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radical3d

Pvp Rewards

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I have been playing Crowfall about 8 days now pretty solid, both Test and Live. I mean the game is exactly what I am looking for all the gear is player made, the crafting system is aggravatingly satisfying and 5.8 looks like PVP is currently being pushed in the right direction.

Rewards for pvp for a sandbox game are always very important, and after talking to some of the veterans of the game I am seeing a gaping hole in PVP rewards on the battlefield. In open field during the levelling process or farming process the players inventory is a great drive to kill someone. However after that I have been told the amount of export you get from your spirit bank will be the reward for winning a campaign (this is awesome).

This causes a huge issue with the losing factions wanting to log in with no DAILY CARROT ON A STICK. Now the lads and lady's here at crowfall may already have a juicy daily carrot on a stick which will allow a underwhelming faction to earn something in pvp for time played/ players killed we do not know about.

My example would be, Faction Rank (titles), Maybe pvp levels (unlocking bar slots for juicy Utility) extra cap / stats, not to much but little carrots.


I know if I was in a losing faction but I was battle siege master grand daddy Radical3d, with 2 extra bar slots and able to optimise my gear because I got an extra 20 stat points/ stat cap in whatever I choose I would feel more comfortable logging in with a group of 6 - 12 against overwhelming odds knowing that the xxxxx amount of hours spent, would make me stand out in pvp for my faction. Player driven goals are always nice, aiming for a title to show off in your community/ guilds, going through the hardships that come with it sometimes can be the building blocks of something bigger in games.

Thank you for Reading

Radical < 3

Edited by radical3d

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12 hours ago, radical3d said:

I am seeing a gaping hole in PVP rewards on the battlefield.

I agree with this. Hopefully as we start fully testing the Campaign game loop in 5.8 and beyond we'll see some type of immediate reward system for capturing objectives or holding territory in addition to the accumulation of points for an eventual team win. It seems strange to me that in a pvp-focused game, pvp activities always feel like a net personal loss (gear decay) compared to pve or harvesting.


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GW2 system i think would be nice, when taking points in the WvW you get a reward usualy a bit of coin and some XP, occasional some crafting items aswell.


Veeshan Midst of UXA

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all of this, for sure, should be in this game because pvp for pvp never working ok. but the main problem in near future is how they distribute players between faction.

whole system can be fatally broken since you should take faction. problems:

1) new players will take faction which are winning most of the time

2) guild players who was not so fast on map starting vs locking faction size

3) dominion faction/guild will ruin whole opposition and the reason to even try to start

4) contract campaigns which have empty 2 sides and full 3-th side for example

and soo much more issues which I watched in every GvG games.

no healty factions -> no decent pvp -> no game -> delete. pvp rewards? you sure? -=)


crowfall pvp makkonMyrmidon statement: Out of Fury

Discord makkon#8550

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Just throwing ideas out here ... but what about a unique essence that only drops from player deaths? Obviously to unlock special crafting gear from recipes found in the environment. 

Actually nevermind , this would lead to people creating sub accounts and farming this essence... 

Edited by ilogos

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3 hours ago, makkon said:

all of this, for sure, should be in this game because pvp for pvp never working ok. but the main problem in near future is how they distribute players between faction.

whole system can be fatally broken since you should take faction. problems:

1) new players will take faction which are winning most of the time

2) guild players who was not so fast on map starting vs locking faction size

3) dominion faction/guild will ruin whole opposition and the reason to even try to start

4) contract campaigns which have empty 2 sides and full 3-th side for example

and soo much more issues which I watched in every GvG games.

no healty factions -> no decent pvp -> no game -> delete. pvp rewards? you sure? -=)

I think that's a bad assumption. 

The faction world's are more or less the learning to play realms, or the casual player realms, and will not be the home of larger guilds.   Guilds are all chomping at the bit to get out of the faction kiddie pool, and into the deep end.

Factions are going to be where casual players learn how to play the game, fight a few battles in sub par gear, and find guilds to join.

Faction was done by ACE first, because it's hardest. When your teammates are programmatically enforced, ACE has to consider all the ways an invulnerable teammate can troll you. For example by taking all the vendor slots, which you can't attack to remove.

With Guild v Guild, which is where the "real" game is going to be, if you don't like something somewhere, blow it up, move it, or otherwise banish or punish the troll through guild systems.

If a guild is winning, they basically have won, and the campaign will end.

Quote

HOW BIG DO YOU EXPECT EACH CAMPAIGN TO BE? HOW LONG WILL THEY LAST?

