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DealsTru

Unforseen Chat trade spammers? Bubbles! + Player Role Tags)

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1) "Proximity Chat Bubbles" : 
An alternative to voice comms and to reduce clutter of spam/fast scrolling chat box resulting in a miss read...(due to Trade/Grouping/Gold Sellers/Item Finding chat spammers likely to come to this game..) .. Is it possible to do bubbles? Even if it just the minimum of a head up display displaying nothing but "..." above their head in certain zones to indicate the player in visual proximity of you said something in chat?
But more likely if possible Id rather see a Bubble with text. And when in combat mode either be with text character limit / reduced text size/ way above the character model / auto adjusting size on screen,  if your in "combat mode" so then also still be able to see your action combat targets.
(When you think about it Players in intense combat can't really type much anyway, but still make sure to also then atleast allow the option to turn bubbles on/off of course.)

Furthermore bubbles in my opinion are immediate attention catching, and would give starting zones a more lively city like feeling of bubble advertisements to their EK vendor server names/rare item offers/cheap or free giveaways to late joiners/guild recruiters/ 2nd account character shouting various information / forming quick safe random harvest groups /etc.

.. Plus they are fun seeing pre-battle social instigating stuff around enemy factions. Prompting the keep defenders to come out and fight, or maybe a possible negotiation for a faction team up?
 
Even after a deathblow, show a bubble... (in this game it would be like the crow spirit speaking/complaining out of its dead body/bone-pile before they accept back to temple..:D.
(Here is fun small example of a old SWG game video showing a Failed Bounty Hunter getting ganked by another Bounty Hunter player. Saying his 2 cents for nearby players to see before he spawns back Fail Bounty Hunter )
 

2) Above character head "Text Titles": Like in Star Wars Galaxies, can we get a form of showing a selected above head "Text Title" obtained by tree skill/mastery/branch. Or a option to examine a player for further info on a players (offered desired roles) in large factions? Helps to find a specific profession advertising player needed to contact for certain crafting mats or combat skill offerings for quick grouping.

..I get Discord has a role option, but ingame is always better to quickly see a title and ask someone if they have or can make a quick crafted component/ ask for help/ or just see all the many different roles available around you... feeling like a lived in campaign.

This then also gives an additional fun mechanic to the player of option to at times then select a "fooling - lesser" obtained title to onlooking enemies in combat zones. An enemy sees them as a crafter/ lesser branch of a skill tree.. but in reality they are also skilled far in combat trees/XP leveled too. (A turn of tide scenario to a failed attempted solo gank. or a trick to look like a newbie to them, hopefully then they leave you alone...heh, hopeful!..)

Edited by DealsTru

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i believe there is a /say command which is local chat already in-game. this should probably display in one of the other tabs apart from zone or general. such as me or even a local tab. I don't like the idea of multiple chat bubble popping up from everyone to start filling the screen.

 

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9 hours ago, sanfall said:

i believe there is a /say command which is local chat already in-game. this should probably display in one of the other tabs apart from zone or general. such as me or even a local tab. I don't like the idea of multiple chat bubble popping up from everyone to start filling the screen.

I don't even check the multiple prompts of the other chat tabs even as of now. Hard to click them number one, and you receive too many.  Plus it doesn't fix the problem of a spam crowded scrolling general chat that is yet to really be seen.

I believe when the game gets going and the way crafting is, you will start to see more spam, especially for good sales/grouping. Bubbles would at least help see a character in front of you trying to get your/groups quick attention. Or to see messages/advertisements of characters around you much easier.

You should only really have 1 maybe 2 message tabs/separate chat windows to keep an eye on. A Combat/Faction/Me/Group or Guild chat with customization to possibly be in just one tab/window with different colors. And then a window for "proximity" shout outs or trade discussion window for proximity bubbles of spam advertisements.  

ehn56r.jpg

Since again, its hard to click on multiple chat tabs these 2 windows could essentially be always on.
You use to be able to key "Alt" to switch to mouse mode.. but now it only possible with opening a window i guess.

An option to turn bubbles off with hotkey would be nice addition to this feature as well.
I honestly think though that it's crucial for this game to atleast have the option of bubbles for the general/multiple playstyle population.

Edited by DealsTru

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Ok, so you don't like the multiple chat tabs and that should be limited to small numbers. Got it. but you also suggested it could be a simple icon with "..." which indicate there is chat somewhere. I may not be understanding what you are suggesting, but isn't it the same has switching to the specified tab with a dot indicating new chat? I think you need to expand on your explanation so we understand what you are trying to suggest so we don't misunderstand what you are trying to say.

If what you are suggesting is a "..." where players needs to click on it to read what is said, i think even you won't waste your time clicking on it to read it all the time.

 

As for chat spam, I think it works for chat bubbles too. If there are lots of chat bubbles, most people stop reading it. Its like something they wish they can turn off. Imagine in combat, suddenly there are chat bubbles everywhere. That will distract you during combat and probably require more computing resources (although i'm no expert in this). In big cities, people will just skip all the chat bubbles anyway, and if its trade, traders will spam general so more people read their trade spam.

