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Ranger Promotions 5.8 Current & Future


Sorrows
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First let me start off by saying I'm a new backer and have only been testing for roughly 10 days now and last night was my first dip into 5.8 Promotion classes specifically for the Ranger. Now with that out of the way let's discuss how needlessly clunky the Ranger Promotions feel and my current thoughts on what they are and which direction they should be going.

FYI, the whole point of this is to have a discussion on the current gameplay mechanics and state of the Ranger and the first pass of its Promotion classes and which directions the majority of the community feels the class should take while it's still being iterated upon.

 

My Current View

Archer

It's by far the least clunky out of the three Promotion classes and all the talents in the promotion tree focus purely on being an Archer. This feels like the initial concept of what the Ranger was when it first came out most likely and they just streamlined it into being a sniper.

Warden

This is a primarily melee build with one bomb which seems odd as this is suppose to be the hybrid melee/archer, but it seems that was lost in translation and it's a more tanky melee build that has high survivability and great stealth detection.

Brigand

Without question the most clunky of the three Promotion classes with a melee/bleed/debuff focus that has access to the Stealth Tray with a single ability Ambush. You can supplement your Stealth Tray with Disciplines, but you might as well play an Assassin or Duelist if you wanted to do that.

 

The Direction I would love to see the Ranger and individual Promotion classes go

Ranger Base Kit

Camouflage - Base skill that allows you to blend into your surrounding similar to the Wood Elf Passive, but would add to your Far-Sight and Perception. Possible limited movement with upgrade through the talent system, but would never come close to a pure stealth class. Possible damage bonus on opening from Camouflage upgrade via talents.

Animal Companions - Unlike permanent pets the Animal Companion would provide some form of active or passive skill and would not necessarily need to be visible in game like a permanent pet would be. For example a passive Hawk Companion that adds to your Far-sight or an active Crow Companion that blinds your enemy. A wolf or hound that adds to your perception or tracks down pray.

Hybrid - Should be equal with Bow or Steel until Promoted into one of the promotion classes. Perhaps some passive that rewards switching between Ranged and Melee Tray.

Archer Leather Armor Long Bow & 1-Hand Melee

If the Archer is the Premier Bow user I'm perfectly fine with the "Sniper" approach. Long Range, Large Radius AoE abilities and slower draw times with a mesh of defensive abilities or passive that keep enemies at bay or minimize their ability to gap close. The main theme for the Promotion should be about your Bow and your melee capabilities should be a small part of the kit. If the base Ranger is 25/25 in terms of Ranged/Melee power the Archer Promotion should  double or triple his Ranged output to 75/25.

Warden Leather Armor Bow & 2-Hand Melee

The Hyrbid or Survivalist that strikes a balance in both Ranged and Melee prowess. The theme for this Promotion should be about the synergy between your Ranged and Melee Tray and they should build upon one another. Think skirmisher that utilizes hit and run tactics wearing his opponents down before going in for the kill. After the Warden Promotion his Ranged and Melee output should land in the 50/50 range.

Brigand Mail armor - Dual Wield & Short Bow

The theme for this Promotion should be Traps and Debuffs. A more melee focused build that wears Mail armor and sets up Ambushes for the unsuspecting. Unlike the patient assassin that is waiting for the right moment to strike, the Brigand is less concerned about who falls into his trap as his Debuffs will give him the upper-hand once the trap is sprung. The Brigand Promotion should be the opposite of the Archer with a 25/75 Melee focused power output.

 

Please add on to the discussion so we can have the Ranger class we all want to play. The Promotion tree's can really add lots of variants that can push different gameplay styles before the addition of Disciplines.

 

 

 

 

Edited by Sorrows
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  • 2 weeks later...

Totally agree with your points, would love to see animal companions be a fluff version of some passive\active bonus, and not some extra damage "second enemy to have to attack". 

Would like to see the "stealth" option for Ranger to be more as you say, camoflauge where its more about being hidden from sight while scouting out enemies, and not just trying to be another stealthy assassin.

More thematic nature-survivalist would be nice to see.

Edited by ArngrimTV
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The animal companion is imo too much fluff and hype.  Its been used to death in nearly every game.

 

The kits each class got ATM are actually really stong and I personally would only look at the atcher - since that “stationary” buff is not realistic under 95% of the circumstances in the game.

