ACE_Jackal

Exploring the Crypt - Official Discussion Thread

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14 hours ago, KohrAh said:

Honestly I think everyone who doesn't get it yet, like yourself, just hasn't had a chance to see it really in action.  Up until this announcement it's been that your crow is the character, and vessels are just bodies that your spirit/character inhabits.

As to crafting stations, currently in the campaign worlds you need to travel to keeps that your faction owns.  The keeps are also one of the locations to gather higher level resources.

Thanks KohrAh. I definitely need to locate the keeps captured by Balance. I made it to Saul's Junction yesterday, although it was captured by Chaos I did manage to smack a few tin and marble bits nearby. As far as being able to use different vessels, more research needed from this little piggie. 

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15 hours ago, KohrAh said:

Honestly I think everyone who doesn't get it yet, like yourself, just hasn't had a chance to see it really in action.  Up until this announcement it's been that your crow is the character, and vessels are just bodies that your spirit/character inhabits.

As to crafting stations, currently in the campaign worlds you need to travel to keeps that your faction owns.  The keeps are also one of the locations to gather higher level resources.

Actually forts have advanced crafting stations as well

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On 2/10/2018 at 8:28 PM, KohrAh said:

One thing that's been running through my head is this notion of getting people more attached to their vessel by making them characters.  The positive responses to this aspect seem to come from people who didn't really get the vessel system.  Time and time again on a variety of systems the devs/designers have told us how we don't have all the pieces yet, basically that we don't get it yet.  Many times I've agreed with that response and have kept an open mind for when we do have the big picture.  This really seems like it should have been the response people who didn't quite get the vessel system should have gotten.  The Crowfall vessel system is basically the Eve Online ship system.  Anyone who has played Eve knows that the stated concern is non-issue.  Some people don't get it yet, but that's not a problem with the vessel system itself, it's just that they don't yet get it.

Oh, I get the vessel system, But I dont like it and never did.

I still remember the sickness in my stomach when I first read that they wanted to add that to the game.

I don't enjoy playing alts, I play one character and that is my intention to do here as well.

Years from now I would like to log in to the same character that I logged into the previous year and the year previous to that to continue my adventure....not some formless gas cloud or spirit crow or whatever the final avatar happens to be.

Persistent fantasy mmorpgs should have persistent characters, save the disposable vehicles for Eve.

Edited by Toadwart

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1 hour ago, Toadwart said:

Oh, I get the vessel system, But I dont like it and never did.

I still remember the sickness in my stomach when I first read that they wanted to add that to the game.

I don't enjoy playing alts, I play one character and that is my intention to do here as well.

Years from now I would like to log in to the same character that I logged into the previous year and the year previous to that to continue my adventure....not some formless gas cloud or spirit crow or whatever the final avatar happens to be.

Persistent fantasy mmorpgs should have persistent characters, save the disposable vehicles for Eve.

I think you just demonstrated that you don't get it.  Vessels were not alts.  Before this change it was a single character, your crow.  Vessels while being bodies were mere equipment, the same as armor and weapons.  You says you don't want to be a formless spirit crow, but that's always been the concept and it isn't fully going away.  You say leave the disposable vehicles for Eve but Crowfall is basically Eve made into a fantasy game with the addition of campaigns.

"Persistent fantasy mmorpgs should have persistent characters".  The crow is persistent.  Crowfall isn't persistent as the main content is campaigns.  It is by design not persistent.  Or more accurately a mix of persistence and non-persistence.  Also saying it "should" be one way is silly.  You hated the idea, but I on the other hand felt the vessel system (and how it tied into other systems) as it was before this change was the singularly best feature of Crowfall.  If you want a singular character to play for years to come (without accepting the crow as your singular character) there are dozens of MMO's that do that.  One of the things that has so many of us excited about Crowfall is that they aren't doing what everyone else is doing.

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27 minutes ago, KohrAh said:

I think you just demonstrated that you don't get it.  Vessels were not alts.  Before this change it was a single character, your crow.  Vessels while being bodies were mere equipment, the same as armor and weapons.  You says you don't want to be a formless spirit crow, but that's always been the concept and it isn't fully going away.  You say leave the disposable vehicles for Eve but Crowfall is basically Eve made into a fantasy game with the addition of campaigns.

"Persistent fantasy mmorpgs should have persistent characters".  The crow is persistent.  Crowfall isn't persistent as the main content is campaigns.  It is by design not persistent.  Or more accurately a mix of persistence and non-persistence.  Also saying it "should" be one way is silly.  You hated the idea, but I on the other hand felt the vessel system (and how it tied into other systems) as it was before this change was the singularly best feature of Crowfall.  If you want a singular character to play for years to come (without accepting the crow as your singular character) there are dozens of MMO's that do that.  One of the things that has so many of us excited about Crowfall is that they aren't doing what everyone else is doing.

