Jump to content
Search In
  • More options...
Find results that contain...
Find results in...
PaleOne

More variety = Better game(locked promotion classes)

Recommended Posts

Crowfall was always promoted as a game where choices matter, but also as the game that will offer the greatest degree of character customization.

 

in WoW we also had three sets of talent trees but the only limit was your total number of points in how to arrange them.

 

Please unlock promotion classes and allow us to Multiclass.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wouldn't work with the way some of the talents are designed.

Myrmidon battle rager for example gets a whirlwind that prevents berserk crash damage.

Mymidon conqueror gets whirlwind that makes you CC immune.

How would you kill a myrmidon that can take both of these talents? 

I'm sure there's examples of this in other classes also. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I also found the character system better but not free. I was hoping for more specialization to the point that some bow guy would be easy pickings in a melee fight, or a healer could be shut down by an anti-healer guy who sends out an aura of negative healing (or whatever). Or the ability to be a good but not great character in several things. I'm still not able to make a personalized character, to many generics.

For example:

Character 1

Easy to detect stealther that is a support healer 

Character 2

Charger that can jump and leap to people to counter ranged characters but without leaping at someone, strait melee is weakened

Character 3

An escape artist that like to pve and can blink away from dangerous pvp, or pops out for a quick hit before the dash away, not a real danger but good at hide collecting

Some quirky examples. RIFT did this well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 12/3/2018 at 8:42 AM, PaleOne said:

Crowfall was always promoted as a game where choices matter, but also as the game that will offer the greatest degree of character customization.

in WoW we also had three sets of talent trees but the only limit was your total number of points in how to arrange them.

Please unlock promotion classes and allow us to Multiclass.

For most of the WoW eras that used the talent system you are referencing, the player always went for the Capstone talent in a particular tree and had 20 points left to play with after hitting that Capstone. (with very, very few exceptions) While you could spend those 20 remaining points in a different tree, you really could never advance past the first 3 tiers due to the amount of points given to a character. Generally speaking the first few tiers of any of the older WoW talent trees weren't much more that stat boosting. So to say you could "multiclass" in the old WoW talent system is really stretching it.

Crowfall is somewhat similar in a sense you should go for a particular Capstone and have points left over to either invest in discipline nodes or the class specific nodes in the middle section of the tree. (I'm really looking forward to the dynamic nodes generated by disicplines in 6.0.) As Blazzen pointed out we built the promotion areas with a specific theme/idea in mind and were able to implement to that theme because we knew the player wouldn't be able to buy into those other promotion areas.

The amount of character customization we have for the launch offering is pretty unparalleled in the space, and the current talent trees as a great starting point, and we will continue to add more content to the talent trees/disciplines as time goes on.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 12/3/2018 at 10:10 AM, blazzen said:

Wouldn't work with the way some of the talents are designed.

Myrmidon battle rager for example gets a whirlwind that prevents berserk crash damage.

Mymidon conqueror gets whirlwind that makes you CC immune.

How would you kill a myrmidon that can take both of these talents? 

I'm sure there's examples of this in other classes also. 

 

On 12/3/2018 at 10:17 AM, PaleOne said:

This could be fixed by putting them at the end of the trees so your couldn’t max both.

This still doesn't fix the problem of doubling-up on the specific promotion class advantages once you get the time in and train multiple promotion classes. Since Blair just said he doesn't want that possible, a simple, better fix is to lock the vessel into a specific promotion class. This way a veteran player can train and play different promo classes with the same crow, but he doesn't have an insurmountable advantage over newer players.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 12/6/2018 at 1:37 AM, thomasblair said:

For most of the WoW eras that used the talent system you are referencing, the player always went for the Capstone talent in a particular tree and had 20 points left to play with after hitting that Capstone. (with very, very few exceptions) While you could spend those 20 remaining points in a different tree, you really could never advance past the first 3 tiers due to the amount of points given to a character. Generally speaking the first few tiers of any of the older WoW talent trees weren't much more that stat boosting. So to say you could "multiclass" in the old WoW talent system is really stretching it.

Crowfall is somewhat similar in a sense you should go for a particular Capstone and have points left over to either invest in discipline nodes or the class specific nodes in the middle section of the tree. (I'm really looking forward to the dynamic nodes generated by disicplines in 6.0.) As Blazzen pointed out we built the promotion areas with a specific theme/idea in mind and were able to implement to that theme because we knew the player wouldn't be able to buy into those other promotion areas.