 

making the Camouflage a base part of the kit - fun amd awesome to have - but imo also OP.  Too many eggs in one basket.

Huginn ok Muninn, fljúga hverjan dag, Jörmungrund yfir; óumk ek of Hugin,, at hann aftr né komi-t, þó sjámk meir of Munin

Gathering of Ranger videos

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As a Brigand, the one thing I long for is a trap I can set while stealthed.  It would be perfect for cat-and-mouse games with other stealthers.  I would gladly give up Ambush for it.  Frankly, Ambush makes me feel like an off-brand assassin.  

Edit: I also would like to see Warden get a passive that would decrease bow range while also decreasing the cooldown on Rapid Fire.  It could be something like the Sanctifier's passive -- optional.

Edited by Pwca
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10 hours ago, Soulreaver said:

The animal companion is imo too much fluff and hype.  Its been used to death in nearly every game.

Pets have certainly been used in almost every game for the Ranger/Hunter class, but animal companions are certainly more rare. I can honestly go either way with them, but I think they fit the theme of the class well without putting to much stress on ACE to figure out how to make a "good" pet class.

10 hours ago, Soulreaver said:

The kits each class got ATM are actually really stong and I personally would only look at the atcher - since that “stationary” buff is not realistic under 95% of the circumstances in the game.

Totally agree that the kits have gotten way better for every class especially after the quick short-pass and talent swapping they did for rangers. Moving the bombs to Brigand was solid and the addition of Suppression on Aero-Spin when talented really feels solid. I do think it's unrealistic under current game play for the Archer to be stationary, but in certain instances he will really shine and that makes it OK for the first pass.

10 hours ago, Soulreaver said:

making the Camouflage a base part of the kit - fun amd awesome to have - but imo also OP.  Too many eggs in one basket.

I have to disagree with this entirely as all Assassins have access to stealth which is a far more powerful tool than my suggestion of Camouflage and how it would work. Of course the counter argument is Assassins "need" stealth, but I also believe that is unfounded as some games have really done Assassin classes with little to no stealth. Take GW2 Thief class which has limited stealth in combat or Albion Online which offers a similar limited stealth mechanic. 

However, I do believe Camouflage would need to be balanced properly, but considering no class, disciplines or talents have really been balanced other than to tweak something that is completely out of whack there is plenty of time for ACE to get it done if they choose to go that route.

Edited by Sorrows
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2 hours ago, Sorrows said:

Pets have certainly been used in almost every game for the Ranger/Hunter class, but animal companions are certainly more rare. I can honestly go either way with them, but I think they fit the theme of the class well without putting to much stress on ACE to figure out how to make a "good" pet class.

Totally agree that the kits have gotten way better for every class especially after the quick short-pass and talent swapping they did for rangers. Moving the bombs to Brigand was solid and the addition of Suppression on Aero-Spin when talented really feels solid. I do think it's unrealistic under current game play for the Archer to be stationary, but in certain instances he will really shine and that makes it OK for the first pass.

I have to disagree with this entirely as all Assassins have access to stealth which is a far more powerful tool than my suggestion of Camouflage and how it would work. Of course the counter argument is Assassins "need" stealth, but I also believe that is unfounded as some games have really done Assassin classes with little to no stealth. Take GW2 Thief class which has limited stealth in combat or Albion Online which offers a similar limited stealth mechanic. 

However, I do believe Camouflage would need to be balanced properly, but considering no class, disciplines or talents have really been balanced other than to tweak something that is completely out of whack there is plenty of time for ACE to get it done if they choose to go that route.

Having a class that get both stealth -and- anti stealth as part of their kit shouldnt be possible is all Im saying.

 

So while I can justify the Brigand due to the heavy specilisation in melee - I cant for the Warden and Archer.

Huginn ok Muninn, fljúga hverjan dag, Jörmungrund yfir; óumk ek of Hugin,, at hann aftr né komi-t, þó sjámk meir of Munin

Gathering of Ranger videos

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42 minutes ago, Soulreaver said:

Having a class that get both stealth -and- anti stealth as part of their kit shouldnt be possible is all Im saying.

 

So while I can justify the Brigand due to the heavy specilisation in melee - I cant for the Warden and Archer.

