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xaero

Its Possible That This Game Will Not Be Niche!

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Think about this:  Players are tired of that "elephant in the room" clones.  How can we prove this?  Look at the full loot FPS style games out there right now that many of us consider junk because there is nothing else to play.  The kickstarter funded, pre-release beta-alpha, and modded games out there may have more active players than the "elephant in the room" game now (people are flocking to them in droves!).  

 

This niche market is quickly becoming not so niche and it is making developers millionaires overnight (see above).  The worst thing AC could do is underestimate the potential of their game.  Crowfall may become the new "mainstream" game if AC can handle it. 

 

Really, It all starts at the first ability to order the game.  If AC shows they can handle +800,000 players trying to preorder at the same time then they may succeed finally at dethroning that elephant in the room game.  That was the "release" market size just 7 or so years ago for PVP MMO's (numbers pulled from a PVP  MMO that had 80% of its playerbase on the hardcore PVP servers).  Not even the "elephant in the room" did that at its launch.

 

Think of how many more people are out there waiting now.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Think about this:  Players are tired of that "elephant in the room" clones.  How can we prove this?  Look at the full loot FPS style games out there right now that many of us consider junk because there is nothing else to play.  The kickstarter funded, pre-release beta-alpha, and modded games out there may have more active players than the "elephant in the room" game now (people are flocking to them in droves!).  

 

This niche market is quickly becoming not so niche and it is making developers millionaires overnight (see above).  The worst thing AC could do is underestimate the potential of their game.  Crowfall may become the new "mainstream" game if AC can handle it. 

 

Really, It all starts at the first ability to order the game.  If AC shows they can handle +800,000 players trying to preorder at the same time then they may succeed finally at dethroning that elephant in the room game.  That was the "release" market size just 7 or so years ago for PVP MMO's (numbers pulled from a PVP  MMO that had 80% of its playerbase on the hardcore PVP servers).  Not even the "elephant in the room" did that at its launch.

 

Think of how many more people are out there waiting now.

If you're talking about WoW, you are forgetting that WoW carved out a mainstream market for MMOs... It launched to gigantic numbers for the time and then kept growing and growing.  You can find out more about it on the WoW documentary that blizzard released at blizzcon. 

 

I don't know of any PvP mmo that launched 7 or so years ago to 800,000 players.  I guess maybe aion could have but most haven't seen anywhere near that number. 

 

This game will be niche, there are a multitude of reasons it won't be mainstream, but the main one is because mmorpg players on average do not prefer pvp over pve. 

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A good game is a good game, most MMOs have been designed around cheap systems and bad publishing over the years ruining the whole genre, I think if they make a quality product, it will have a lot of appeal, even if it is different.

 

I don't think there's anything niche about the design except the PvP emphasis. If they make that part of it fun and accessible, than it should have a pretty broad audience :)


a52d4a0d-044f-44ff-8a10-ccc31bfa2d87.jpg          Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes... Than if they're upset, they'll be a mile away, and barefoot :P

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If you're talking about WoW, you are forgetting that WoW carved out a mainstream market for MMOs... It launched to gigantic numbers for the time and then kept growing and growing.  You can find out more about it on the WoW documentary that blizzard released at blizzcon. 

 

I don't know of any PvP mmo that launched 7 or so years ago to 800,000 players.  I guess maybe aion could have but most haven't seen anywhere near that number. 

 

This game will be niche, there are a multitude of reasons it won't be mainstream, but the main one is because mmorpg players on average do not prefer pvp over pve. 

 

I think Crowfall could also appeal to target markets such as players that enjoy games like Travian or Evony. There's a HUGE playerbase over there that isn't being considered in conventional MMO games.

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Niche isn't so much about how many people play a game but instead how it's made.

 

A niche game has specific target goals that are known to focus the audience the game will appeal to. Games that aren't built as niche games try to add features to appeal to as many groups as possible. Non-niche games lack focus and this often leads to features that aren't well resolved.

