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Gwuinny

Fix broken class.

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51 minutes ago, Angelmar said:

There is no issue with the Centaur racial. It does exactly what it says it does.  Some folks are just too full of salt and need something to blame for their losses.

Please do some testing for a change.

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1 hour ago, Angelmar said:

There is no issue with the Centaur racial. It does exactly what it says it does.  Some folks are just too full of salt and need something to blame for their losses.

If the only problem with it was the excessive armor break, that'd be one thing (and really, your best response is to say people are salty?  That's just sad).  It also features numerous other bugs, or at least unintended interactions.  Just off the top of my head from what I can recall, it's wider than it should be, randomly does no damage, it prevents those hit by it from moving or using skills for a short while even after landing from the knockback, it cancels numerous skills including passive channeled skills (like songs) as well as block/parry despite those preventing CC, and I'm sure I'm missing a few.

And on top of all that it's a 20% break that lasts almost as long as the cooldown.  Anyone will win fights with enough centaurs and overpowered classes.  The fact that Eldritch and SL have proven the viability of numerous others and have beaten you with mob drops and white vessels (and no centaurs) only for you guys to start fielding templars like us makes me wonder where the salt truly lies.

Edited by Deioth

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1 hour ago, Angelmar said:

There is no issue with the Centaur racial. It does exactly what it says it does.  Some folks are just too full of salt and need something to blame for their losses.

lol

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36 minutes ago, Deioth said:

And on top of all that it's a 20% break that lasts almost as long as the cooldown.  Anyone will win fights with enough centaurs and overpowered classes.  The fact that Eldritch and SL have proven the viability of numerous others and have beaten you with mob drops and white vessels (and no centaurs) only for you guys to start fielding templars like us makes me wonder where the salt truly lies.

The irony on this is that -W- has probably ran the most templars(and overall diversity of classes/races) out of any guild consistently since 5.8 was released. Not only that, it is visually documented in many videos from over the past 12 months. Ultimately you'll see what you want to see if you actually believe the things you say. Maybe it is all a "troll".

I am finding this weeks excuse for being bad pretty good though. It is almost as good as when 65 people is apparently less people than 35. It really makes me confident that we will continue to be successful when you look at every issue as something that surely must be broken and can't possibly be how a mechanic works. Therefore you aren't going to try to find a solution but rather keep doing what we're doing and cry when other groups adapt to counter the play style that you are running.

I honestly feel a little bad for your guild mates because you demoralize yourselves and your allies by throwing your hands up in the air like something is an impossible situation when the only thing that is holding you back is yourselves. I hope at some point you realize this and then we can get some exciting fights out and about.


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1 hour ago, Deioth said:

 Just off the top of my head from what I can recall, it's wider than it should be, randomly does no damage, it prevents those hit by it from moving or using skills for a short while even after landing from the knockback, it cancels numerous skills including passive channeled skills (like songs) as well as block/parry despite those preventing CC, and I'm sure I'm missing a few.

What's truly sad is in your "extensive testing", you still don't realize the Centaur charge is a physics impulse and all the "unintended bugs" you describe are exactly the effects common to ALL physics abilities (nados, chain pull, etc).

You guys are just clueless and frustrated that throwing 10 Templars at a fight isn't getting you any results. 

Thus the devs get a thread full of  uninformed, inaccurate, and salt laden feedback.

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1 hour ago, Phylor.the.Jester said:

The irony on this is that -W- has probably ran the most templars(and overall diversity of classes/races) out of any guild consistently since 5.8 was released. Not only that, it is visually documented in many videos from over the past 12 months. Ultimately you'll see what you want to see if you actually believe the things you say. Maybe it is all a "troll".

I am finding this weeks excuse for being bad pretty good though. It is almost as good as when 65 people is apparently less people than 35. It really makes me confident that we will continue to be successful when you look at every issue as something that surely must be broken and can't possibly be how a mechanic works. Therefore you aren't going to try to find a solution but rather keep doing what we're doing and cry when other groups adapt to counter the play style that you are running.

I honestly feel a little bad for your guild mates because you demoralize yourselves and your allies by throwing your hands up in the air like something is an impossible situation when the only thing that is holding you back is yourselves. I hope at some point you realize this and then we can get some exciting fights out and about.

