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yianni

Vessels are too easy to make

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Posted (edited)

I think that vessels are kind of easy to make for the amount of stats we get for them. I think ambrosia should match the quality of the vessel to make it . 

Edited by yianni

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If we/they wanted to make vessels harder, pretty much all that would be required is either seriously raising the re-roll costs, or removing the ability to re-roll stats all together on them.

I am not however convinced that they are too easy to make to begin with as it requires groups to harvest motherloads, etc, not to mention months and months of passive training.

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I disagree.

You need to train Quarrying, Necromancy and Alchemy

You need a group to get minerals

You need to collect multiple minerals of the same rarity to grind and complete Ambrosia

You need to make it back to your city without dying ( No more spirit banking everywhere)

Then you need to find a graveyard of the correct rarity, 

Harvest compete sets of bodyparts without being killed

Make it back to base without dying ( once again spirit banking everywhere is not in 5.11)

Grind the dust and embers to reroll it

 

I think that is more than enough hoops to jump through.

 


www.lotd.org       pking and siege pvp since 1995

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16 minutes ago, PaleOne said:

I disagree.

You need to train Quarrying, Necromancy and Alchemy

You need a group to get minerals

You need to collect multiple minerals of the same rarity to grind and complete Ambrosia

You need to make it back to your city without dying ( No more spirit banking everywhere)

Then you need to find a graveyard of the correct rarity, 

Harvest compete sets of bodyparts without being killed

Make it back to base without dying ( once again spirit banking everywhere is not in 5.11)

Grind the dust and embers to reroll it

 

I think that is more than enough hoops to jump through.

 

All of this, especially since it is a key mechanic to the game,

Not to mention have you tried leveling a gold vessel? It takes forever, compared to a blue vessel, compared to a white, that amount of game time and effort also needs to be taken into account also.

I would say the system is decent also at the moment, unique, interesting, decent amount of customization, and available to all players, hardcore/casual I would not mess with it much at all in my opinion

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26 minutes ago, PaleOne said:

I disagree.

You need to train Quarrying, Necromancy and Alchemy

You need a group to get minerals

You need to collect multiple minerals of the same rarity to grind and complete Ambrosia

You need to make it back to your city without dying ( No more spirit banking everywhere)

Then you need to find a graveyard of the correct rarity, 

Harvest compete sets of bodyparts without being killed

Make it back to base without dying ( once again spirit banking everywhere is not in 5.11)

Grind the dust and embers to reroll it

 

I think that is more than enough hoops to jump through.

 

It takes 2 people to get minerals, you dont need any passive training to get the minerals if you're smart.

Even little necromancy training is enough to make a vessel superior to a white default one. Body parts are also very easy to get with 0 training due to the fact that you only need 1 part per body which makes it easy to craft. 

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2 hours ago, Extintor said:

If they do that they can remove poor, common and uncommon minerals from drop tables ...

not really, they haevent removed any other resources that are poor, common, and uncommon even though theyre not useful

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2 minutes ago, yianni said:

not really, they haevent removed any other resources that are poor, common, and uncommon even though theyre not useful

They removed all poor regular drops when they introduced the white quality materials in vendors ...

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11 minutes ago, Extintor said:

They removed all poor regular drops when they introduced the white quality materials in vendors ...

poor yes but not white and better

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18 minutes ago, yianni said:

not really, they haevent removed any other resources that are poor, common, and uncommon even though theyre not useful

 

2 minutes ago, yianni said:

poor yes but not white and better

They removed what was obsolete at that time. Anyway, we're talking about something that will not happen, so ... :)

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3 minutes ago, Extintor said:

 

They removed what was obsolete at that time. Anyway, we're talking about something that will not happen, so ... :)

you never know, still think its too easily available

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1 hour ago, yianni said:

It takes 2 people to get minerals, you dont need any passive training to get the minerals if you're smart.

 

If you aren't trained in minerals, Don't have mineral specced tools or the foreman discipline, its going to be a very long slow grind before you have enough minerals to make a vessel.


www.lotd.org       pking and siege pvp since 1995

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13 minutes ago, yianni said:

you never know, still think its too easily available

Depends on if you consider starter vessels minimally viable.  That is the real goal, to get people minimally viable as quickly as possible.

That is why there are war tribes drops, and if a minimally crafted vessel is included in that assumption, it's best to not have it take too many flaming hoops to sort out.

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9 minutes ago, PaleOne said:

If you aren't trained in minerals, Don't have mineral specced tools or the foreman discipline, its going to be a very long slow grind before you have enough minerals to make a vessel.

not really, you can get minerals ff lvl1 motherloads to make ambrosia, and if tools are decent you dont need foreman... and again you dont even need mineral specced hammers. i dont think you know how to do it completely :)

 

 

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9 minutes ago, KrakkenSmacken said:

Depends on if you consider starter vessels minimally viable.  That is the real goal, to get people minimally viable as quickly as possible.

That is why there are war tribes drops, and if a minimally crafted vessel is included in that assumption, it's best to not have it take too many flaming hoops to sort out.

even creating a green vessel is superior than a white

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2 hours ago, yianni said:

It takes 2 people to get minerals, you dont need any passive training to get the minerals if you're smart.

Even little necromancy training is enough to make a vessel superior to a white default one. Body parts are also very easy to get with 0 training due to the fact that you only need 1 part per body which makes it easy to craft. 

While I can't predict the future, I have to guess that what you've experienced will not be 100% duplicated at launch.

Simply having an actual population should drastically change the difficulty of obtaining resources for all crafting. Going from <500 players to 10s of thousands if not more will change supply/demand.

One easy way to shake it up would to put an expiration date on vessels. It makes zero sense to me that they last forever when everything else, even entire worlds, end. How does a frankenstein body last forever, move from place to place, have no long term risk? Having them decay and eventually go poof would be a boon to everything beyond people not wanting it because they feel emotionally attached to a vessel someone else likely crafted and they likely will shed eventually anyway.

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The fact that they are permanent and make slotted disciplines permanent - they are unbalanced atm - no matter how hard they are to make.

We've been promised a revisiting of the vessels and some sort of mechanic to keep that economy going and the necromancers happy.

I do hope we will get it by launch.


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I dont think decay is the right solution, I also think necromancers will always have work with people rolling alts, crafters, gatherers, and of course mix/maxing

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3 minutes ago, McTan said:

Do we know if disciplines are permanent choices in a vessel? Or can they be removed?

Unless something changes, they can be removed.


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