 

Eve is a niche game and it has one of the larger MMO playerbases.

Edited by Django

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If you're talking about WoW, you are forgetting that WoW carved out a mainstream market for MMOs... It launched to gigantic numbers for the time and then kept growing and growing.

 

I think hes talking about the "WoW mindset", not that game specifically.

 

And it did, just as you say.

 

Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, that's why there are so many "elephants".

 

*EDIT* Hi Xaero  o/

Edited by getz

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If you're talking about WoW, you are forgetting that WoW carved out a mainstream market for MMOs... It launched to gigantic numbers for the time and then kept growing and growing.  You can find out more about it on the WoW documentary that blizzard released at blizzcon. 

 

I don't know of any PvP mmo that launched 7 or so years ago to 800,000 players.  I guess maybe aion could have but most haven't seen anywhere near that number. 

 

This game will be niche, there are a multitude of reasons it won't be mainstream, but the main one is because mmorpg players on average do not prefer pvp over pve. 

Aion was freaking amazing. Loved that game until F2P launched. Ah wells. 

 

As for WoW. It just got really really lucky. PCs were more widely available (cheaper) for everyone now, broadband was also more available for consumers, it just hit at the perfect moment and it snowballed, they didn't let up.

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I think these guys are on the right track.  How about Wiz 101?  That was a game aimed at kids. Niche, right?  But I bet there are a ton of adults playing it.

I played it for a while because my youngest grandson wanted me to play with him.  A lot of the people I talked to in game were also adult.

Just because a game has a target doesnt mean it will hit its mark.  People dont like to be put in categories.

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Do you think AC can raise enough money over crowdfunding so they dont have to sell their rights to some publishers?

Coz if (when) they do they will lose a large portion of their vision for the game and the publishers will twist the damn game to appeal to basicly everyone :P

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If you're talking about WoW, you are forgetting that WoW carved out a mainstream market for MMOs... It launched to gigantic numbers for the time and then kept growing and growing.  You can find out more about it on the WoW documentary that blizzard released at blizzcon. 

 

I don't know of any PvP mmo that launched 7 or so years ago to 800,000 players.  I guess maybe aion could have but most haven't seen anywhere near that number. 

 

This game will be niche, there are a multitude of reasons it won't be mainstream, but the main one is because mmorpg players on average do not prefer pvp over pve. 

 

Niche is relative I guess, but I think if they do it right it could get a very substantial following. Not dethroning WoW but still over a million perhaps.

 

I also want to relay my satisfaction in you deciding to replying to quotes in a proper manner.


Member of The BlackHand Order

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Everything I expect from Crowfall is a game that combines:

Ultima Online amazing map and the fun during PvP;

How RuneScape's combat and non-combat skills worked, the early times of the Grand Exchange and amazing quests;

The real PvP between races/factions/whatever introduced by WoW;

Something totally different like Silkroad's "professions" that, in that case, had a so called Triangular Conflict; and

A game that is not pay to win. It's a one time purchase and, after that, you can only spend money to make your character more beautiful, cosmetic stuff.

 

If Crowfall has a little bit of all of this, I'm willing to pay $60+ as I did with Guild Wars 2, but I can't take monthly fees/membership anymore. F2P is bad, P2P is also bad, one time purchase with cosmetic in-game is the best, IMO.

 

 

And, finally, something that's a bit controversial: some way to play the game in a semi-AFK mode where you can check your character every 10 minutes or so while crafting, mining, woodchopping or something like that. Maybe it's just me but I would absolutely LOVE to be able to "play" the game while I'm at work or college and really play the game on my free time. Yeah, I'm talking about bots, but I can live without them, as long as the previous topics could exist.

 

Sorry for the long post, much love.

