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veeshan

Stats and professions

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I was going through the Detail section of the character sheet and found out some stats get the short end of the stick when it comes to crafting/harvesting i feel they should balance them a little better so each stat is a bonus to certain things instead of one being way better than the other for example harvesting benefits from Str and Dex and nothing else so anyone wanting to play a int based race get shafted if they also wanna harvest and what not.

So here my suggestion for this matter
Harvesting is pretty simple since there 5 of them and 5 stats so you should break up the bonuses for one each. (need to look into the weakspots/yield bonus aswell since its all Str/Int/dex)
Mining = Str
Quarrying = Con
Logging = Dex
Skinning = int
Spirit = Digging
This way all stats bonus a harvesting skill in some way.

Crafting a little harder however since there 8 crafting skills, there is however 3 sections though so it could be 24 to split between stats wise so you could make each stat give bonuses to 5 things and one only gets 4 but its better than it current is since spirit and Con get shafted again :)


Veeshan Midst of UXA

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Necromancy when crafting Vessels can apply points to certain stats. You can make yourself a harvesting Vessel which stacks STR,DEX & INT for better results and then further increase those stats through leveling the vessel. INT does have its roll in harvesting, forget what it is off the top of my head. If you really want to min/max you can have a variety of harvesting vessels based on each race that has the best passives for whatever you are trying to harvest.

 

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Int increases the chance of weak spots forming while harvesting. This can work well with a the disc that restores stamina on weak spot hit.  I'd rather they didn't homogenize everything, and instead made unique builds viable. If every stat is good for only one thing the stats themselves become irrelevant. 

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it's weird because all of those professions need strength to do.  


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14 hours ago, Gorantu said:

Necromancy when crafting Vessels can apply points to certain stats. You can make yourself a harvesting Vessel which stacks STR,DEX & INT for better results and then further increase those stats through leveling the vessel. INT does have its roll in harvesting, forget what it is off the top of my head. If you really want to min/max you can have a variety of harvesting vessels based on each race that has the best passives for whatever you are trying to harvest.

 

the thing is though if your main class you play is a dex or str based one you will be better at crafting and harvesting than lets say a healer since your mostly gonna spec into spirit in the class tree which gives you pretty much no benefits in harvesting or crafting


Veeshan Midst of UXA

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21 minutes ago, veeshan said:

the thing is though if your main class you play is a dex or str based one you will be better at crafting and harvesting than lets say a healer since your mostly gonna spec into spirit in the class tree which gives you pretty much no benefits in harvesting or crafting

I'm afraid you are still missing my point, your crow is your main, not the flesh suit you occupy while waging war for your god. 

This game is all about specialization, you specialize a vessel for healing, for damage, for tanking, for crafting and for harvesting. If you are bringing your high spirit vessel to harvest you are doing it wrong.

Let me put this in other terms, if you were moving you wouldn't use your Lamborghini to haul all your furniture to your new home. You would use a truck, why? Because it is the right tool for the job. You have to specialize if you want to be good at what you are doing. If you approach this game from a JOT mindset you will fail. 

 

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3 minutes ago, Gorantu said:

I'm afraid you are still missing my point, your crow is your main, not the flesh suit you occupy while waging war for your god. 

This game is all about specialization, you specialize a vessel for healing, for damage, for tanking, for crafting and for harvesting. If you are bringing your high spirit vessel to harvest you are doing it wrong.

Let me put this in other terms, if you were moving you wouldn't use your Lamborghini to haul all your furniture to your new home. You would use a truck, why? Because it is the right tool for the job. You have to specialize if you want to be good at what you are doing. If you approach this game from a JOT mindset you will fail. 

 

Ok lets assume you dont have VIP however u wanna play a healer in combat, lets say woodelf, im gonna gon in the woodelf tree and passive skill gain points i get all in spirit and support power.
Lets say another person wants to play an assasin there gonna put all there passive skill gain point from the race tree into dex, now they benefite there combat class aswell as to a degree of jewlery crafting and wood cutting and so on where the first person doing cleric doesnt get that side bonus.