----

As for time scale, we expect Campaigns to last anywhere from one to three months. Technically they can be shorter or longer, so we’ll put up a handful of options, and see which are most popular. Some Campaigns will be time-limited, and others will end based on a triggered event (i.e one faction or guild takes over the entire map).

 

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1 hour ago, ilogos said:

Just throwing ideas out here ... but what about a unique essence that only drops from player deaths? Obviously to unlock special crafting gear from recipes found in the environment. 

Actually nevermind , this would lead to people creating sub accounts and farming this essence... 

We already have skulls if you manage to behead an enemy.

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15 hours ago, makkon said:

So this is a faction balance issue this is a different issue but I believe this is an easier fix then a REAL ISSUE.

"1) new players will take faction which are winning most of the time

2) guild players who was not so fast on map starting vs locking faction size

3) dominion faction/guild will ruin whole opposition and the reason to even try to start

4) contract campaigns which have empty 2 sides and full 3-th side for example

and soo much more issues which I watched in every GvG games.

no healty factions -> no decent pvp -> no game -> delete. pvp rewards? you sure? -=)"

The only Pvp game I know of where 3 realms/factions was a game called Dark Age of Camelot. For those that played it, I am pretty sure they would say it was a GOLDEN age for PVP. FACTION BALANCE is not what it seems in games like this in my opinion. Its not 150 vs 150 vs 150, or everyone having equal gear. 

Ill give you a good example on Dark age of Camelot you had 3 factions, one with 2000 the second with 1500 and the third with 600 at max level. This may seem unfair? However the realm with 600 people often took the objective (DARKNESS FALLS), people gravitated to that realm not only for its lore and levelling aspect, because of its tight nit community. It only takes one leader to run down 2 to 3 forts, organisation is key in big battles. 

Having a number disadvantage makes for a difference in tactics / taking fights where the other two teams are already fighting was often a Hibernia(smallest realm) thing.New players might find themselves in the popular realms, they may even find themselves struggling to get a guild or group for pvp, even though there are more opportunity's to fight big realms/ guilds often have restrictions and requirements because they have the members they need already.

So what I am trying to get across here is at points you may feel like one side has the upper hand but all it takes its 1 person with some sort of realm respect to log on and all of a sudden a forts taken that you need.    

11 hours ago, KrakkenSmacken said:

Faction was done by ACE first, because it's hardest. When your teammates are programmatically enforced, ACE has to consider all the ways an invulnerable teammate can troll you. For example by taking all the vendor slots, which you can't attack to remove.

With Guild v Guild, which is where the "real" game is going to be, if you don't like something somewhere, blow it up, move it, or otherwise banish or punish the troll through guild systems.

If a guild is winning, they basically have won, and the campaign will end.

This is also a really good point I did not know about, which will stop ENDLESS TORMENT if one guild it over dominant thank you so much for the information. 

Thank you for both of your reply's, any contribution is welcome. 

 

Edited by radical3d

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There is absolutely nothing wrong with enjoying faction play, but in crowfall's case faction campaigns are intended to be "the farm league" where NPCs were nice enough to place all of the buildings and siege spots ahead of time and everyone is guaranteed to have allies because there are only three teams.

They're not designed for the kind of guilds currently dominating them, and the plan if for their rewards to be significantly less than the "pro league" campaigns where all factions are created and run by players.

This is a problem that will eventually sort itself out. If one faction is roflstomping a campaigns, the goal is that the campaign will be over quite quickly because they've won. That's the entire point of campaigns they're supposed to directly combat the feeling of logging in to a game you have no chance of competing in by allowing winners to win, losers to lose, and everyone to move on to somewhere else where they all have a fighting chance again.

It now falls to ACE to figure out scoring systems and victory conditions that make this a reality.


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Rub rock on face and say "Yes food is eaten now time for fight"

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I think there should be a pvp reward .....of a different type. Not like Guild wars or CU where whatever it is is dished out at the end of a campaign after calculations ....but  I also agree roughly with "The reward is pvp" sentiment above.

The easiest (read least time to implement for the devs and once in code there would be very little management required (or maybe another knob to slide) ) would be if a buff to the faction who has asset control of more than 50% in any particular zone. Eg If Chaos has 51% + ownership of Nesa (or what ever that map is called) chaos players in that specific zone receive some sort of harvesting buff. This would tie in well with the anti slippery slope mechanisms they are trying to introduce because although it rewards the winning side it means for that same side to "lever this advantage" they must introduce more squishy harvesters into the fray.  It would be similar to how eve online handles its system sovereignty for corporations. You could even go one step further and reward the most active guild in that faction responsible for the domination of that zone by giving them an increased buff over the faction buff ............

Anyway just trying to think outside the box.

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