Jump to content
Search In
  • More options...
Find results that contain...
Find results in...
Battlewrath

Class Armor Tiers, yay or nay?

Recommended Posts

Typed on my phone. 

 

Hello all so in the recent 5.5.4 Crowfall stream it was said that;

Armor class types are progressive so that Leather->Mail->Plate and that say, if your class uses leather they need to use 2 major Minor disciplines to use plate. (mail discipline, plate discipline). If your class uses mail you use 1 major Minor discipline to use plate (plate discipline) but can use leather freely. If you are a plate user class you can use Mail and Leather freely - now is this fair and the right move to make? For me the great equaliser of Crowfall was Discipline, you can make that build how you wish, but now that is not the case, for a caster to use plate they have to now use up 2 major Minor disciplines just to do this and leaves none to further there own class disciplines, where a plate user can be a battle mage all they wish with having 2 free disciplines and the use of cloth. 

 

To me, this will only push players to plate classes for major  Minor discipline slot flexibility, for me it should just be that you start with your class Armor type and then use 1 major Minor discipline to move out of this, the great equalizer. 

 

-Addition

 

Ah! So turns out that the Armor use skills come from MINOR not MAJOR Discipline runes, however that still does not change that people will go to the class with the most build options for the cheapest rune cost, ie, Plate using classes, as opposed to Leather users (2 minor disciplines to use plate.) or mail users (1 minor discipline to use Plate.) 

Edited by Battlewrath
Spelling mistake, correcting Major to MINOR.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

When i understood right, everyone has the possibility to learn this armorclass options over the skill tree. Nearly every class is very limited to use minor (not major) disciplines and giving them away for this less powerful option isnt a good think. On the other hand leather gives the highest damage bonus. Now everyone can choose for damage or damage mitigation. But you are right, the player himself should choose what he want to wear without using disciplines for it...

Edited by DeHei

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, in the begiining i thought everyone would need to use a minor to change armor types. I already think the whole class locked armor is dumb but now it got even worse. It makes no sense to have different requirements to unlock them.

In this situation the only class that get punished are leather users. We are screwed. For no good reason. We have to accept that everyone else can swap armor except us. I call BS.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I agree, armour choice should either be locked by class or open to all.

If they wish to have different armour type able to be unlocked by player choice make that choice in skill tree training not by discipline and make all classes have the same cost. with the concept of all armour stats coming from the chest cookie cutter build will be plate chest and DPS everything else.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think its a bit silly to add it to disciplines, there has got to be better way to do it. I would be fine with classes being locked to their designated armor type in the beginning as long as they had a way to unlock the other types fairly early on that didn't require the use of a discipline that like stated above, really only affects leather wearers.

Not sure I can get on board with this wasting Disciplines on gear stuff. 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Apok said:

I think its a bit silly to add it to disciplines, there has got to be better way to do it. I would be fine with classes being locked to their designated armor type in the beginning as long as they had a way to unlock the other types fairly early on that didn't require the use of a discipline that like stated above, really only affects leather wearers.

Not sure I can get on board with this wasting Disciplines on gear stuff. 

 

 

should of just done a new 'armor mastery' discipline slot like we have for weapons mastery discipline - with the choice to either enhance your base armor type - or pick a single new type [so not using a major or minor]

Edited by Tinnis

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I mean I kinda like the idea of it. I'm not sure if the implementation is the right way though. 

Tbh what this game needs is to make players make hard choices regarding their characters. Classes that are forced only to leather naturally are supposed to be DPS classes. They are supposed to do high damage with low defense. If you want to be tankier on one of those classes you should definitely need to give something up for it! Now whether it should be two minor slots...I'm not sure. BUT I like the idea. Forcing players to give up something to get something is going to be important for this game...and it's non-existent atm

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, dreaden said:

Requiring a minor disc, or two, to use other armor types is unnecessarily punishing. For example, if you want to be a tanky fessor you are already sacrificing the damage bonus from leather. That is already meaningful choice.

This right here.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, dreaden said:

Requiring a minor disc, or two, to use other armor types is unnecessarily punishing. For example, if you want to be a tanky fessor you are already sacrificing the damage bonus from leather. That is already meaningful choice.

