is 3-E (Champion combo).  It really isn't that much to remember and it becomes second nature before you know it.  Additionally, you will be able to change these key-binds in the future to better suit your play-style.

As far as the UI goes, there is a LOT of work to be done on the UI and there may even be addons or customization features in the future as well.  So I wouldn't worry about that.

Given the low number of skills you have at one time compared to a traditional MMO, I really do not think the "memorization" burden is higher.  This system promotes skillful play and reduces the ever present "instant cast, un-counter-able CC" that exists in MMO's these days.  Keep playing, you will get used to it.

Edited by Kirchhoff

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1 minute ago, Kirchhoff said:

This is kind of a key concept to the Crowfall combat.

One of the biggest reasons it exists, and is good for the game, is that it allows counter-play based on what you see in the game.  By playing, you quickly learn the animations of certain skills.  That way, when you see someone start the skill chain for their stun, you are able to react and avoid it.  That is not true of other games, so it is a unique feature that brings a lot of skill based game-play.

I understand the slight learning curve associated with it.  But it is not really intended that you read and make decisions based on those UI pop-ups.  Instead you should have memorized that Disarming Shout is 3-3 and that Rend is 3-E (Champion combo).  It really isn't that much to remember and it becomes second nature before you know it.  Additionally, you will be able to change these key-binds in better suit your play-style.

As far as the UI goes, there is a LOT of work to be done on the UI and there may even be addons or customization features in the future as well.  So I wouldn't worry about that.

Given the low number of skills you have at one time compared to a traditional MMO, I really do not think the "memorization" burden is higher.  This system promotes skillful play and reduces the ever present "instant cast, un-counter-able CC" that exists in MMO's these days.  Keep playing, you will get used to it.

I think you've made some good points, but I don't think any of them address the main issue: that the system is overused. 

 

In your example, you have to build up to a stun - that makes sense, and I can see the value of the system for that powerful of an ability. However, this system is used on nearly every ability even when it just means you get to leap a second time. 

 

The best things in life are used in moderation, and this system is not. 

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15 minutes ago, PsychoBob said:

I think you've made some good points, but I don't think any of them address the main issue: that the system is overused. 

 

In your example, you have to build up to a stun - that makes sense, and I can see the value of the system for that powerful of an ability. However, this system is used on nearly every ability even when it just means you get to leap a second time. 

 

The best things in life are used in moderation, and this system is not. 

I agree it may be overused a bit in some cases.  There are absolutely some classes that have more combos and more complicated ones (Knight and Confessor come to mind).  The Champion combos are actually pretty straight forward and simple.

As far as the leap skill goes, I agree that "combo" is lacking.  I would prefer they have it be one leap and then combo into some other skill(s), such as a stun/slow/something interesting.  Beyond that, I would love for the leap to be ground targeted.

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