Sure you can craft a vessel with more points aimed towards the stat for crafting that could gimp your progression if your playing a spirit or tank based class where DPS classes that focus on int, stre or dex gets double the bonuses or being a good main stat for combat class aswell as combat and harvesting


Veeshan Midst of UXA

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8 minutes ago, veeshan said:

Ok lets assume you dont have VIP however u wanna play a healer in combat, lets say woodelf, im gonna gon in the woodelf tree and passive skill gain points i get all in spirit and support power.
Lets say another person wants to play an assasin there gonna put all there passive skill gain point from the race tree into dex, now they benefite there combat class aswell as to a degree of jewlery crafting and wood cutting and so on where the first person doing cleric doesnt get that side bonus.

Sure you can craft a vessel with more points aimed towards the stat for crafting that could gimp your progression if your playing a spirit or tank based class where DPS classes that focus on int, stre or dex gets double the bonuses or being a good main stat for combat class aswell as combat and harvesting

Not sure what VIP or the lack there of has to do with this discussion. Your high Str combat character will only receive benefits in a certain area of harvesting, same with Dex and Int. I wouldn't underestimate spirit either it increases stamina, if you focus on single nodes this can be quite useful. At higher rank single nodes you can be 1 swing from destroying a node and be completely out of stamina, now the high Str, Dex, and Int vessels will have to wait for their stamina bar to recharge before swinging again to destroy the node, not sure how long the stamina bar takes to recharge but let's say it's 10 seconds for the sake of arguement. Your high spirit vessel however will be able to destroy the node and move onto the next node, never really experiencing that 10 second "down time" due to your increased stamina capacity. That 10 seconds could be the difference between getting ganked or making a clean get away with all your resources. That 10 seconds per node will also really add up if you harvest for an hour or two. Just because a stat doesn't directly effect a harvesting "stat" on your character sheet doesn't mean it isn't useful for harvesting. 

But ultimately my point is I would not use any of my combat specialized vessels (with only high Str, Dex, or Int) to harvest with unless there was no other option. I would make a vessel with high Int, Dex & Str with a little bit of Spirit mixed in so my time is as effecient as possible. 

 

 

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17 hours ago, Gorantu said:

Not sure what VIP or the lack there of has to do with this discussion. Your high Str combat character will only receive benefits in a certain area of harvesting, same with Dex and Int. I wouldn't underestimate spirit either it increases stamina, if you focus on single nodes this can be quite useful. At higher rank single nodes you can be 1 swing from destroying a node and be completely out of stamina, now the high Str, Dex, and Int vessels will have to wait for their stamina bar to recharge before swinging again to destroy the node, not sure how long the stamina bar takes to recharge but let's say it's 10 seconds for the sake of arguement. Your high spirit vessel however will be able to destroy the node and move onto the next node, never really experiencing that 10 second "down time" due to your increased stamina capacity. That 10 seconds could be the difference between getting ganked or making a clean get away with all your resources. That 10 seconds per node will also really add up if you harvest for an hour or two. Just because a stat doesn't directly effect a harvesting "stat" on your character sheet doesn't mean it isn't useful for harvesting. 

But ultimately my point is I would not use any of my combat specialized vessels (with only high Str, Dex, or Int) to harvest with unless there was no other option. I would make a vessel with high Int, Dex & Str with a little bit of Spirit mixed in so my time is as effecient as possible. 

 

 

I dont care about the vessels its the passive training that does the dmg, yes ur vessels can be al;tered to make a crafting and combat vessel like you say but if you passive skill gain all going into spirit and con for example for a healer your dont double or even triple dip on the passive training if you were a Str, Dex or int based class since that benefits both your harvesting crafting and combat, where playing a healer and going spirit in your passive training you dont get that bvonus to crafting or harvesting that other do. 


