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Say No to Shadowbane Style Mines


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4 hours ago, KrakkenSmacken said:

Bottom line, what you think is fun and fair, is actually boring and terrible.  It may work for Travian, partly because it is in fact a browser game which does not rely on twitch, which means that ping is not as big a deal, so that someone from the other side of the world can in fact realistically work in the same guild.

CF however, like any other real time game, needs sub 100 ping on average, which means people from the same time zone will be playing together for the most part, which means that 24/7 flipping would be a "who can stay up the latest" contest.

It's just a bad idea, and has been demonstrated to be a bad idea, on many other games that have tried it.

As i said to PopeUrban and to other player it has nothing to be about it being a good game decision or a funny mechanics. If you only enable prime time siege you are cutting out of the siege all the population who can't do sieges in prime time.

So what should these people do? Find another game because they can't play prime time?

 

Since Crowfall can have campaigns make a"funny" campaign for people who can play prime time and a "boring and terrible" (I am quoting you) campaign for people who can't.

I do not understand why you want to exclude the game people who would likely play it but couldn't due to real life incompatibily issues. If you find that particular ruleset boring DO NOT PLAY IT and go play the prime time campaign. Problem solved and everyone happy.

 

PS: Yo Krakken, have you forgot too that Crawfall has customizable campaigns? The more I read this the more it seems you all are doing a witch hunt to a players base you do not want in the game. If these players play a different campaign they are by no way ruining your game experience. On the other side, you and others here, advocating that these kind of campaigns shouldn't exist on the first place, you aren't even ruining other player experience... you are preventing them to join the game at all. Someone would say this is some sort of next level PVP... my hope is that Crowfall team still find this playerbase economically relevant to implement a place for them to be regardless of all the hate you and others are showing to this playerbase.

Edited by Nyamo

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Getting back on track, I can't stress enough that hitting rocks for hours isn't how I want to spend my game time, and that seems to be necessary for supplying crafters with what they need to keep ever

Ok, I stopped reading this thread around page 8 (and didn't read each post meticulously), so forgive me for addressing the elephant in the room if it's already been addressed...   Nyamo, do

First, I like the idea. But, the key to PvP health is variety, in my opinion. This should be in, SB style mines should be in, 24-hour active mines that cannot be captured should be in, hot spots

Yeah, prime time siege means I can't play.  Period.  I can't forsee being able to play prime time any time in the near future.  I can play almost 12 hours a day, but just that can NEVER be between 8pm and Midnight EST.

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I've always been confused by this type of thing.  Like don't 9 to 5ers have enough?  Can't they go to happy hours and evening events and play golf or hang out at the country club and whatever.  If MMOs aren't for people with weird schedules and night shifters and 4 on 3 offers and truck drivers and disabled and such, what are?

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6 minutes ago, Arcadi said:

Yeah, prime time siege means I can't play.  Period.  I can't forsee being able to play prime time any time in the near future.  I can play almost 12 hours a day, but just that can NEVER be between 8pm and Midnight EST.

Thank you for spending one minute of your time for posting this feedback. I kindly appreciate and you have my deep gratitude. I am pretty sure there are many players like us out there and we do deserve a campaign in which we can siege according to our real life needs.

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3 minutes ago, Nyamo said:

Thank you for spending one minute of your time for posting this feedback. I kindly appreciate and you have my deep gratitude. I am pretty sure there are many players like us out there and we do deserve a campaign in which we can siege according to our real life needs.

Yes, I agree.  I find often 9 to 5ers are most active on forums, because they work the types of jobs that afford them a lot of time they can surf the internet but can't actually play the game.  People with less regular schedules oftentimes can't access the internet in their jobs, and in their free time would rather be in game than on the forums.

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1 minute ago, Arcadi said:

Yes, I agree.  I find often 9 to 5ers are most active on forums, because they work the types of jobs that afford them a lot of time they can surf the internet but can't actually play the game.  People with less regular schedules oftentimes can't access the internet in their jobs, and in their free time would rather be in game than on the forums.

Are you implying that the majority of people with disposable incomes for video games don't work a 9-5 job? 

40 minutes ago, Andius said:

W/HoA were held up as like these mystical forces of highly skilled players with legendary theorycrafters chained to a desk in some deep dungeon holding all the arcane secrets we could use to win if only we knew them.

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24 minutes ago, Nyamo said:

As i said to PopeUrban and to other player it has nothing to be about it being a good game decision or a funny mechanics. If you only enable prime time siege you are cutting out of the siege all the population who can't do sieges in prime time.

So what should these people do? Find another game because they can't play prime time?

 

 

That's a very "chicken little" assumption. The sky is not falling.

With multiple servers, probably all over the world with all the partnerships stuff ACE is cooking up, they go play on the servers with the siege time windows usually set for the time they play.

Unless of course you think that 200,000+ users all need to cram into one world, or that somehow magically people from different time zones are going to create unbreakable friendship bonds even though they play at completely different times. My guild population typically runs 1-2 hours ahead of me in times zones, and even that makes a noticeable difference in the "when we play together" experience. I can't imagine a shift greater than 6 hours, or the impact it would have.

