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kajidourden

Leveling

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43 minutes ago, kajidourden said:

Right, you can't manage to put together a cohesive argument....quick, better deflect!  

I already did, you chose to hogwash instead soooooo not my problem I guess.  Any time you wanna play league though hit me up, last time I cared about ranked I got to plat 1 but could never win my series; I'd love to crush you in that game too. 


This post was paid for by "Mandalore for Emulated CF Community Manager 2032™". 

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1 minute ago, mandalore said:

I already did, you chose to hogwash instead soooooo not my problem I guess.  Any time you wanna play league though hit me up, last time I cared about ranked I got to plat 1 but could never win my series; I'd love to crush you in that game too. 

The tryhard is strong with this one

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1 hour ago, mandalore said:

I already did, you chose to hogwash instead soooooo not my problem I guess.  Any time you wanna play league though hit me up, last time I cared about ranked I got to plat 1 but could never win my series; I'd love to crush you in that game too. 

real men, play dota. snowflakes play lol. z;p

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I stopped playing LoL years ago when I found out the parent company was one of the developers of the Chinese social credit score system.

No way will I ever knowingly support a company that participated in that.

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1 hour ago, KrakkenSmacken said:

I stopped playing LoL years ago when I found out the parent company was one of the developers of the Chinese social credit score system.

No way will I ever knowingly support a company that participated in that.

That was a long ass time ago. 


This post was paid for by "Mandalore for Emulated CF Community Manager 2032™". 

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4 minutes ago, mandalore said:

That was a long ass time ago. 

Riot is 100% owned by tencent as of Aug of this year (Link)

Social credit and tencent

Quote

In 2015, the People's Bank of China licensed eight companies to begin a trial of social credit systems. Among these eight firms is Sesame Credit, owned by Alibaba Group, Tencent, as well as China’s biggest ride-sharing and online-dating service, Didi Chuxing and Baihe.com, respectively. In general, multiple firms are collaborating with the government to develop the system of software and algorithms used to calculate credit.

...

In November, a detailed plan was produced for further implementation of the program for 2018-2020. The plans included black listing people from public transport and publicly disclosing individuals' and businesses' untrustworthiness rating.

It's not a long ass time ago, its today, ongoing, and getting worse. It's a dystopian governmental control nightmare coming to life right before our eyes, and like it or not Riot games is part of that behemoth. 

Now, back to our regularly scheduled leveling outrage thread.

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On 12/22/2018 at 5:11 PM, kajidourden said:

You keep bringing up how easy it is to bypass the xp system.  If that's the case then it's totally pointless to even have it since everyone will simply sacrifice their way out of it, which is really making my argument for me.

Not everyone ... the sacrifice system is a choice.  Some will use it as much as possible to level quickly.  And some like me are comfortable with a bit of PvE leveling and getting used to my skills.  The leveling process seems pretty quick.  I played for less than a day without PvP only using a few sacs and was level 11 with intermediate gear.  So far it does not seem a difficult feat.  But its still early so we'll see :).  

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On 12/22/2018 at 9:00 PM, kajidourden said:

Ultimately this is all about skill acquisition.  If you were at least given half of your skills up-front then you could have the CHOICE about how to grind out your levels.  Right now the only option is to go out and PvE for X amount of time.  Druids can't even heal until level effing 20!  Gutting classes of their core skills and then forcing people to grind PvE to get them is not a good idea.  

The reason to do that with druids was because prior to 5.8 people had a very difficult time understanding how druids were designed to work.

 

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Leveling is a poor design choice for Crowfall. Players shouldn't be forced into leveling, when this isn't a PvE based game. Resources are the main "PvE" component that we're fighting for. I've said it once before in the 5.8 Gripes thread, leveling in Crowfall is poorly designed, since it doesn't fit. Opening up Disc to allow player experimentation is fine. But locking skills away behind them is very bad. New players (like myself) come in and are confused and have no real clue on what to do. What do you want players initial reaction to be when they first get into the game? "Let me see what I need to grind first." or "What do my skills do." 