Veeshan Midst of UXA

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15 hours ago, veeshan said:

I dont care about the vessels its the passive training that does the dmg, yes ur vessels can be al;tered to make a crafting and combat vessel like you say but if you passive skill gain all going into spirit and con for example for a healer your dont double or even triple dip on the passive training if you were a Str, Dex or int based class since that benefits both your harvesting crafting and combat, where playing a healer and going spirit in your passive training you dont get that bvonus to crafting or harvesting that other do. 

I understand what your saying but isn't this just matter of player choice/customization?

If as a player you decide you want to do everything in your power to min/max your healing by putting your passive skill tree points into skills knowing it won't affect other things (i.e. crafting/harvesting) then thats up to them.

 

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17 hours ago, veeshan said:

I dont care about the vessels its the passive training that does the dmg, yes ur vessels can be al;tered to make a crafting and combat vessel like you say but if you passive skill gain all going into spirit and con for example for a healer your dont double or even triple dip on the passive training if you were a Str, Dex or int based class since that benefits both your harvesting crafting and combat, where playing a healer and going spirit in your passive training you dont get that bvonus to crafting or harvesting that other do. 

I agree with you the damage is done in the passive training tree, specifically if you train in the exploration section, that is where you will see the most improvement. The stats that affect harvesting, as it stands the increase you see from these stats is minimal at best.

Let me get this straight, your opinion is that the balancing in the harvesting / crafting area is unbalanced because con and spirit play no role and the areas of expertise should be more evenly distributed among all stats so that no matter what race you play you should have an advantage. And your purposed solution to the problem is a complete overhaul of the stats involved to include spirit and con.

If that is correct, can you see how ridiculous that is. Considering that there is already a mechanic in the game that would allow you to have a high INT,DEX,STR CLERIC, and when purposed with this mechanic you proceed to say you don't care about it and re-iterate your position that everything needs to change.

Let me ask you a few questions.

1. Why do you want to harvest/craft on a high spirit cleric?

2. Why wouldn't you use a more specialized option?

3. Every race has training in every single stat, yes some more so than others. For instance a Minotaur or a Half Giant has more options to train strength then a human. High elfs have more opportunities to train INT than a Minotaur or a Half Giant. Since this is a heavy lore based game, shouldn't Minotaur's and Half Giants be naturally stronger than than a human. Shouldn't be easier for them to hit a rock or an ore node more successfully than them?

This game is all about specialization, I'll say once again that if you tend to play a single race/class/vessel and attempt to have a JOT play style you will fail. Specialization is at the core of crowfall and it will not change.

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If my experience with the actual harvesting is any indicator, then the reliance on stats to get the more advanced drops from a node is minimal. It’s there in the sense that bonus’ are applied but doesn’t really dictate your not being able to get the normal amount of the resource. Will the person who has DPS or Tank trees on their crow have an advantage? Yes. Will someone with a crafted Vessel focused on strength have the advantage? Yes. 

But we all have access to the same trees to advance our Crows. To V’s point, if you have VIP then you gain these points faster.

But I think there’s more here. When I play a game, I don’t expect to get my Level 60 freedom at the onset. Your initial trees are a point of injection into the gameplay, and you spiral out from that point as you play. If your focus is on Healing class skills you will have that disadvantage in harvesting. Likewise if you’re focusing on crafting you will likely see a lapse in your healing skills. 

But that is the nature of a skill tree. It will require time and careful thought as to when and how you grow your gameplay potential. As harvesting is, in and of itself a skill set in this game I feel like it’s playing to the Meta to combine goals, such leveling the Tank trees and Harvesting skills at the same time. 

Ideally, I think harvesting should have its own secondary stat so that the concept of strength stacking doesn’t play in. But that gets complicated to the players quickly...

I feel like the method the Dev team chose makes sense to me. And that the aversion to VIP players getting to those points more quickly should be a motivator to have the subscription and support the development of the game. 

To be a PURE healer and not focus on advancing the crafting stats of the game will likely prove to force a player to be reliant on other crafters. Which is why the economy will be so VAST in Crowfall. 

I respect your argument. And I see where you’re coming from. I just don’t think it aligns with the game. That to change it in the way you’ve suggested would go in the face of several of the core designs and intentions of the mechanics on which the game is based.


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