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ACE_JackalBark

More on Crowns & Guilds - Official Discussion Thread

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10 minutes ago, YouTubejasonwivart said:

You just didn’t understand his above statement. Let me simplyfy it for you. They screwed up with KS  /2016 packages that offered guild reservation/creation.  If they were to make everything free now they would need to do a massive grant to all those backers that purchased it. Instead they are keeping the price they assigned $40 it but are giving away free money with every member added to the guild($10 crowns earliest) ... so essentially it is free after 4 members join your guild.

A massive grant? You mean like, opening up guild registration to the public? sort of like how name reservation was promised at Kickstarter, but instead sort of just happened without much fanfare? They massively granted name reservation to anyone who made a free Crowfall account. That didn't seem to bother you then. Why now?

Edited by Scree
emphasis placed on "free"

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1 minute ago, Gummiel said:

I am sure they could come up with a proper replacement for those backers, just like with the character slots they had promised before, they went to the crow/vessel system

They could have but it would have been a lot more work especially considering name reservation already happened and I am sure some older backer that have purchased it have not even used it yet which the main problem would lie IMO. Say you have a KS who for whatever reason that owns /purchased guild reservation and has not used it yet and wanted to sometime in 2018 ... but come to find their names are all taken and everyone was given a free pass to make a guild and name it... that person would be disgruntled even if they are given $50 in wallet credits... they bought something 3-4 years ago and now was told oh we’re givinv it away for free now and your name has already been taken by someone that didn’t purchase it. 

 

Yes, i I understand they did have 1st dibs on names this year already but maybe their over seas/military or had a medical hardship that prevented this etc. stuff happens


Check out my youtube channel for testing gameplay https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCp-AgZ6mHOVObusemDVEXoA

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1 minute ago, Scree said:

A massive grant? You mean like, opening up guild registration to the public? sort of like how name reservation was promised at Kickstarter, but instead sort of just happened without much fanfare? They massively granted name reservation to anyone who made a free Crowfall account. That didn't seem to bother you then. Why now?

They obviously are using that as an example of why they didn’t do it this time, learning from their past mistakes.


Check out my youtube channel for testing gameplay https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCp-AgZ6mHOVObusemDVEXoA

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Just now, YouTubejasonwivart said:

They obviously are using that as an example of why they didn’t do it this time, learning from their past mistakes.

Obviously. So obviously that they didn't mention that in their reason given above by Gordon.

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On 12/13/2017 at 5:12 PM, Caenth said:

Well, you need to earn your trust as a (guild) leader. My members trust me in regard of finances. I've proven to the members they can trust me more than a few times by now. Transparency is key to gain trust. Especially where money is involved.

How exactly does a new person get the opportunity to learn what a guild leader is like before their crowns are donated to this guys guild?

You dont know what hes like before you join, after you join its too late ...he has your crowns.

I do not like this system at all, not remotely.

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3 hours ago, Toadwart said:

How exactly does a new person get the opportunity to learn what a guild leader is like before their crowns are donated to this guys guild?

You dont know what hes like before you join, after you join its too late ...he has your crowns.

I do not like this system at all, not remotely.

They don't get the crowns right away. They get the crowns at open beta/soft launch, and only if you're still in the guild at that point. So you can join now, stay a while, and then leave and they won't get anything. You could go through a dozen guilds before open beta releases, only the guild you're in at that moment gets any reward.

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4 hours ago, Avloren said:

They don't get the crowns right away. They get the crowns at open beta/soft launch, and only if you're still in the guild at that point. So you can join now, stay a while, and then leave and they won't get anything. You could go through a dozen guilds before open beta releases, only the guild you're in at that moment gets any reward.

I guess, except that i wont play this game while full loot is the only option available.

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Hello artcraft friends how have you been

I really like this promotion, it's got me really excited about guilds and crowfall and stuff but I have a fairly important terms of service / rules question and this seems like a good time to ask:

I am under the impression that scamming / stealing funds from other players in-game where mechanics allow is not against the TOS, given the nature of the "play to crush" atmosphere the game has going for it.

Does this apply to scamming / stealing of crowns out of guild wallets, or using them to purchase things for yourself without the "official" sanction of the guild? How will this be handled in cases where the guild leader /owner themselves does these actions?

 

Thanks in advance!

 

hi

 


 

 

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2 hours ago, Hi. said:

I am under the impression that scamming / stealing funds from other players in-game where mechanics allow is not against the TOS, given the nature of the "play to crush" atmosphere the game has going for it.

Does this apply to scamming / stealing of crowns out of guild wallets, or using them to purchase things for yourself without the "official" sanction of the guild? How will this be handled in cases where the guild leader /owner themselves does these actions?

In the update, FAQ 9.:

Quote

How will ACE prevent the guild leaders from embezzling the funds in the guild wallet?
The guild wallet is owned by the guild leader, and they can't embezzle what they own. To be clear: the contents of the guild wallet are considered to be owned by the guild leader. Be careful who you trust.