But really, this is a moot discussion.  ACE can probably set you and like minded players up in a server with 24/7 capture windows, and we can all watch that server whither and die while people figure out the servers with active population closer to home time, and good ping, are just more fun to play on.

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6 minutes ago, mandalore said:

Are you implying that the majority of people with disposable incomes for video games don't work a 9-5 job? 

MMOs are an incredibly cheap hobby.  Maybe you are thinking of console games?  Or squash?

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If the amount of players that want that style of play are in fact high in number and willing to be worth the cost of running a campaign server, then you will probably get what you want. If there are not enough of them and/or they are not worth the cost of a server then chances are you wont see campaigns with the rulesets you want.

JTC has already seen that players like you are very scarce and there are not enough of you to keep a game running. The campaign structure in crowfall might alleviate this problem, but they have stated before that they will be testing out alot of things with campaigns system, things that work they will probably keep in some way shape or form moving forwards while things that dont work will get dropped.

So if you really want campaigns with 24/7 vulnerability windows, then you better start gathering as many like minded people as you can and make sure that all of you are willing to jump on the server if one shows up and try keep it as populated as possible and have as many of you running VIP as possible. If less than 5% of the overall population is interacting with a ruleset, then they need to be willing to support that ruleset, cause if they cant then there is no reason for ACE to continue running a ruleset that over 90% of players wont wanna interact with.

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13 minutes ago, Arcadi said:

I've always been confused by this type of thing.  Like don't 9 to 5ers have enough?  Can't they go to happy hours and evening events and play golf or hang out at the country club and whatever.  If MMOs aren't for people with weird schedules and night shifters and 4 on 3 offers and truck drivers and disabled and such, what are?

These groups should be bunching together into related time blocks.  The mechanic can really be quite simple, if you own an asset, you pick the time it's vulnerable, based on the time your group is most likely to be on, so you can have a real fight.  

If one keep is on a time that makes it strategically hard for some players with opposite time zones, it then will create relationships and blocks for groups to fight around. Servers will naturally form up ownership around the relative populations, and with the relative times they all play at.  We could see sections of a map all on one time zone, and other sections based around another.

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4 minutes ago, KrakkenSmacken said:

That's a very "chicken little" assumption. The sky is not falling.

With multiple servers, probably all over the world with all the partnerships stuff ACE is cooking up, they go play on the servers with the siege time windows usually set for the time they play.

Unless of course you think that 200,000+ users all need to cram into one world, or that somehow magically people from different time zones are going to create unbreakable friendship bonds even though they play at completely different times. My guild population typically runs 1-2 hours ahead of me in times zones, and even that makes a noticeable difference in the "when we play together" experience. I can't imagine a shift greater than 6 hours, or the impact it would have.

But really, this is a moot discussion.  ACE can probably set you and like minded players up in a server with 24/7 capture windows, and we can all watch that server whither and die while people figure out the servers with active population closer to home time, and good ping, are just more fun to play on.

I don't get what in the actual custard is happening here. Play on a CW that allows you to play prime time for that CW but if you're playing on a CW that doesn't maximize your available time and then complain about not being in the prime time I'm a little confused.  What do you want?  Do you reasonably expect the majority of people to capitulate to the minority? 

 

Stop making me agree with Krakken.  I don't like it.  It's not comfortable. 

40 minutes ago, Andius said:

W/HoA were held up as like these mystical forces of highly skilled players with legendary theorycrafters chained to a desk in some deep dungeon holding all the arcane secrets we could use to win if only we knew them.

wiDfyPp.png

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2 minutes ago, ShadowwBoi13 said:

If the amount of players that want that style of play are in fact high in number and willing to be worth the cost of running a campaign server, then you will probably get what you want. If there are not enough of them and/or they are not worth the cost of a server then chances are you wont see campaigns with the rulesets you want.

JTC has already seen that players like you are very scarce and there are not enough of you to keep a game running. The campaign structure in crowfall might alleviate this problem, but they have stated before that they will be testing out alot of things with campaigns system, things that work they will probably keep in some way shape or form moving forwards while things that dont work will get dropped.

So if you really want campaigns with 24/7 vulnerability windows, then you better start gathering as many like minded people as you can and make sure that all of you are willing to jump on the server if one shows up and try keep it as populated as possible and have as many of you running VIP as possible. If less than 5% of the overall population is interacting with a ruleset, then they need to be willing to support that ruleset, cause if they cant then there is no reason for ACE to continue running a ruleset that over 90% of players wont wanna interact with.

Based on what?  pre-Alpha population?  There's an apples to oranges comparison for you.

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2 minutes ago, mandalore said:

I don't get what in the actual custard is happening here. Play on a CW that allows you to play prime time for that CW but if you're playing on a CW that doesn't maximize your available time and then complain about not being in the prime time I'm a little confused.  What do you want?  Do you reasonably expect the majority of people to capitulate to the minority? 