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"..." above a character head would visually indicate what player character is talking. I meant this is the minimum visual prompt alternative to then look to your chat window if full text bubbles above head wouldn't work.(a standard text window might scroll too fast)
This would be the restriction to being in combat mode or say a restricted bubble zone.
(maybe could display the first few text words/way above head/or smaller text.. but could possible still be distracting in combat)

Full chat bubbles maybe only allowable back at the beachhead for services and advertisements.

I uploaded a sample improved chat box above. Hopefully that explains a more simplified chat view with the bubbles also being a viewing option in certain places (as i would assume yes, spam on those channels might scroll faster in certain zones.)



 

Edited by DealsTru

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2 hours ago, sanfall said:

, traders will spam general so more people read their trade spam.

This right here is what bubbles may help with.
If there is trade spam on multiple channels.. then at least bubbles would allow you to talk to the "viewing locals" :)

Also maybe if there is a dedicated trade channel then you could "report" General spammers to be blocked a time duration from General tab and such.

Edited by DealsTru

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i don't know. i feel trading one spam for another spam (which fills up your screens) seems like a bad idea. At least with general spam, that is clutter that I know is mostly unimportant. It seems that if you want to talk to someone specifically, don't use general but whispers and you'll see it in the ME window. /say should also be on the ME tab, and since that is local, it fixed your problem which is already in game. Its just that not a lot of people know the /say command. Adding a bubble feature to replace a fix that is already in place seems a bit pointless in my opinion.

If your argument is that chat bubbles looks nicer and is more convenient for you, sure. That is a valid argument. But to say chat bubbles will reduce spam doesn't seem like a valid argument as I don't believe it will. People will continue using /general, you may get a /say chat bubble here and there, but you'd still need to read general.

My other point is that in combat, if chat bubbles fills your screen blocking your view of combat, it is a bad thing.

 

Regards,

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9 hours ago, sanfall said:

" At least with general spam, that is clutter that I know is mostly unimportant." 
Wouldn't you like to see these in viewing bubbles then instead of just mostly ignoring General? (Opens you up to beyond a discord channel).

"It seems that if you want to talk to someone specifically, don't use general but whispers and you'll see it in the ME window".
I want bubbles to include a viewing area wide approach.

"/say should also be on the ME tab, and since that is local, it fixed your problem which is already in game. Its just that not a lot of people know the /say command." Adding a bubble feature to replace a fix that is already in place seems a bit pointless in my opinion."
Right now yes it is susceptible to misreading "/say" from fast scrolling General. IF it was in ME tab.. you wouldn't want to be in general even more then.

"If your argument is that chat bubbles looks nicer and is more convenient for you, sure. That is a valid argument. But to say chat bubbles will reduce spam doesn't seem like a valid argument as I don't believe it will. People will continue using /general, you may get a /say chat bubble here and there, but you'd still need to read general. "
It will reduce a misread though. And "/say" not displaying a bubble. I think its just a vicinity text and not a different color yet either. Currently there is no chat bubble option I think. 

"My other point is that in combat, if chat bubbles fills your screen blocking your view of combat, it is a bad thing."
Yes, but I think a small use of bubbles will be used in combat fields as combat is very user interactive in this game (action combat). To me, a random few bubbles is positive in my view, as it another combat obstacle. But yes would like to see bubbles further above head of closer vicinity to you / only display "..." / or reduced to the start of text only (small character limit)

I appreciate your replies and trying to understand this all with me. Its taken me a few posts to fully read into this and I still cant grasp it all. I give game developers credit as design is hard and this particularly is a tough system to address. "Sociability" to me is crucial and should be as many platforms that you can provide in an MMO. Def not having your game strictly rely on 3rd party social apps to provide a greater upper hand to the grouping of people that choose to use them. or possibly early later players fortunate to then find out about them, or not able to get into locked channels/ see text on 2nd monitor/etc..
(it even hard enough to quick form guilds through the forums without some form of ingame way to do it as well. (To see accepting guild recruiters visually for you then able to change over to join theirs instead if yours falling apart.). The devs have stated this and are now looking further to address something like that.)

Sorry I'm rambling.. anyway....

Thanks for agreeing that bubbles would atleast look better. I guess mainly to me seeing a few bubbles here and there on the battlefield is a joy to recognize. Battles on youtube and such look kinda boring without that social aspect. (unless the video has voice recording of the discord). Its like seeing kids on a playground yelling that instigates further fun.
And the shouting in Beachheads for trade deals can make the beachhead feel MUCH more alive and a place to actually want to be in with vendor /crafters/recruiters advertising and such. Newbies would like to see this interaction.

I'm not sure if I'd agree bubble chat would be too distracting in combat zones as its tough enough to partake in action combat targeting and the combination of fireing off abilities. The random bubbles would only happen if one found a way to get out of combat for minute to type up something long. (then, again I would then want restricted txt characters) The random small text shouts would be fine I would assume mostly "leaders" trying to grab attention with bubbles during field combat. This would include then other faction members to maybe tag along in their groups/discord restricted directions.
 