Vessels are most definitely alts. What else would you call playing another class/race? Maybe you dont "get it".

The "Crow" is not your character. Can you fight with your crow? Craft  with your Crow? Harvest with your Crow?...you cant do anything with your crow except choose what alt to play next. Yes, your trained skills are tied to your crow...but you dont play the crow, you dont adventure with it. Its pretty easy to see how no one can get attached to the Crow.

And the Crow was not always part of the game. When I bought into the game in 2015 the vessel idea didnt even exist.

Crowfall is persistent. The EK's never go away...The EK is where you and your friends hang out between adventures, or other people come to pvp, its your base of operations for as long as you play the game.

The first thing you need to realize is that people that dont like the vessel system do not necessarily dislike it because they are too stupid to see its full glory as you have so much have said. I fully understand the system and i do not like it.

Edited by Toadwart

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1 minute ago, Toadwart said:

 

Vessels are most definitely alts. What else would you call playing another class/race? Maybe you dont "get it".

The "Crow" is not your character. Can you fight with your crow? Craft  with your Crow? Harvest with your Crow?...you cant do anything with your crow except choose what alt to play next. Yes, your trained skills are tied to your crow...but you dont play the crow, you dont adventure with it.

And the Crow was not always part of the game. When I bout into the game in 2015 the vessel idea didnt even exist.

Crowfall is persistent. The EK's never go away...

The first thing you need to realize is that people that dont like the vessel system do not necessarily dislike it because they are too stupid to see its full glory as you have so much have said. I fully understand the system and i do not like it.

Campaigns will be the majority of the game, they are not persistent.  The crow is not your character now, but with the vessel system before this change yes it most certainly was.  That might not have been the case in 2015 but it was most definitely the case with the vessel system before now.  That's why it made sense that your training remained the same when your crow inhabited different bodies.  Just like in the show Altered Carbon when someone transfers their consciousness to a different body it's not a different person in that other body, it is that one person jumping into a different body (or sleeve as they call it in the show).

The first thing you need to realize is that your one perspective isn't the only one.  Sure some people may simply not like the vessel system and that's all there is to it.  But there are many people who just never had a chance to experience it to fully understand it.  That's not saying they are too stupid to understand it, or are stupid in any way.  That's saying that is saying that they don't  yet have the perspective to see what it's really about.  When something is completely new and different it's quite possible to not really get it based off just an explanation.  Just like in the 90's when the internet was new and most people had heard of it but many really had not understanding of what it was.  Many of those people didn't get it at all from any way you tried to explain it, and it wasn't until they actually used it that they understood.  That wasn't because they were stupid, but because the entire concept was completely new and alien to them.

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I really don't understand the vessel system quite yet as stated before. I'm only assuming that you can select another body to inhabit and while your basic skills will transfer, you would still have to invest more skill time in training race/class the same as leveling an alt I guess. I haven't tried a new vessel yet because I fear losing all of the bits and bobs I've harvested unless the local and spirit banks are persistent across vessels. Which means any armor crafted for my duelist would also have to be stored as I don't see there being any current way to save my initial vessel. I'm not opposed to new concepts, just typically play one character which I like to add a little personality to in my adventures. I also understand that we'll be able to trade our skills through tomes of some sort.

I'm glad to be experiencing it through these early stages and only wish that I could have gotten in even sooner.

Crypts are SCARY!

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1 hour ago, Gaiawyn said:

local and spirit banks are persistent across vessels

They are, also, the basic armor fits on every vessel and even advanced armor (leather, mail, plate) fits on every race, given that the class can wear it. 

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For those of you who aren't sure what the vessel system is read below:

  • YOU ARE THE SPIRIT CROW. You are a spiritual being given immortality by the gods to inhabit bodies of fallen heroes in order to fight for said gods.
  • Necromancers dig up graves in order to claim those fallen hero...body parts and stitch them together in order to make a "Vessel" for Crows to fall into.
  • Once stitched together (This is slightly an assumption) vessels can have disadvantages/advantages applied to them by the Necromancer.
  • Then the completed vessel can be equipped (can NOT be traded/looted anymore once this is done) sold, traded, or sacrificed for XP.
  • Lets say the vessel is sold to Henry, who buys it for 5K Gold. Henry is ALSO A SPIRIT CROW, but he is inhabiting a vessel in order to interact with mortal flesh.
  • Henry then equips that vessel, cause its a badass vessel for scouting out forts, and making maps for his guild. That vessel can NO LONGER BE SOLD/TRADED/SACRIFICED.
  • The vessel then (Another assumption) is added to the crypt as a vessel that Henry can enter, and leave in as he pleases. Cause he's a spirit crow, not a mortal being.

