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jtoddcoleman

02/12/15 - The Confessor, God History & Pricing Faq

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Read the whole sentence.  "paying for an advantage you can't get by any other means."

 

Pay 2 Win for me is an advantage, related to the gameplay, a player has over other players because he paid more for the game than they did. It has very little to  do with the possibility of earning the advantage by another mean in game.

 

For exemple : someone purchase a VIP and sell it for 1,000 Gold. He buys a big sword with the Gold. His sword is stronger than the average players' weapon. He has a big advantage during the fights.

 

That is Pay 2 Win, by me, because the normal player spent 50 houres to get the big sword, and the VIP, only 20 minuts.

 

Now repeat the process 100 times and you got a player who has 1,000,000 Gold only a week after the server start, and the average player only owns 1,000 Gold.

Edited by courant101

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At first it wasn't pay 2 win(or so they said) and I was one of those defending AA saying it wasn't pay 2 win. But then the game launched and they slowly but surely turned it into a pay 2 win cash shop. AA devs said the same things CF devs are saying, only cosmetic fluff items and account services. AA devs lied and went down that route lets hope CF Devs are better.

 

Now, they didn't lie about anything. The items that were game breaking were already there. (Regrade charms, BiS mounts, etc.) I caught these early on with that post, but people were too nullfied by the devs that as you see from the downvotes, there was no community response.

 

It was only when people played and saw the massive advantage that people who paid got was when they called P2W. They didn't add anything into the cash shop that made it any more pay to win, only more RNG boxes that made people RQ.

Edited by anj

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you do know that gold farmers can always sell gold for less than any official game can.  Look at wildstar, eve online, archeage and any countless other mmo's that have those systems.

 

Depends on the cost of doing business for the gold farmers.  If there are no resources in secure areas (which we already know is included in the design) then some percentage less than 100% of collected resources will be returned back safely due to loss to PvP.  Much will depend on how effectively bots or manually operated farmers can get those resources out of the POIs and back to town.

 

So do your part to save the economy - murder the farmers!  (hmm that sounds kinda creepy, doesn't it?)


rSHxVEY.gif

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We're still early in development so there's a number of things we still need to do. However, Eric has started on the confessors models! 

 

I wonder if people would want to see his work in progress?

Yes I personally would love to see the work in progress.  Eric show us what you've got!

 

What a glorious day in the Crowfall updates.  :D


"Be polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everybody you meet." General James Mattis

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Couple things to note here:

 

1) People are assuming there is going to be tier'd gear here. Meaning a sword as example having a higher value over others. I am willing to bet the gear in this game won't be determining factors in most cases. Think shadowbane gear vs WoW gear here. I am willing to bet being naked will allow a player to remain competitive with a slight disadvantage only.

 

2) We are assuming there is going to be a currency ie money. They could go the route of no in game currency and trading is all based on resources. Unless I missed somewhere they stated there was currency.

 

Can I trade VIP membership tickets to other players?

 

Yes. This means that people who purchase the game, but don’t want to pay a monthly subscription, can still become VIP members by providing goods and services to other players.

 

3) Binding micro items to account solves all the biatching going on :P

 

What you've written is really interesting. There could be just no currency at all, and we would have to trade with iron, leather, etc...

 

Also binding micro items to players would solve the "P2W" aspect of the apparent problem, but it would be detrimental to the devs, I think, since people wouldn't buy as many items (only one VIP token, one nice hat, etc. per player).

 

They could maybe put a limit like 5 VIP tokens can be purchased per month...

Edited by courant101

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Pay 2 Win for me is an advantage, related to the gameplay, a player has over other players because he paid more for the game than they did. It has very little to  do with the possibility of earning the advantage by another mean in game.

 

For exemple : someone purchase a VIP and sell it for 1,000 Gold. He buys a big sword with the Gold. His sword is stronger than the average players' weapon. He has a big advantage during the fights.

 

That is Pay 2 Win, by me, because the normal player spent 50 houres to get the big sword, and the VIP, only 20 minuts.

 

Now repeat the process 100 times and you got a player who has 1,000,000 Gold only a week after the server start, and the average player only owns 1,000 Gold.

 

You can't just throw in an arbitrary amount of time that it would take for the non-spender to acquire the same item.  Why does it all of a sudden take 50 hours?

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Systems like PLEX in EVE and gems in Guild Wars 2 encourage farming of gold by players which causes massive inflation. The economy in Guild Wars 2 is so broken right now there is absolutely no chance of them fixing. They've tried, repeatedly. There is a cabal of people with most of the game's in game wealth and they use it to control precursor and legendary weapon  prices on the auction house to get even more in game money. They probably then sell their gains to gold selling websites for real money if the cabal isn't the in game gold sellers themselves.