Where is all this anger and hate coming from?  Suddenly we're bad?  We've beaten WHoA groups in mob drops and white vessels while you guys are all rocking epics and better and somehow we're making excuses why we "suck" because centaur's racial is overpowered regardless of its functionality being intended or not and intentionally choose not to play the OP cheese?  And no, you guys haven't run almost a single templar since Eldritch started playing... right up until we started beating you guys with templars.  A couple months ago is when the shift happened, after we wiped W and HoA twice with even numbers then a third time when you had more on the same fort.  The following days and weeks we noticed a reduction in centaurs and an increase in templars.  You still have some templars but your centaurs are back out in force.  Yes, there IS plenty of video evidence of that.

Don't even know what this numbers thing is about so I'll skip it (because Order on a good night even with Conflict can barely reach 20 people).  The fact we can stand toe to toe with you guys consistently with barely anyone in good crafted gear still (and with Odynak featuring one of the game's newest guilds on Order custard rocking it despite their inexperience) is impressive.  All I can say is, you better bring enough players come Dregs, because when gear and passives are even again you're going to be in for a hell of a surprise.

Look are our K/Ds and tell me again if you think we're demoralized by the difficulty.  We're on Order on purpose to be the underdogs.  We crave the challenge.  Your words are meaningless to us.

 

52 minutes ago, Angelmar said:

What's truly sad is in your "extensive testing", you still don't realize the Centaur charge is a physics impulse and all the "unintended bugs" you describe are exactly the effects common to ALL physics abilities (nados, chain pull, etc).

You guys are just clueless and frustrated that throwing 10 Templars at a fight isn't getting you any results. 

Thus the devs get a thread full of  uninformed, inaccurate, and salt laden feedback.

Then the mechanics need to be reworked and the character controller improved.  I'm pretty sure the devs are not intending non-retaliate CC to be stronger than retaliate CC.  And if so, the centaur racial is bar none above and beyond better than any other racial and overpowered as hell.  W's abuse of it is telling.

No, our meta gets plenty of results.  Imagine how much stronger we'd be if our gear and passives were even to yours.  Just because W's consistent abuse of broken, bugged, or straight up overpowered mechanics nets you more wins doesn't somehow mean we're salty, uninformed, or inaccurate in our opinions, reports, or intentions.  We've clearly poked the bear and hit one hell of a nerve with you guys crawling out of the woodwork like this just to lay down such sad, pitiful trash talk.  If I were a member of your guild right about, I'd be ashamed.

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31 minutes ago, Deioth said:

Where is all this anger and hate coming from?  Suddenly we're bad?  We've beaten WHoA groups in mob drops and white vessels while you guys are all rocking epics and better and somehow we're making excuses why we "suck" because centaur's racial is overpowered regardless of its functionality being intended or not and intentionally choose not to play the OP cheese?  And no, you guys haven't run almost a single templar since Eldritch started playing... right up until we started beating you guys with templars.  A couple months ago is when the shift happened, after we wiped W and HoA twice with even numbers then a third time when you had more on the same fort.  The following days and weeks we noticed a reduction in centaurs and an increase in templars.  You still have some templars but your centaurs are back out in force.  Yes, there IS plenty of video evidence of that.

Don't even know what this numbers thing is about so I'll skip it (because Order on a good night even with Conflict can barely reach 20 people).  The fact we can stand toe to toe with you guys consistently with barely anyone in good crafted gear still (and with Odynak featuring one of the game's newest guilds on Order custard rocking it despite their inexperience) is impressive.  All I can say is, you better bring enough players come Dregs, because when gear and passives are even again you're going to be in for a hell of a surprise.

Look are our K/Ds and tell me again if you think we're demoralized by the difficulty.  We're on Order on purpose to be the underdogs.  We crave the challenge.  Your words are meaningless to us.

 

Then the mechanics need to be reworked and the character controller improved.  I'm pretty sure the devs are not intending non-retaliate CC to be stronger than retaliate CC.  And if so, the centaur racial is bar none above and beyond better than any other racial and overpowered as hell.  W's abuse of it is telling.