Hopefully that clears things up a bit for those of you that weren't sure what the vessel system is supposed to look like. Or at least, my understanding of the vessel system. NOW a caveat to all that was stated above, is that some of that may be changed due to the aforementioned worries of other players. (NOT THE SPIRIT CROW PART) 

Edited by OsirianLegacy

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On 2/8/2018 at 9:28 AM, ACE_Jackal said:

Join us on a trip to the home of the dead.

FULL STORY

Going forward, we’re going to change that: you enter character creation before you first enter the game world, and you only turn into a “spirit crow” when your character dies.

Feedback: I can better relate to this more now. Maybe show a cinematic on your very first death to describe what happens to your body as you transform into the Spirit of the Crow.

Suggestion: Your eternal and immortal soul learned it's life lesson and can choose whether to continue along the same path as before or be blessed with a choice from the Gods. They offer you the freedom to adventure on a new journey, carrying with you in spirit, the memories left behind from the previous vessel. (Insert object into inventory once the new vessel has been created; title earned "Cannon Fodder" and/or a trinket from the Gods that tracks the number of incarnations you've had and when activated will open up "achievements or goals" including your spirit journal where you can type notes. The trinket could be a crow amulet that is tied to your spirit and is worn always by each vessel. There could also be a trigger for the amulet if you decide to cast it into the "eternal fire" while inhabiting your vessel. 

As far as the first death cinematic: make it so you won't be able to by-pass experiencing it for your first time through hitting ESC, but allow it thereafter.

I've been enjoying the experience so far with the expectations of knowing the game is in it's testing phase.

Thanks ACEs and experienced crows for keeping us informed as much as possible especially when we have questions in the forums or in game. I'm finding the community mostly helpful.

#feedback
#suggestions
#crowsareawesome
 

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Wouldn't it just make sense that your first character, as a default vessel would be the baseline for that created character as long as they held a character slot?

Necromancy should just allow you to craft another form of yourself and just overwrite the default. Necromancy vessels could eventually expire, or be damaged, and you could maintain demand for vessels. When the player loses their ~better vessel they just return to the default vessel while still keeping intact the form of that character as they originally created it.

Edited by Lightsig

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On 2/12/2018 at 3:03 AM, XpCjU said:

They are, also, the basic armor fits on every vessel and even advanced armor (leather, mail, plate) fits on every race, given that the class can wear it. 

I assumed banks would be shared at least spirit, but where did ACE state this?

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2 minutes ago, APE said:

I assumed banks would be shared at least spirit, but where did ACE state this?

On 12.2.2018 at 10:26 AM, Gaiawyn said:

I haven't tried a new vessel yet because I fear losing all of the bits and bobs I've harvested unless the local and spirit banks are persistent across vessels.

 

I assumed the original poster was refering to the current gameplay.  They haven't stated anything, but I hope it will be that way anyways, the current very small banks will make banking vessels almost a requirement if not. 

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There isn't any "bind on equip" system. So your vessels can share any weapon or armor they are able to use. The look of the armor changes when you put it on (based on race).

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Why would we need this many character slots when you can only train 1 or 3 classes at a time...

 

did that system change, or will people have a lot of useless characters for the “fun” of it?

Edited by Ziz

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1 minute ago, Ziz said:

Why would we need this many character slots when you can only train 1 or 3 classes at a time...

because, depending on how rare disciplines are going to be, you might want to have a harvesting vessel, a crafting vessel and multiple combat vessels. 

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22 hours ago, Ziz said:

Why would we need this many character slots when you can only train 1 or 3 classes at a time...

Since you can't train more than a single combat tree, anyone with VIP is going to have some harvesting or crafting skills.  Even if you play a single race/class combo there is still going to be uses for different vessels with different stats and rune setups.  Say you have skinning trained.  You'll want a vessel with relevant runes.  Maybe even though you're not trained in mining (with the aid of potions and good tools) you'll have vessel with the foreman rune to help on motherloads.  Perhaps you want another setup for when you're out guarding gatherers.  Now to your actual combat vessels you may want several or different situations.  The setup you want for roaming in a single group may not be the same as when it's larger guild vs guild battles.  Perhaps you're a confessor but sometimes you want runes with utility to them (such as heal debuffs) instead of your usual DPS.  How many slots is that?  How many variants did I not think of?  How about testing new builds of this very versatile system without having to delete vessels you still have use for?  (this one factor is enough for me to be adamantly against character slots)  Then on top of all that, most people aren't going to go with a single race/class combo.

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