Having to grind to Level 5 for a major disc then craft Stonemason just so you can make frames to turn in to sacrifice is ridiculous and I'd rather be spending my time working on my craft then going out of my way to skirt/cheese a poorly implemented leveling system. Not to mention the monster respawn time is quite long in some instances and there's far too much open space where mobs SHOULD be placed for leveling that aren't. It's one of the main reasons why I personally pledged for this game, no leveling system.  Being able to hop into the action or start your ideal craft should be on your list of priorities. Not having to go through the same leveling bullpunch every time you make a new character. 

"If you don't like leveling, Crowfall isn't the game for you." - No. People get tired of doing the same systematic nonsense they've been doing for well over a decade in any MMORPG. This isn't World of Warcraft, this isn't FFXIV, this isnt' Blade 'n Soul/TERA, etc etc. We're Crowfall, a PvP Throne War MMO.To throw leveling into the mix of stuff we already have to do on our bucket list, feels like a lazy development choice and otherwise tacked on. You can tell it wasn't 100% thought out due to how poorly the exp rates are and how it frustrates players into having to look for alternative ways to cheat the system (i.e Frames) 

Every stream I've gone to has told me the same thing for leveling. 

ModeratorVerifiedNightbot: Fastest way to 30: Get to level 5, to open your first Major Discipline slot. Then farm ~100 non-basic ore and ~100 non-basic trees. Craft yourself the Stonemason discipline and go to the Stonemason table in a keep. Use the ore to craft carpentry nails, and then those with wood to make Architect Frames. They sacrifice for 800 xp per. Use gold to fill in the gaps so you aren't using frames to get the last 100 xp for a level or something.... Step 2: Profit

 

This shouldn't be the norm.

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Posted (edited)
8 minutes ago, RhapsodyDownpour said:


ModeratorVerifiedNightbot: Fastest way to 30: Get to level 5, to open your first Major Discipline slot. Then farm ~100 non-basic ore and ~100 non-basic trees. Craft yourself the Stonemason discipline and go to the Stonemason table in a keep. Use the ore to craft carpentry nails, and then those with wood to make Architect Frames. They sacrifice for 800 xp per. Use gold to fill in the gaps so you aren't using frames to get the last 100 xp for a level or something.... Step 2: Profit

 

This shouldn't be the norm.

@jtoddcoleman @thomasblair 

We have kind of bastardized the leveling system because it’s almost universally hated. 

 

It it takes about an hour and half in spring and you can do it outside the temples never once being ganked

Edited by mandalore

This post was paid for by "Mandalore for Emulated CF Community Manager 2032™". 

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Posted (edited)
On 1/4/2019 at 8:46 PM, mandalore said:

@jtoddcoleman @thomasblair 

We have kind of bastardized the leveling system because it’s almost universally hated. 

 

It it takes about an hour and half in spring and you can do it outside the temples never once being ganked

I mean if this is the kind of response we're getting from someone who supposed to be a development partner, it clearly shows taking criticism isn't your strong suite and your position as a development partner should be re-considered. You're obviously being sarcastic in an attempt to be humorous to the devs and to get a good laugh among your peers via Discord or other social media. So how about we stop acting childish and have an actual conversation. 

 

If you didn't understand my point, I'll water it down. 

  • Leveling Systems as a whole does not fit well into Crowfall's mold in my opinion. 
  • Players shouldn't be pidgeonholed into having to grind to 5 and then do that first hour of grinding just so they can max out.
  • There are not enough PvE mobs on the map to justify this kind of system right now. PvE is not the focus of the game outside of just materials.
  • If Crowfall goes this route, then make mobs another resource to fight over and give higher experience.
  • Players who have 0 interest in the crafting aspect aren't going to like this. I'm guessing you expect them to beg over chat for frames.
  • 5 Years in development and this is the best we could come up with for progression.
Edited by RhapsodyDownpour

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Posted (edited)
16 minutes ago, RhapsodyDownpour said:

I mean if this is the kind of response we're getting from someone who supposed to be a development partner, it clearly shows taking criticism isn't your strong suite and your position as a development partner should be re-considered. You're obviously being sarcastic in an attempt to be humorous to the devs and to get a good laugh among your peers via Discord or other social media. So how about we stop acting childish and have an actual conversation. 