So to my understanding, it will not be handled at all on a support level.

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3 hours ago, Hi. said:

I am under the impression that scamming / stealing funds from other players in-game where mechanics allow is not against the TOS, given the nature of the "play to crush" atmosphere the game has going for it.

Does this apply to scamming / stealing of crowns out of guild wallets, or using them to purchase things for yourself without the "official" sanction of the guild? How will this be handled in cases where the guild leader /owner themselves does these actions?

I dont think this should be regulated by the DEVs. If you are scammed you have no one else to blame but you.

I am not the more hardcore person around but i think some people here are really too soft. I mean, you guys are hesitating about something that makes no sense. You arent supposed to be protected here. Remember this game has used EVE as a marketing source. What is EVE? That is the place where gullible people will lose even their socks if they go around believing people easily.

"OMG what if my guild leader makes a run for it after getting the money?" (or just kick a lot of people out of the guild which is what will probably happen)

First, there is no way a respectable guild would do this. Just no way. This thing would smear the guild reputation meaning losing on recruiting people and bad relationship with others guilds. All this for what? Cosmetics? Dont see it happening.

So dont join just any guild with a random post in the forums. You cant be gullible enough to fall for that, right? "Hmmm... This guild that was just made after the crows promotion, doesnt participate in any meaningful form in the game and has no reputation? Hell yes, let's join them. What can go wrong."

Bzzz! Wrong! You deserve to be cheated if you fall for that!

Second, being cheated is not thaaaat bad. It is not like you lost something. You guys are acting like the guild leader is stealing your money. That is not the case. That money was never yours so what is the problem? You can say this deal has nothing to do with you, it is about ACE compensating the guild leaders for their good job in managing a guild (measured by size in this case).

I mean, it would suck to be cheated but that is more  a case of a hurt ego then anything. You will have spend time with those guys and will not be strangers anymore by the time the promotion delivers and bam! Backstab! It is not about the money anymore.

Edited by BarriaKarl

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4 hours ago, Dhorfel said:

In the update, FAQ 9.:

So to my understanding, it will not be handled at all on a support level.

 

Oh poorly made socks how did I miss this - thanks!


 

 

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Just gotta say that I don't like the idea of monetizing guilds to begin with, but I guess that ship already sailed long ago. I know they will eventually be free, but still. This doesn't even touch on the other stuff mentioned, since I don't really understand it clearly just yet.

Edited by Mythforger

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On 12/15/2017 at 1:00 PM, Scree said:

A massive grant? You mean like, opening up guild registration to the public? sort of like how name reservation was promised at Kickstarter, but instead sort of just happened without much fanfare? They massively granted name reservation to anyone who made a free Crowfall account. That didn't seem to bother you then. Why now?

Are you sure that's correct? I only built the reservation system, I didn't actually do the rollout of the guild name reservations to players. But I know the way Gordon had described it to me was that the guild creation would be rolled out in small batches, based on the order people had purchased a guild name reservation. And I built the system to make that possible. Only after those who had paid for a reserved name had a chance to create their guilds were others supposed to be allowed to do so. 

That seems to me like it's fulfilling the promise, but maybe I'm missing something? Did the rollout not go as I just described? Can you clarify?


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3 minutes ago, EdZ said:

Are you sure that's correct? I only built the reservation system, I didn't actually do the rollout of the guild name reservations to players. But I know the way Gordon had described it to me was that the guild creation would be rolled out in small batches, based on the order people had purchased a guild name reservation. And I built the system to make that possible. Only after those who had paid for a reserved name had a chance to create their guilds were others supposed to be allowed to do so. 

That seems to me like it's fulfilling the promise, but maybe I'm missing something? Did the rollout not go as I just described? Can you clarify?

He's talking about reserved Character Names. One of the KS rewards for pledges of $100 or more was "Reserve Unique Character Name."

The decision to use our account names as our in-game names meant that reservations weren't handled in batches like the guild names were. So when he says the reservations were handed out "without much fanfare," it is because we had been reserving names all along  by making crowfall accounts, without even knowing it.


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2 hours ago, Jah said:

He's talking about reserved Character Names. One of the KS rewards for pledges of $100 or more was "Reserve Unique Character Name."

The decision to use our account names as our in-game names meant that reservations weren't handled in batches like the guild names were. So when he says the reservations were handed out "without much fanfare," it is because we had been reserving names all along  by making crowfall accounts, without even knowing it.

 

2 hours ago, EdZ said:

Are you sure that's correct? I only built the reservation system, I didn't actually do the rollout of the guild name reservations to players. But I know the way Gordon had described it to me was that the guild creation would be rolled out in small batches, based on the order people had purchased a guild name reservation. And I built the system to make that possible. Only after those who had paid for a reserved name had a chance to create their guilds were others supposed to be allowed to do so. 

