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Surelia

Communityquestion about 5.110 on TEST with bigger bugs?

Do you want today to be the day?  

60 members have voted

  1. 1. Even with some Blockers and many Crits....

    • YES, and i wont annoy ACE with the known issues
    • YES, and i will report any bug i find
    • No, lets wait until ACE has a good feeling with it
    • No, other cause...


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It refers to the types of bugs in 5.110 they are in house testing. Blockers are the worst bugs, blocking it from from going on public test, critical is not quite as bad, but still pretty bad(especially for someone new experiencing the game). The poll is should they put it on Test as it stands currently, knowing how bad some of the bugs are, or wait a bit until the biggest bugs are fixed. 

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We only have a small idea of what the issues are.  Even if people like us are ok with bugs you have to think about the random people who come back and say "This game is still a buggy mess" and tell their friends not to bother


12Oe7ot.png

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2 minutes ago, Toadwart said:

I have no clue what this poll is even asking.

Is it supposed to be humorous? Blocker and many Crits refers to what?

The poll is asking about 5.110 being released rather now, even with bugs, or better later, with less bugs. Unfortunately with this poll system, the original question is hard to see. But it's on top of the poll. Blocker and crits refer to things they said in the first minutes of todays Q&A stream (within the first minutes), explaining why 5.110 is not yet available to test.

 


My answer is clear: No. I assume that most will answer yes, though. But that's because the biggest part of the audience reading this is not the audience 5.110 is made for.

They can simply not afford to provide a version that will not be good enough to reduce complaints as much as possinble. We've seen this in the past. People cried for the new version. Wanted it to be released as soon as possible, no matter which bugs it has, because we wouldn't care. They did. But we didn't! Happened several times, and I absolutely understand that they are not able to trust us anymore regarding that.

The farther we are in development, the more people join the crowd who paid less (to nothing, when it comes to the free beta players). It may sound strange and twisted, but experience shows that people who invested less, need (and expect) more, to be happy.
In the early days, with all the kickstarter backers and testing environments being available for the whales only, it was no problem if when a new version came up people needed to try two hours to login, before it finally worked. It was ok.

This is about different mindest, different audiences, different expectations - which change over time. This has to be understood. And ACE simply needs to address it the right way. They need to release a 5.110 with some minor bugs, but with nothing that feels too bad to a highly sensitive mass audience.

"Yeah, no problem, just give it to us" is something that only works for the old and/or most dedicated crows with a real tester mindset. It won't work for the masses. Which is also why this poll won't provide a usable answer. Because we are not the masses. Those who follow Crowfall closely, are deep into it and participate in the forums ... are a minority.

 

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Depends on your priorities for launch.  Prematurely releasing with known bugs just to placate will 100% guarantee that they will get a mountain of bug reports about bugs they are already aware of and trying to fix.  Sure, we will find other unknown bugs and report them earlier too, but someone will have to sift through the impertinent reports of bugs they are already tackling and that ultimately takes ACE resources away from where we really want them.

My take on the vibe presented today is that we are days, not weeks, and if they are that close then I think they should just finish as they planned and release it at that point so that all feedback is more likely to be pertinent and less likely to be a waste of our, and their, time.

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16 minutes ago, starrshipcs said:

 

My take on the vibe presented today is that we are days, not weeks, 

My take is  the opposite i think they are still quite away from it.They said designers are still adding effects to frostweaver.So they are still having most people focusing on this patch and not shifting people to the next one. If i were to guess probably after 20th of march would be a good guess.

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My DERGS may be flaring up something mighty bad but I can stand the itch a lil longer. 

I feel like they’d only be making more work for themselves if they give it to us now. 

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4 minutes ago, Arkade said:

This poll is entirely irrelevant because it isn't going to change when we get 5.110.

I know, but I keep trying...
And it gives some other perspectives to think about. Yes I understand the issue with maybe having something on your TEST in alpha that doesn´t look that good. Maybe a not having a NDA issue, but I played betas where the client crashed every few minutes and sometimes the game was just not playable. I think the set expectations for an alpha are pretty high at ACE or my expectations about alpha are too low. I also thought pencils down a few weeks ago means really just bugfixing and polishing, so maybe the statement about frostweaverloop not ready yet points to another direction or it is also just polishing.

So for me the answers show atleast which different type of TESTERS or Players we have here. And that gives me other Perspectives which is a good thing, thanks!

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Posted (edited)

If you've seen my bug reports, you already know I will post any and all bugs I find

Edited by coolster50
https://community.crowfall.com/topic/25243-590-snap-test-bug-reports-for-5102019/page/2/?tab=comments#comment-433204

giphy.gif

You Can't Be A Genius, If You Aren't The Slightest Bit Insane.