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Hey Guys!

 

I'm excited to show you guys the current progress on the Male Confessor model! This is his high poly version from Zbrush. Soon he will be made game ready and sent over to be rigged and begin animation work. I look forward to sharing more updates with everyone in the future!  :)

 

 

That was quick - Very cool thanks for sharing!

 

Hm, that "weapon" looks like a brand, doesn't it?

Edited by ren

rSHxVEY.gif

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Hey Guys!

 

I'm excited to show you guys the current progress on the Male Confessor model! This is his high poly version from Zbrush. Soon he will be made game ready and sent over to be rigged and begin animation work. I look forward to sharing more updates with everyone in the future!  :)

 

 

ConfessorHP_01.png

 

I've been wondering why he brandishes his wand like that... maybe it's a branding iron? Does he stamp zombie's butts with his mark after he slays them? Very interesting way to leave your mark I guess!

Edited by anj

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So let's use "Pink" dye as example here. Let's say a player purchases this dye to change the color of their armor to pink as a cosmetic change. 

 

Now I challenge you to explain to me how this is pay to win in any way? Isn't gonna help yo arse in a siege or a pvp skirmish .... help me understand your thought process here 

I think his argument is that if you purchase pink dye and dye a hat pink, you can then sell that pink hat to another person for 5000 wood and 5000 stone in-game.  You can then use the wood and stone to build a house and crafter equipment.  This gives you an in-game boost in exchange for the use of RL $$ to purchase the pink dye.

 

As for the idea of being able to sell the equivalent to EVE Plex for $$, it's the same idea.  I'm actually fine with it because I think EVE maintains its competitive balance despite allowing players to buy plex and sell it for in game cash.  

 

My bigger concern is the use of RL $$ to buy cosmetic gear or furniture.  I would like everything used in the game or worn in the game to be made by crafters and all the resources for those items to be obtainable by harvesting in the game.  

 

I would prefer they drop the cosmetics and just stick with the PLEX equivalent.

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Awesome! I was hoping the game would be a pay once thing. Considering that, do we  have to pay for beta? A lot of people are wondering that it seems. I personally think beta should be free so we can decide if it's worth playing, ya know? The game seems awesome but we still haven't gotten to even play so it's a little early to be throwing money in without a little bit of a test run. 

 

But that's just my opinion. 


I say to you: the Hunger is not your enemy. Your enemy walks among you, charming and handsome, with a tongue full of lies.

 

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Hey Guys!

 

I'm excited to show you guys the current progress on the Male Confessor model! This is his high poly version from Zbrush. Soon he will be made game ready and sent over to be rigged and begin animation work. I look forward to sharing more updates with everyone in the future!  :)

 

 

ConfessorHP_01.png

 

Yes! Looks sweet!

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Also, if anyone comparing this model with GW2 thinks it's a good model, maybe for the company's pocket is, but let me tell you that GW2 ingame's economy is broken.

 

GW2's ingame economy is broken for a host of reasons.  Also, we don't have enough details about the system to compare it to GW2.  It sounds like it'll be different, with some similarities.  It has one commonality with WildStar (W*'s CREDD trading system to subscribe without paying).

 

----------

 

This is not "Pay 2 Win".  Comparing this model and dev team to the cash grabbing f2p/p2w games that really exist out there is an insult.  Calm the [...] down.

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Pay 2 Win for me is an advantage, related to the gameplay, a player has over other players because he paid more for the game than they did. It has very little to  do with the possibility of earning the advantage by another mean in game.

 

For exemple : someone purchase a VIP and sell it for 1,000 Gold. He buys a big sword with the Gold. His sword is stronger than the average players' weapon. He has a big advantage during the fights.

 

That is Pay 2 Win, by me, because the normal player spent 50 houres to get the big sword, and the VIP, only 20 minuts.

 

Now repeat the process 100 times and you got a player who has 1,000,000 Gold only a week after the server start, and the average player only owns 1,000 Gold.

By that logic then someone who can play more is "pay 2 win" and unfair because they'll have an advantage of time and being able to acquire items and skills faster.

 

Also gear will come from crafting, so its not likely there will be many if any crafters with super high skill that can make higher quality weapons soon after launch. Even so those crafters will be able to sell to anyone, so sure some will be able to afford it faster but again anyone will be able to obtain those items.

Edited by pang

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