How meaningful is it though? You're already going to have higher base damage stats as a DPS class. Forgoing an otherwise free and innate damage bonus from the armor doesn't seem like much to give up, and doesn't seem like much of a difficult choice when it comes to available slots to customize your character. Idk if that makes sense but w/e.

I think two passive slots is probably overkill, but I don't think one slot is at all punishing imo. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, Jjohnsin said:

How meaningful is it though? You're already going to have higher base damage stats as a DPS class. Forgoing an otherwise free and innate damage bonus from the armor doesn't seem like much to give up, and doesn't seem like much of a difficult choice when it comes to available slots to customize your character.

I concur.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I really don't think every class needs the option to wear every armor type. A confessor has no business wearing plate. A druid has no business wearing plate. A champion wearing plate takes away from the barbarian feel of the class.

Too many options isn't necessarily a good thing. We are getting to options overload here where you cannot possibly do a good job of balancing. This creates flavor of the month type builds. This creates useless builds, this creates useless options.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So you guys don't want to pay a minor disc to change armor type from your class kit...  but harvesting players pretty much have to burn a minor slot to have good/better results (until far into high end training).   Sound to me like what isn't good for the goose is good for the gander.  I think the minor disc loss is an adequate trade off damage for mit just like we deal with...

Edited by Frykka

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Jjohnsin said:

How meaningful is it though? You're already going to have higher base damage stats as a DPS class. Forgoing an otherwise free and innate damage bonus from the armor doesn't seem like much to give up, and doesn't seem like much of a difficult choice when it comes to available slots to customize your character. Idk if that makes sense but w/e.

I think two passive slots is probably overkill, but I don't think one slot is at all punishing imo. 

 

A confessor's role base roll is dps, taking plate is a deviation from that role. Taking one minor discipline to access plate removes access to two sources of dmg(one from leather, one from the disc) and that seems excessive to me.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, dreaden said:

A confessor's role base roll is dps, taking plate is a deviation from that role. Taking one minor discipline to access plate removes access to two sources of dmg(one from leather, one from the disc) and that seems excessive to me.

Patient:  Doc, It hurts when I do "this"
Doc:  Then don't do "That"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 minutes ago, Frykka said:

Patient:  Doc, It hurts when I do "this"
Doc:  Then don't do "That"

I'm sorry, how do this have anything to do with what we're discussing? Trading damage for mitigation is fair trade, trading 2 sources of damage for one source of mitigation is excessive imo.

1 hour ago, Frykka said:

So you guys don't want to pay a minor disc to change armor type from your class kit...  but harvesting players pretty much have to burn a minor slot to have good/better results (until far into high end training).

Combat players have to take major and minor disciplines to get better at results in killing people as well. Not sure what your point is.

Edited by dreaden

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Like I said, I don't think it should be tied to a Discipline, make it a skill you need to train or something along those line, it means you have to spend time/points on training it but doesn't take away from an already limited customization feature such as Discipline. I don't think it should just be given without consequence, I just don't agree with the Discipline method.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, dreaden said:

I'm sorry, how do this have anything to do with what we're discussing? Trading damage for mitigation is fair trade, trading 2 sources of damage for one source of mitigation is excessive imo.

Combat players have to take major and minor disciplines to get better at results in killing people as well. Not sure what you're point is.

When the base kit is leather and you move to plate rather than just to mail (one step) you are gaining 2 jumps in mitigation, correct? in trade for 2 jumps down in damage...   If you went to mail you'd lose less dmg and gain less mit.   Now if there was a training node deep in the Class tree (NOT the combat tree) that eventually let you use another armor type without the disc, that would be much more equivalent to how Harvesters have to use, not just a minor, but a major disc spot up until deep training lets you get that slot back.   It has everything to do with this conversation because again it is about the combat power curve vs ALL other players and not just vs other combat focused players.   To me that is asking to make choices not matter or having your cake and eating it too...   some builds cause limitations and are just bad choices, a plate confessor would be one; plate druid, plate cleric make much more sense as a build (base kit being mail).

We also need to see the actual new stats on the armor to evaluate the process...  will armor types still have weaknesses to certain damage types or will the get more well rounded across damage types?   will damage be 10%/5%/0%?

Edited by Frykka

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...