That seems to me like it's fulfilling the promise, but maybe I'm missing something? Did the rollout not go as I just described? Can you clarify?

Yea, basically what Jah said is accurate. 

The promise of reserved guild names WAS fulfilled in the order of purchase. 

Claiming this is living up to your promise of the Kickstarter campaign is nonsense because you've already abandoned the name reservation system and didn't blink twice. The problem to me is that character names, originally a Kickstarter reward, are still being given away for free to everyone and yet you cited living up to Kickstarter promises as your reason for selling Guild Name Reservations.

Guild Names are locked behind a $40 paywall for the foreseeable future (until launch). I'm bothered by this. Why are character names being treated differently from guild names? It feels like a questionable decision, a money grab, to me. None of what Gordon explained previously really makes me understand why this is still considered a premium item. The original backers who got Guild Name Reservation privileges should have already claimed them by this point. Kickstarter promise lived up to. Why the need to charge $40 at this point and going forward?

I try to defend the company from pay to win haters (or those who simply see this as a cash-grab) anywhere I encounter them. This feels undefendable.

Edited by Scree

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11 hours ago, Scree said:

 

Yea, basically what Jah said is accurate. 

The promise of reserved guild names WAS fulfilled in the order of purchase. 

Claiming this is living up to your promise of the Kickstarter campaign is nonsense because you've already abandoned the name reservation system and didn't blink twice. The problem to me is that character names, originally a Kickstarter reward, are still being given away for free to everyone and yet you cited living up to Kickstarter promises as your reason for selling Guild Name Reservations.

Guild Names are locked behind a $40 paywall for the foreseeable future (until launch). I'm bothered by this. Why are character names being treated differently from guild names? It feels like a questionable decision, a money grab, to me. None of what Gordon explained previously really makes me understand why this is still considered a premium item. The original backers who got Guild Name Reservation privileges should have already claimed them by this point. Kickstarter promise lived up to. Why the need to charge $40 at this point and going forward?

I try to defend the company from pay to win haters (or those who simply see this as a cash-grab) anywhere I encounter them. This feels undefendable.

I get where you are coming from.  I was bothered by this as well.  Although, after thinking about it for some time I believe they don't want every person and their alt accounts forming a guild right now.  Seeing as how it's just a list of names and a crest on the website now It doesn't count for much.  When the time comes that guilds are in game and people want to form them, if there is a pay wall, then the cries will be real. You can expect some bad press when guilds go live and people are forced to pay to form them. I hope the ACE team gets in front of the bus, rather than going under it.


"Float like a Butterfly.... Sting like a Misplaced Decimal Point" - Xarrayne 2018

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Also worth nothing that pledge packages seem to have a 10% discount if you're in a guild when you buy them. I think they're trying to get new people to join established guilds so they learn and stick with the game instead of just letting anyone create a random guild to get the discount. 

Edited by blazzen

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I assume those kind of promotions can't be announced without complaints.
 
However, the only change with this news is that ACE is (again) giving away thousands of dollars for their backers (this time guilds and guild members) who lay their trust in this company and this game early.
 
The guild reservation + company garrison bundle exists for a long long time now. Where have the complaints been before? Right, nowhere.
This bundle is even 50% off currently. 40$/€. Besides the name reservation including the Garrison which is about the size of a manor which alone is 180 in the shop. And you get ingame credits for 10$ for each Member that is in you guild when Alpha starts, and each joining member immediately gets 10% off of it's next store purchase.
 
If you start your guild when the game launches, you pay nothing for your guild name. And you get nothing. Like in any other game, too. And ACE decided early (to be more precise: from the first days on) that they want to reward those players (and now also playere groups) who decide to back this game early.
 
So what is the problem?
 
The problem is the thought "Others may get more than I will get". This - and nothing else. But: what we get is based on our own decisions.
 
Lay your trust on ACE earlier, and you will get higher rewards. Wait until everything is cheap and save, and your reward will be the usual. Risk vs. Reward - that's the principle of Crowfall.
 
The end is near. The game is slowly arriving. With 50$/€ you can get not only the later game itself (which has a planned retail price of 50) but also immediate test access.
 
I say:
 
Take it ... or leave it. Buy the game when it is launched and you can be sure what you get "exactely". Or trust in ACE NOW, get the game AND have immediate Access to the tests right now for the same price. It's your last chanceto make a bargain. If you want to, build a guild pre-launch. Invest 40 and get those 40 back in ingame credits with only 4 members and additionally save all of them 10% of their next purchase.
 
And if you don't want to take the risk ... don't complain that you don't get the rewards.
 
ACE is doing something extremely generous here. And in my opinion it is a shame that this isn't recognized appropriately by the crowd.
 
That's my opinion.
Edited by Kraahk

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