I don't care about the balance implications as much as i care about granting camo as a class ability pretty much poorly made socksting on the major race advantage of guinecians and wood elves.

If you want camo, play a wood elf. That's the trade off.

LMAO my website is broken please click this to apply to Flames of Exile (maybe, if that's not busted too)

On 5/11/2015 at 1:48 PM, CAWCAWCAW said:

Rub rock on face and say "Yes food is eaten now time for fight"

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7 hours ago, Pwca said:

As a Brigand, the one thing I long for is a trap I can set while stealthed.  It would be perfect for cat-and-mouse games with other stealthers.  I would gladly give up Ambush for it.  Frankly, Ambush makes me feel like an off-brand assassin.  

Edit: I also would like to see Warden get a passive that would decrease bow range while also decreasing the cooldown on Rapid Fire.  It could be something like the Sanctifier's passive -- optional.

When you posted this you could set all three of your brigand traps in stealth. Brigands got stealth trapping fixed and two additional traps as 5.8 came to live.

Did you actually try to put your traps on your stealth bar?

Edited by PopeUrban

LMAO my website is broken please click this to apply to Flames of Exile (maybe, if that's not busted too)

On 5/11/2015 at 1:48 PM, CAWCAWCAW said:

Rub rock on face and say "Yes food is eaten now time for fight"

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On 12/21/2018 at 8:23 PM, PopeUrban said:

When you posted this you could set all three of your brigand traps in stealth. Brigands got stealth trapping fixed and two additional traps as 5.8 came to live.

Did you actually try to put your traps on your stealth bar?

Thanks for enlightening me.  I've been so conditioned by the strictly segregated bars that I didn't even try. Things just got a lot more interesting.

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On 12/21/2018 at 5:58 PM, Sorrows said:

Of course the counter argument is Assassins "need" stealth, but I also believe that is unfounded as some games have really done Assassin classes with little to no stealth. Take GW2 Thief class which has limited stealth in combat or Albion Online which offers a similar limited stealth mechanic. 

The most popular thief builds for a large majority of the lifespan of competitive GW2 was D/P which gave you access to perma stealth with a short bow on second tray. 

That said, id like to see that ranger tree be closer to a S/D or S/P thief, which was always more fun to play than D/P

Edited by Jjusticar
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I played the archer seemed like it was designed for wall defence in keep/forts however there a couple problems

- Lack range even with max range cap to do a whole lot especially on keeps walls and things, you can shoot the tanks i guess but get pulled or knockbacked off it. Realy need an extra 10-15 range/cap as the arch spec they are spose to be sniperish
- Standing on walls are deathtraps more than anything, you wont realy get a kill or make an impact up there so your not realy ding anything but its only a matter of time before you get pulled off the wall into the horde below :P My solution to here is archer passive (Or archer stake could work too) when it triggers the charge time bonus so after 2 shots standing still you get the grounded buff where your immune to knockup/pulls (can still be CCed or knockdown just not moved) this leave u vunerable to being pulled off the walls at the start when you getting those leftclick to trigger the effect but once ur situation you can actually try doing something

Veeshan Midst of UXA

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Grounded buff seems like a cool idea veeshan. I’d actually rather see it as a power than passive tho, maybe a 30 second duration with a 45 second cool down. It would fit nicely on the sharp shooter discipline if not in the promotion path. 

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Make grounded mode a toggle power that replaces hunker down IMO. Grant it with the archery subclass.

Immune to movement CC, -25% move speed,cancelled by dodge, +10% mitigations

can only slot in ranged tray.

Attaching a movement rebuff to it would help prevent it from being used in the open field where the archery spec is already mobile enough, but allow archers to set up on walls and rocks in a "tactical superiority" position where being stationary should be to their advantage.

LMAO my website is broken please click this to apply to Flames of Exile (maybe, if that's not busted too)

On 5/11/2015 at 1:48 PM, CAWCAWCAW said:

Rub rock on face and say "Yes food is eaten now time for fight"

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On 29/12/2018 at 12:39 AM, Glory said:

Grounded buff seems like a cool idea veeshan. I’d actually rather see it as a power than passive tho, maybe a 30 second duration with a 45 second cool down. It would fit nicely on the sharp shooter discipline if not in the promotion path. 

can add it to archer stake 

Veeshan Midst of UXA

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