No, our meta gets plenty of results.  Imagine how much stronger we'd be if our gear and passives were even to yours.  Just because W's consistent abuse of broken, bugged, or straight up overpowered mechanics nets you more wins doesn't somehow mean we're salty, uninformed, or inaccurate in our opinions, reports, or intentions.  We've clearly poked the bear and hit one hell of a nerve with you guys crawling out of the woodwork like this just to lay down such sad, pitiful trash talk.  If I were a member of your guild right about, I'd be ashamed.

I'm more so ashamed of your guild, this type of salt is more so ridiculous and amusing, you arent the first guild to quickly point fingers to blame and wont be the last. ❤️;) 

Edited by simisoft

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Really hope the next update's changes to racials makes a difference and actually makes sense and are followed up with A LOT of polish to everything else.

I commend everyone that play tests, but come on, this thing is far from complete. Bickering about specifics and who is winning (or not) because of non-final elements is a bit silly.

Clearly things are broken and not balanced in more then one spot, if people deny or ignore it, shame on them. People make the best of what is available, but don't pat yourselves on the back too much.

Where's Viking Nail at? Need someone to claim they won Shadowbane's Beta and how launch wasn't worth trying or whatever nonsense.

Hope the passion lives on at launch when an actual population exists and the game doesn't have a few minutes in the oven still.

Edited by APE

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59 minutes ago, APE said:

Really hope the next update's changes to racials makes a difference and actually makes sense and are followed up with A LOT of polish to everything else.

I comment everyone that play tests, but come on, this thing is far from complete. Bickering about specifics and who is winning (or not) because of non-final elements is a bit silly.

Clearly things are broken and not balanced in more then one spot, if people deny or ignore it, shame on them. People make the best of what is available, but don't pat yourselves on the back too much.

Where's Viking Nail at? Need someone to claim they won Shadowbane's Beta and how launch wasn't worth trying or whatever nonsense.

Hope the passion lives on at launch when an actual population exists and the game doesn't have a few minutes in the oven still.

Only the greatest legends of the CF Forums get a place at the TABLE OF CHAMPIONS!


Shadowbane - House Avari/Hy'shen
"Gimp elves get good elves killed." - Belina

Avari Discord - https://discord.gg/Bch24PV

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Lots of salt in here.  Let me allow you the opportunity to make good on your mouth: I challenge any of you to a 5v5 or 3v3, open comp, streamed/YouTubed.

 

This is the point where you start S keying your way right out of this thread by dodging my challenge or puking up excuses.

 

Begin tootin, boats.

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Sounds like the problem with the charge is more of too many things attached to it making it a great ability.

The only potential bug item from that list I’m not sure about is going through CC immunity, I don’t recall if chain pull/push effects ignores blocks or not but if some of the other physics effects do then I would assume the charge does for some reason or all physics effects have something a little buggy in them. As for it’s “range” that’s hard to accurately tell as what we see and where the server thinks we are can be slightly off enough just due to regular pings to feel weird. This has been particularly noticeable to me in general with the change to the 3m melee range.

As for the general argument going on, idk I think it’s all silly to be pointing fingers either way. If someone is beating you with something cause it’s imbalanced you should probably switch to it or look for a counter. Them’s the breaks of competitive games. Now if it’s truly buggy/exploit then yea test it, get others to verify it, and of course report it without abusing it.

But there’s also a lot more leniency in this testing phase then their would be once the game is live regarding those latter buggy/exploity issues. Now is the time to share info and work together to verify bugs vs balance problems without bringing name calling into it.

The post shouldn’t be “hey these guys beat us with broken mechanics their douches” it should be “hey is this working right we saw this do X, Y, Z can anyone confirm?” Cause remember this is not a complete game, this is still messy alpha testing phase.

Edited by Duffy

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5 hours ago, Ble said:

Lots of salt in here.  Let me allow you the opportunity to make good on your mouth: I challenge any of you to a 5v5 or 3v3, open comp, streamed/YouTubed.

 

This is the point where you start S keying your way right out of this thread by dodging my challenge or puking up excuses.

 

Begin tootin, boats.

They won't take the challenge; it's easier to cry than to win anything. 