As far as bubbles helping with spam. I would say they do greatly help. A fast scrolling chatbox is way worse having to go into mouse-mode to scroll up and try to find it. Especially if there is scrolling trade/grouping/random spam. 

(for example, say a Vendor advertiser stated an item that interested you into thinking about purchasing. Only to be like a few seconds later you think "ya that sounds like something i need, wait who said that?" You would have to enter mouse mode and scroll up in the chat box and try to find it again.. if even possible to see again if chat is too busy. (or your in a busy situation)
If it was visually in front of you, (prob in a town) would be much easier to find out who to contact in their random text bubble that lasted at least visually for a few seconds. Or pointing you the location of the nearby NPC set up vendor at beachhead/town.
This would also "keep advertisers in city/town like places" as well, again make those zone feel alive. Otherwise if only a chatbox the further suggests the multiple "repeated" spam attempts would happen in every possible channel, creating a greater chatbox nightmare.)

Otherwise I would assume to cut down chat trader spam.. we need a general Auction house to be able to find these player vendors locations/goods with MULTIPLE different stat combinations. (was random Bazaar terminals in SWG to browse all)

Edited by DealsTru

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Sorry if this isn't the right thread for this, but I've given thought to how trade or "open market economy" is supposed to work in-game as well. This is one of my main turnaways from the game currently because unless you are well connected or in a guild, there is little you can do with your inventory other than spamming chat or crafting your own items. 

 

My solution to this in a previous post was to add the ability for players to temporarily set up a site for selling goods (e.g. laying down a carpet). I understand that player trade stalls are already something that can happen, but in my opinion there is a bit of a curve to get to that point; and that while having permanent stalls is a good idea in some situations, it might also be a good idea to have temporary stalls for other situations.

For example, lets say I am in my faction city and not vulnerable to other players being able to attack me. I select the "set up trade camp" ability and my character rolls out a trade carpet with some generic design decorations. Above my head there would be some kind of indicator stating that I am open for business, and selecting on my character would open up a store with the goods that I have for sale. 

I see two main issues with this thought :

  • It removes the need for more permanent player-based trade stalls 
  • It utilized  more server resources because more people will be sitting afk and cluttering certain areas

My main solution to the above two issues is to have a timer on the temporary trade stall. For example, every 24 hours you can only have your stand open for 2 hrs total. Once 2 hrs is used, the ability will be unavailable again for 24 hrs. This can also allow people to quickly set up shop and leave if the area is too dangerous or not enough people around. 

 

In conclusion, I think this would remove from some of the spam of selling and buying goods if it was more centralized and structured like the situation I described above.  

Edited by ilogos

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3 hours ago, ilogos said:

Sorry if this isn't the right thread for this, but I've given thought to how trade or "open market economy" is supposed to work in-game as well..."...."

I like your idea. Are you talking "Keep" and "Camp" temporary vendors? But would it have "multiple placing vendors" that create performance issues in prone combat areas due to increased players/decorations around? Would also probably include increase of population of the dedicated players that are strictly only crafter tree speced then there too viewing all these random vendor goods)?

 My idea (maybe adding to this)
Random campaign placed Computer Terminals like "Online sales". (Beachhead,FreeCity, and EK vendors filled with spirit bank temp campaign items, and travel to pick up good),
and Temporary time accessed in campaign shops. (for quicker/easier access for those rolling through campaign regions (keeps, forts, camps)
As far as permanent vendors, I would like vendors placed in EKs than to be required as "unlocked EKs" to your whole faction. This then allows displaying your decorated EK to all faction onlookers (a fun bonus element). And allows campaign forts to become vulnerable by forcing missing players out shopping as well as the regional harvesters. (have to rely on social comms to go back and defend)

Adding to this, id like random placed computer like "terminal access hubs" to link most "but not all" of the EK server wide faction vendors and goods together to browse though. Then only advanced more higher "tree skilled vendor players" would get this special terminal "ad placing access" that would then allow showing their advanced vendors around the "campaign universe" on other linked computer terminals. 

I think, with all the different goods enhanced with lots of random stats that we will be creating, Terminals then simplifies some social things like multiple advertising.

Id like your idea though, to place in Keeps/beachheads/camps with the "temporary allowed" stall vendors. (would appeal to keep defenders or maybe you could offer some rare goods that the terminals wouldn't be able to show.) Would also appeal to quick sale rather then travel.

Most vendors though I would think for performance sake, to keep most back at EKs, free city, beachead. (a separate server, but most tied to "terminal access")


I now started a thread on this. 

 

Edited by DealsTru

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Maybe this picture might help. i'm not the best photo editor out there so excuse my poor image. :)

What I don't want to see is this happen, especially in combat. I would rather there be a system for you to get someone's attention, then start a private chat somehow instead of speech bubble. I have no issue with trying to prevent misreads or catching someone's attention. Just not to the point where it could affect gameplay.

Speech bubble sample

Regards,

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1 hour ago, sanfall said:

Maybe this picture might help.

If it ever got that bad I would definitely want a hotkeyable option to turn off/on.

Edited by DealsTru

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