 

BaSkA

Edited by BaSkA

“War is mass murder, conscription is slavery and taxation is robbery.” ― Murray N. Rothbard
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They've already said this game will not be for everyone. But with many diffrent server rules they can appeal to quite a few players. Some will play long campaigns that may go on for years, others will find 1-week fast games more enjoyable. Hell, if the system is good and the game is succesful, they could even add a server that focuses on PvE(although that would be something further down the line)

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Niche is relative I guess, but I think if they do it right it could get a very substantial following. Not dethroning WoW but still over a million perhaps.

 

I also want to relay my satisfaction in you deciding to replying to quotes in a proper manner.

 

You're very welcome.

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Niche is relative I guess, but I think if they do it right it could get a very substantial following. Not dethroning WoW but still over a million perhaps.

 

I also want to relay my satisfaction in you deciding to replying to quotes in a proper manner.

 

You're very welcome.

 

Lel! I knew it was just a fluke.


Member of The BlackHand Order

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Going by the definition of Niche: a distinct segment of a market or a specialized market, not sure how all games don't fall under the umbrella.

 

Seems we use the term in gaming to imply small numbers and or something unlike WoW or blockbuster games (themeparks mostly) that go after "everyone".

 

If you really break it down though, all games are niche. WoW with its millions of fans is geared toward a distinct segment(s) of the market. It doesn't really cater to a good number of gamers or at least not for specific reasons/features that we might want. If so, games like CF probably wouldn't have a reason to exist, nor would we see FPS, MOBA, RTS, etc existing.

 

This game will be niche, regardless of how we might define the overused buzzword. Could it have a larger then expected fan base? For sure if they execute it well. The more the merrier, but beyond more profits, no game really needs millions upon millions of fans to be successful. Doesn't really matter if WoW has 50 servers or 500, each is pretty much the same. All though, depending on how the worlds/servers/campaigns turn out for CF, more players might result in more options and variety. 50k fans or 2 million could be a actual game changer for everyone.

 

So far they seem to be walking the line well to get folks that might have not tried something like this in the past as it was too "hardcore" or whatever, without having to go down the "this game is for everyone" design. Gamers like to compete, yet like a start/finish and some form of control. Hence why MOBAs/FPS/RTS/CCG and even instanced based eSport PVP in themepark games is so popular. Trying to incorporate some of these elements into a traditionally "hardcore" PVP game is pretty smart. Just enough to give people a reason to take a second look. I hope we see a good turn out, but if day 1 doesn't bring it 10 million, I won't be worried.

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Most pvp based games fail. Its the way of the road.  Pvp games tend to be full of alpha males. Alphas need betas to beat on, without betas they move on.

 

 

Way of the Road.

What.


#CrowFallBata


~Sweet Sensations~


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Most pvp based games fail. Its the way of the road.  Pvp games tend to be full of alpha males. Alphas need betas to beat on, without betas they move on.

 

 

Way of the Road.

 

What we need is a marketing campaign targetted at communities made up primarily of alpha males. Can you suggest any?


 

 

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Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, that's why there are so many "elephants".

 

*EDIT* Hi Xaero  o/

 Has more to do with greed and numbers than imitation and flatery

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With Crowfalls server structure they may hit quite a few "niche" markets in one game.  The PVP crowd is bigger than people realize.  Of that other mystery game from 7 years ago: 80% of 800k players is 640k that knew they could be killed anytime, anywhere.

 

More people are now exposed to "open combat" and "full loot" style games than ever before.  As I stated before that number of people may be more than WoW's active numbers.  That is impressive and that pushes that style of game into the mainstream realm.  The only reason it isn't is because most are either "niche" MMO's or could be not considered MMO's.

 

Also, didn't WoW take years to hit 1 million players?  Then they launched it in China.  That and their advertising campaign skyrocketed their playerbase.  I don't think they ever went past 3 million in North America.  A few other games have almost touched that number at the very least.  Imagine what would happen if Crowfall had a superbowl Ad next year.  That would only happen with a clean launch of the game.  That is something hard to do with any MMO but I want to see this game be successful instead of going to the bug zapper like my other favorite games.

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