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18 hours ago, simisoft said:

I'm more so ashamed of your guild, this type of salt is more so ridiculous and amusing, you arent the first guild to quickly point fingers to blame and wont be the last. ❤️;) 

The fact that no one in your guild thus far can come up with anything more creative than such a tired line is incredibly telling.  We--that is, Eldritch--have been dedicated playing Crowfall since the Trial of Arkon.  At not one single point has any one of us complained on the forums about centaur racial.  It was only over time that we realized where its strengths lied and where it seemed to be bugged, or at least mechanically interacting in unintended ways (physics CC even seems to have canceled my Neckbreakers on numerous occasions which means it ignores CC immunity and that would be a bug).  We've not pointed blame at any point.  A completely passing remark has turned into you guys piling on me and the only reason I can come up with is because you're upset we've beaten you before with less gear, less passive training, less game knowledge, and without exploiting overpowered mechanics.  If you had a defense for your tactics, you'd actually offer one rather than trolly little snipes.

18 hours ago, APE said:

*snip*

Your honest attempts at reasoned commentary are appreciated.  I may not always agree with your assessments, but I appreciate them.  Keep it up.

7 hours ago, Duffy said:

*snip*

Indeed, centaur charge appears to ignore CC immunity conditions and I'm quite certain net and chain pulls are considered a kind of soft CC as they are not physics based.  It seems likely that all physics based knockback/up skills that do not trigger Retaliate ignore CC immunity states.  That is without any doubt a bug and that rather passing comment has of mine apparently pinched quite a few Balance nerves.  I can only speculate why they feel the need to redefine what "bug" means or resort to personal attacks rather than counter arguments, but I have my ideas.

16 hours ago, Jah said:

Not sure what to make of this new whiner-braggadocio persona from Order.

Activity in the campaign is picking up, so that is a good thing.

I can speak for Eldritch and say definitively there is no whining and am not aware of any coming out of Order generally at any time since we've come in.  Trash talk here and there maybe, but that's expected.  If you're referring to OP, Chaos still fields some centaurs and alpha warriors (feels significantly fewer these days though) so this strikes me as a rather generalized rant.  If my passing comment pointing out an apparently bugged and arguably overpowered state of a racial (and consequential revelation of one side's particular use of it has them triggered) is somehow "whining" I clearly need a new dictionary.  Without a doubt I love that things are more active but as is typical (and a reality we're fully accepting of) Order won't be winning any campaigns when we typically average 5-20 players fewer than either Chaos or Balance.  Certainly means more fights.

8 hours ago, Ble said:

Lots of salt in here.  Let me allow you the opportunity to make good on your mouth: I challenge any of you to a 5v5 or 3v3, open comp, streamed/YouTubed.

 

This is the point where you start S keying your way right out of this thread by dodging my challenge or puking up excuses.

 

Begin tootin, boats.

The only salt so far is coming from you guys considering none of you are actually trying to defend the state of the centaur racial, but if you want to throw down, Eldritch is always down for fights.  That's why we're on Order to begin with.  I see no reason why we can't set up something amicable (and respectfully, for that matter, thank you very much).  

 

Oh, and speaking of centaur bugs, let's also not gloss over the movement speed bug where properly timed jumps make you comparably fast to (if not faster than) epic mounts. We've seen plenty of that cheese, too.

 

Edited by Deioth

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32 minutes ago, Deioth said:

We've not pointed blame at any point. 

You sure about that?

33 minutes ago, Deioth said:

If you had a defense for your tactics, you'd actually offer one rather than trolly little snipes.

Why would we defend our tactics if you haven't accused us of anything?


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9 hours ago, Ble said:

Lots of salt in here.  Let me allow you the opportunity to make good on your mouth: I challenge any of you to a 5v5 or 3v3, open comp, streamed/YouTubed.

 

This is the point where you start S keying your way right out of this thread by dodging my challenge or puking up excuses.

 

Begin tootin, boats.

Just waiting for Pann to show up and lock this thread since its gone off the rails but got to love the E-peen challenges. Try doing some testing instead of issuing challenges.

So the racial bug 1)  Reported by players already apparently wild charge isnt doing proper damage (this is comical this was their only bug report on wild charge) ,  2)  Drops Parry & Block on players  (so acting like shield breaker here)  3) Acts as hard cc by turning off all toggles (songs, auras etc)  when its a soft cc skill.   Added bonus is the knock away on top of it not sure if this would be classified as a bug or not.    So you've got a racial that is way beyond any major .  If it was just armor break it wouldn't be a problem.  

The other take away after thinking about it is if all the armor breaks follow the same rule in dropping parry & block.

Edited by MrErad

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