The amount of character customization we have for the launch offering is pretty unparalleled in the space, and the current talent trees as a great starting point, and we will continue to add more content to the talent trees/disciplines as time goes on.

True but the different talent trees specialized and by maxing one and then choosing how many points you put in the other you had a unique character that suited your taste.

The way you have "Locked the trees" you have made that sort of multiclassing difficult.

For example. You have locked together a melee focus and stealth capability for rangers.  What if Someone wanted to be a ranged stealther?

Same with Duelist specialties

there is a ranged tree and a stealth focused tree but no way to blend the two.

Currently if you want stealth as a ranger, you have to give up the ability to equip runic bows.. Probably a game changer

Unless you give us the ability to equip runic bows through disciplines.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 12/6/2018 at 1:37 AM, thomasblair said:

The amount of character customization we have for the launch offering is pretty unparalleled in the space, and the current talent trees as a great starting point, and we will continue to add more content to the talent trees/disciplines as time goes on.

The level of character customization is almost becoming overwhelming/unnecessary/"enuf, plz stahp" territory :) At some point I want to be able to stop worrying about customization/optimization choices and just play the game of beatin' people up.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The problem with completely free form character customization is that while on the surface it sounds like it promotes diversity, in practice it usually ends up where only a few specific builds are viable. So you end up either having to look on google how to configure your skill tree to obtain a playable character, or to try to figure it out by yourself and merely ending up gimping yourself.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, Eleris said:

The problem with completely free form character customization is that while on the surface it sounds like it promotes diversity, in practice it usually ends up where only a few specific builds are viable. So you end up either having to look on google how to configure your skill tree to obtain a playable character, or to try to figure it out by yourself and merely ending up gimping yourself.

Path of Exile is a pretty good example of this if anyone is looking for one.  I don't think CF is quite in that territory, nor would I want it to be.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, Eleris said:

The problem with completely free form character customization is that while on the surface it sounds like it promotes diversity, in practice it usually ends up where only a few specific builds are viable. So you end up either having to look on google how to configure your skill tree to obtain a playable character, or to try to figure it out by yourself and merely ending up gimping yourself.

Shadowbane had way more options that the current structure for Crowfall, and Shadowbane didn't have that problem at all.  There were many different ways to build a certain race/class/promotion combo that were all viable.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 12/21/2018 at 7:03 PM, KohrAh said:

Shadowbane had way more options that the current structure for Crowfall, and Shadowbane didn't have that problem at all.  There were many different ways to build a certain race/class/promotion combo that were all viable.

Very, very few of the hundreds of Sb builds were legit viable.  Don't bring some revisionist ad hoc and think you're not going to get called out on it.  So many SB builds were trash and every moron thought their 35 con 1800 hp channy was the poorly made socks and it was trash that exploded when hit. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 12/21/2018 at 8:03 PM, KohrAh said:

Shadowbane had way more options that the current structure for Crowfall, and Shadowbane didn't have that problem at all.  There were many different ways to build a certain race/class/promotion combo that were all viable.

That was tied into the number of classes and disciplines available though.

4 base classes became 22 promoted classes - CF 11 base classes become 33 prestige variants

Weapon runes gave you the weapon you could use if not base - which is pointless in CF because those runes seem to only be able to be used by classes that already get the weapons

Disciplines were the real meat of changing things up - which is more limited because there are less disciplines and they give less on average in CF atm.

The base technology is there to do this, and we'll just see how development goes.

 

The most annoying part of CF is the bar lock and swapping between them. Limiting what you can use at a time without swapping in abilities, but also the iteration is rather clunky. But with more passes at the disciplines, and hopefully the disciplines will be more contained to themselves and not just fleshing out an aspect of a class (like sundancer in Shadowbane completely changing up how a class would work. Meaty and not just 2 powers 1 passive) 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 12/21/2018 at 5:03 PM, KohrAh said:

Shadowbane had way more options that the current structure for Crowfall, and Shadowbane didn't have that problem at all.  There were many different ways to build a certain race/class/promotion combo that were all viable.

Yes, it did have this problem. If you didn't create your character to a T before creating it in game, you were a gimp and worthless in 95% of the game. New players were constantly having to reroll once they joined a guild and were informed of how bad their builds actually were.

The difference is communication wasn't as abundant. A lot of gamers didn't even use the internet as a source of info for gaming. So most people with terrible builds were just blissfully ignorant. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...