 

Stop making me agree with Krakken.  I don't like it.  It's not comfortable. 

Any fixed siege window model is bad for people who don't have regular schedules.  It's not like people have 9 to 5 schedules just in a different time zone.  There are lots of irregular schedules out there.  And people with those schedules already can't go to bridge club or be in PTA or really do anything if they don't live in a big city.  Thus many got involved in MMOs back in the day because it was something social you could do where people were always around at weird times.  That was like everyone I played with in EQ and AO.

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1 minute ago, Arcadi said:

Any fixed siege window model is bad for people who don't have regular schedules.  It's not like people have 9 to 5 schedules just in a different time zone.  There are lots of irregular schedules out there.  And people with those schedules already can't go to bridge club or be in PTA or really do anything if they don't live in a big city.  Thus many got involved in MMOs back in the day because it was something social you could do where people were always around at weird times.  That was like everyone I played with in EQ and AO.

So play on a server where you're not custard yourself over so you can stop virtue signaling about not having a normal 9-5 job?  Is it so alien for you to play on a CW where other people play in the prime time?  Do you so desperately want to avoid major conflict?  Stop hiding in the off time for a server and play on CW that matches your availability. 

Edited by mandalore
40 minutes ago, Andius said:

W/HoA were held up as like these mystical forces of highly skilled players with legendary theorycrafters chained to a desk in some deep dungeon holding all the arcane secrets we could use to win if only we knew them.

wiDfyPp.png

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1 minute ago, mandalore said:

So play on a server where you're not custard yourself over so you can stop virtue signaling about not having a normal 9-5 job?

Ad hominems are always so productive.  I guess the discussion is over.

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Just now, Arcadi said:

Ad hominems are always so productive.  I guess the discussion is over.

You're advocating for preferential treatment.  It was over a long time ago bromego. 

40 minutes ago, Andius said:

W/HoA were held up as like these mystical forces of highly skilled players with legendary theorycrafters chained to a desk in some deep dungeon holding all the arcane secrets we could use to win if only we knew them.

wiDfyPp.png

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3 minutes ago, mandalore said:

So play on a server where you're not custard yourself over so you can stop virtue signaling about not having a normal 9-5 job?  Is it so alien for you to play on a CW where other people play in the prime time?  Do you so desperately want to avoid major conflict?  Stop hiding in the off time for a server and play on CW that matches your availability. 

Stop making me agree with mandalore, it's making me uncomfortable.

 

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Just now, Arcadi said:

Based on what?  pre-Alpha population?  There's an apples to oranges comparison for you.

Based on nothing. Im giving you advice for keeping the type of playstyle you want afloat. Unlike others who seem to be bashing this style completely. If you want 24/7 vulnerability to be a thing you need to find way more people like you. Cause as it seems from the forums and many past game flops, there are not that many. Prove everyone else wrong and bring your droves of friends that wish for that play style and keep a campaign active enough for ACE to be willing to keep running that campaign style.

If there actually are enough people that think like you and Nyamo, then this will be a non issue for you and everyone bad mouthing that style of play will be put in their place. If there arent enough of you then your out of luck and should try growing your community untill it becomes enough. The simple fact of the matter is, right now there isnt a single person who can say this style will succeed OR fail, not even by comparing it to other games that have failed to do it properly. The only thing that decides if that style of play will be a thing is ACE deciding its worth the cost to run those types of CWs, which as of right now, no one (not even the devs probably) could say if the play style is worth it. It cant be known untill its seen. So when the time comes put your money where your mouth is and hope enough people like you are also willing to do the same.

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Just now, KrakkenSmacken said:

Stop making me agree with mandalore, it's making me uncomfortable.

 

Reported. 

 

1 minute ago, ShadowwBoi13 said:

Based on nothing. Im giving you advice for keeping the type of playstyle you want afloat. Unlike others who seem to be bashing this style completely. If you want 24/7 vulnerability to be a thing you need to find way more people like you. Cause as it seems from the forums and many past game flops, there are not that many. Prove everyone else wrong and bring your droves of friends that wish for that play style and keep a campaign active enough for ACE to be willing to keep running that campaign style.

If there actually are enough people that think like you and Nyamo, then this will be a non issue for you and everyone bad mouthing that style of play will be put in their place. If there arent enough of you then your out of luck and should try growing your community untill it becomes enough. The simple fact of the matter is, right now there isnt a single person who can say this style will succeed OR fail, not even by comparing it to other games that have failed to do it properly. The only thing that decides if that style of play will be a thing is ACE deciding its worth the cost to run those types of CWs, which as of right now, no one (not even the devs probably) could say if the play style is worth it. It cant be known untill its seen. So when the time comes put your money where your mouth is and hope enough people like you are also willing to do the same.

I think that the fact that removed it from JTC's other game (while he was still there I think) says a lot about it. 

40 minutes ago, Andius said:

W/HoA were held up as like these mystical forces of highly skilled players with legendary theorycrafters chained to a desk in some deep dungeon holding all the arcane secrets we could use to win if only we knew them.

wiDfyPp.png

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