 

If you didn't understand my point, I'll water it down. 

  • Leveling Systems as a whole does not fit well into Crowfall's mold in my opinion. 
  • Players shouldn't be pidgeonholed into having to grind to 5 and then do that first hour of grinding just so they can max out.
  • There are not enough PvE mobs on the map to justify this kind of system right now. PvE is not the focus of the game outside of just materials.
  • If Crowfall goes this route, then make mobs another resource to fight over and give higher experience.
  • Players who have 0 interest in the crafting aspect aren't going to like this. I'm guessing you expect them to beg over chat for frames.
  • 5 Years in development and this is the best we could come up with for progression.

You whinge a lot.  I’m not a crafter but crafters have found an exploit to leveling that everybody uses.  My statement was about fixing the existing system not reverting it to something else entirely.  

 

Is telling the devs they are taking too long (5 years) going to make them work faster?  Nothing worth doing is easy, give them time and adult through it.  

Whats a dev partner?  

Edited by mandalore

This post was paid for by "Mandalore for Emulated CF Community Manager 2032™". 

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Posted (edited)

Not 

7 minutes ago, mandalore said:

You whinge a lot.  I’m not a crafter but crafters have found an exploit to leveling that everybody uses.  My statement was about fixing the existing system not reverting it to something else entirely.  

 

Is telling the devs they are taking too long (5 years) going to make them work faster?  Nothing worth doing is easy, give them time and adult through it.  

Whats a dev partner?  

 

Not sure what "Whinge" is. If you can't have a conversation with someone on this board without actually insulting them, then I suggest you find someone else to talk to. I haven't insulted you or made rude comments towards you. I'd appreciate it if you did the same and showed civility. Others here may not like you, but I don't sit in their camp. 

Also check your name. Furthermore, leveling in most MMORPG's at this point is quite draconian in the regard that you are working for chickenfeed experience. Crowfall had my interest since it had no leveling in it at the time, but this is still in development and not a full game, so I get what I pay for, but I'm also going to speak with my wallet here and say this isn't something the players as a whole should be forcefed, I don't think we asked for this, unless there was a stream I missed where the developers put up a poll asking whether or not we wanted a leveling system. 

 Also, you used the term "exploit" if it's an exploit, should it not be fixed or was that not the word intended to be used to structure your argument? If anything, killing other players should net that much experience to encourage skirmishes, not fancy walkabouts and leisurely strolls, which is what Crowfall is right now. By the time the development has reached its peak, I don't think much of the playerbase is going to be too enthused to actually stick it out, but we'll see. After all, Rome wasn't built in a day. 

Edited by RhapsodyDownpour

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I don’t know what to tell you.  There are no answers that you WANT to hear here.  Sorry bromego.  

Leveling is fine imo.  It needs some balancing and tweaks but gutting and starting over seems like a poor idea.  

I don’t work for ACE, I’m not an employee.  I’m a customer.  Civility isn’t very important to me personally but I do try to follow the TOS (I don’t like making Jackal and Pann work harder).  Post some constructive ideas that don’t take months of reworking systems and potentially waste limited funds.  

 


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Posted (edited)
On 04/01/2019 at 22:37, RhapsodyDownpour said:

Leveling is a poor design choice for Crowfall. Players shouldn't be forced into leveling, when this isn't a PvE based game. Resources are the main "PvE" component that we're fighting for. I've said it once before in the 5.8 Gripes thread, leveling in Crowfall is poorly designed, since it doesn't fit. Opening up Disc to allow player experimentation is fine. But locking skills away behind them is very bad. New players (like myself) come in and are confused and have no real clue on what to do. What do you want players initial reaction to be when they first get into the game? "Let me see what I need to grind first." or "What do my skills do." 