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Posted (edited)
58 minutes ago, pamintandrei said:

My take is  the opposite i think they are still quite away from it.They said designers are still adding effects to frostweaver.So they are still having most people focusing on this patch and not shifting people to the next one. If i were to guess probably after 20th of march would be a good guess.

It is entirely possible it could take that long, but the fact that they are down to < 10 blockers, which seem to get a daily pass, makes me very hopeful that any day could be the day.  Those same <10 could continue to resurrect in different permutations (or spawn fresh bugs) for weeks, sure, but if they have been at that point for weeks already then it wouldn't be unreasonable to think that they could punch through them suddenly any day now.  I got the impression, based on JTodd's description of a "blocker" level ticket vs a "crit" level ticket (around 8 min mark), that the FW effects would be considered a "crit" level cosmetic issue and that they may turn it loose to test while in progress.  Also, given how tight-lipped they have been over the past couple months, this Q/A they weren't so reticent to talk about the push to test.

Of course, this is all circumstantial and history has shown us that crappy socks what cause delays happen, so if your sanity hinges on your expectations for the push of 5.110 to test, then better to err on the side of caution and keep them on the low side.  My case of the Dergs is mild so I'm content to be optimistic and suffer for it if I must :) 

Edited by starrshipcs

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Posted (edited)

As a player, I want to see what's coming even if there are still major issues.

As a playtester, I know that putting up a build takes effort and if they have enough serious bugs to keep them busy, they don't need my help 'finding' bugs they already know about, and they don't need to be filtering through reports for minor bugs they may or may not know about.

From a marketing side, this is probably the most important release in CF history, and all eyes are going to be on it. Putting out a bad build, even on test, even with a big fat disclaimer, is going to leave a bad impression that'll be hard to overcome.

I hate the waiting, but I'll wait until they get it close to right and actually need my help getting it the rest of the way there.

Edited by VaMei

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7 hours ago, Kraahk said:

The poll is asking about 5.110 being released rather now, even with bugs, or better later, with less bugs. Unfortunately with this poll system, the original question is hard to see. But it's on top of the poll. Blocker and crits refer to things they said in the first minutes of todays Q&A stream (within the first minutes), explaining why 5.110 is not yet available to test.

 


My answer is clear: No. I assume that most will answer yes, though. But that's because the biggest part of the audience reading this is not the audience 5.110 is made for.

They can simply not afford to provide a version that will not be good enough to reduce complaints as much as possinble. We've seen this in the past. People cried for the new version. Wanted it to be released as soon as possible, no matter which bugs it has, because we wouldn't care. They did. But we didn't! Happened several times, and I absolutely understand that they are not able to trust us anymore regarding that.

The farther we are in development, the more people join the crowd who paid less (to nothing, when it comes to the free beta players). It may sound strange and twisted, but experience shows that people who invested less, need (and expect) more, to be happy.
In the early days, with all the kickstarter backers and testing environments being available for the whales only, it was no problem if when a new version came up people needed to try two hours to login, before it finally worked. It was ok.

This is about different mindest, different audiences, different expectations - which change over time. This has to be understood. And ACE simply needs to address it the right way. They need to release a 5.110 with some minor bugs, but with nothing that feels too bad to a highly sensitive mass audience.

"Yeah, no problem, just give it to us" is something that only works for the old and/or most dedicated crows with a real tester mindset. It won't work for the masses. Which is also why this poll won't provide a usable answer. Because we are not the masses. Those who follow Crowfall closely, are deep into it and participate in the forums ... are a minority.

 

    I am also a no. If the mob's (monster on binds) are not even attacking you at the moment,  give them a bit longer let them get rid of the blockers, or "Game Killer" bugs as people from the gamer not the developer side call them, and then release the patch.

 No one is going to want to go through a whole lot of progression on the test server, if they release too early on test, in 3 weeks time everyone will want it to go live, so they can feel like they are accomplishing something that will not be irrelevant in 30 days..and if they are still trying to squash huge bugs, that will just annoy people more down the road.

 I see if Test patches everyday now, I want the patch as much as anyone, but I would rather let the developers make the call at this point, not the gamers

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As we see so far most don´t want them to push sth they don´t wanna push atm.
The concerns about leaving a bad impression with sth that is not major bug free is sth I don´t feel that way, but of course that is my opinion and yes pretty sure some would go crazy and wouldn´t help the game. Especially after what we saw happening at other communities that concerns get more value.

 

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Crowds are fickle. Saying "I dont care about bugs, just give me the content" is, *in my opinion*, largely about a need for instant gratification. This next patch is a huge milestone,  it's very important that they get it right. I think Kraahk was spot on in the assessment that those who have the least invested (in time especially, not necessarily monetarily) are going to complain the loudest. It needs to be reasonably stable, even when it's going on Test first with a smaller pool. People will talk and it will be streamed.

It. Needs. To. Be. Right.

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