Having to grind to Level 5 for a major disc then craft Stonemason just so you can make frames to turn in to sacrifice is ridiculous and I'd rather be spending my time working on my craft then going out of my way to skirt/cheese a poorly implemented leveling system. Not to mention the monster respawn time is quite long in some instances and there's far too much open space where mobs SHOULD be placed for leveling that aren't. It's one of the main reasons why I personally pledged for this game, no leveling system.  Being able to hop into the action or start your ideal craft should be on your list of priorities. Not having to go through the same leveling bullpunch every time you make a new character. 

"If you don't like leveling, Crowfall isn't the game for you." - No. People get tired of doing the same systematic nonsense they've been doing for well over a decade in any MMORPG. This isn't World of Warcraft, this isn't FFXIV, this isnt' Blade 'n Soul/TERA, etc etc. We're Crowfall, a PvP Throne War MMO.To throw leveling into the mix of stuff we already have to do on our bucket list, feels like a lazy development choice and otherwise tacked on. You can tell it wasn't 100% thought out due to how poorly the exp rates are and how it frustrates players into having to look for alternative ways to cheat the system (i.e Frames) 

Every stream I've gone to has told me the same thing for leveling. 

ModeratorVerifiedNightbot: Fastest way to 30: Get to level 5, to open your first Major Discipline slot. Then farm ~100 non-basic ore and ~100 non-basic trees. Craft yourself the Stonemason discipline and go to the Stonemason table in a keep. Use the ore to craft carpentry nails, and then those with wood to make Architect Frames. They sacrifice for 800 xp per. Use gold to fill in the gaps so you aren't using frames to get the last 100 xp for a level or something.... Step 2: Profit

 

This shouldn't be the norm.

 

I agree. This progression model is totally outdated and hiding the PVP behind a repetitive PVE is asking to have a stagnant game as it is now.

In my opinion, it is enough for the DEVs to make the PVP and PVE progression system together. The player does PVP with elements of PVE from the first moment, but always competing against another players directly or indirectly and not just killing mobs or collecting resources repeatedly like a brainless bot. CrowFall should be a competitive game from the start. In my view a player should try to gain more skills with smooth progression to not generate powercreep (a better equipment set is one consequence and not requirement to PVP).

Edited by hamon

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20 minutes ago, RhapsodyDownpour said:

Also check your name. Furthermore, leveling in most MMORPG's at this point is quite draconian in the regard that you are working for chickenfeed experience. Crowfall had my interest since it had no leveling in it at the time, but this is still in development and not a full game, so I get what I pay for, but I'm also going to speak with my wallet here and say this isn't something the players as a whole should be forcefed, I don't think we asked for this, unless there was a stream I missed where the developers put up a poll asking whether or not we wanted a leveling system. 

Anyone that gave them enough money gets a forum title and access to a private subforum where the devs actually interact with players, unlike the rest of the forums. You could check the devtracker to see how little they actually interact with players, but that function has been broken for a very long time.

You did miss when they changed the leveling system, a couple months ago.They wanted to give 'progression' like other mmo's and for players that play for 'achievements' in games

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Posted (edited)

Can the noobs all get together and figure out what they want? Last patch you wanted a progression system. This patch its the opposite. Figure it out and get back to me.

Also the I speak for everyone hogwash is just that. Have a nice day!

Edited by Zatch
In the tub and dropped my phone

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8 minutes ago, hamon said:

I agree. This progression model is totally outdated and hiding the PVP behind a repetitive PVE is asking to have a stagnant game as it is now.

The model does somewhat work for games that have PvE elements like storyline, quests, leveled zones, ect. Even then many folks demand separate pvp gear and such. 

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