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Fps / Darkfall Aiming Confirmed


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That's kinda taking it to the extreme don't ya think? Just because combat has animation locking, doesn't mean you'll be stuck in place for a long time. I feel you only have the worst vision of what locking can do.

But it's gonna happen in large battles. I guess we need to know what their vision is on how big these battles will be. These combat systems work better in different scenerios.

I think the pefect balance is something combined between GW2 and Tera to be honest. We have to see how the game plays out and term of sieges. I mean it would suck to have a game based on city building and sieging than have the combat system not work well in that scenerio.


 


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God I hope it's different from Darkfall. We don't need another fantasy skinned Quake.

I prefer animation locking. Forces you to commit to attacks. Can be rewarding or punishing. None of this floaty, iceskating combat .

No artificial telegraphing, no animation locks, and require some degree of aiming for all ranged attacks. Preferably a Z-axis too, which seems to be what ThomasB is alluding to.

I mean you are in a large siege and you are in animation lock and get 0'd by the enemy because you can't react to get out ... it's almost as bad as being cc'd to 0 isn't it? 

 

Then you should have thought before committing to that attack. Although some attacks can often be cancelled out of with certain skills as well, but you'd be wasting a cooldown in order to do that. The animation locks can still be done so that combat is fluid and fast paced, but it really adds an element of skill that you don't have without it. It forces important choices in combat. I mean they won't have damage that high and animation locks that long that you'll die that quickly, but you get the idea. 

Edited by leiloni
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Animation lock is something out of a fighting game. It could theoretically be fine if you like that type of gameplay in a 1v1 scenario. However, I find the idea of counting frames of animations to master the game a horrible design. It also puts a hell of a lot of emphasis on your given frame rate. If you frame rate dips, you're in trouble. It also completely breaks down if you have more than a single opponent.

Edited by frozenshadow
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Then you should have thought before committing to that attack. Although some attacks can often be cancelled out of with certain skills as well, but you'd be wasting a cooldown in order to do that. The animation locks can still be done so that combat is fluid and fast paced, but it really adds an element of skill that you don't have without it. It forces important choices in combat.

You haven't played a siege warfare game have you? I  mean poorly made socksa changes faster than the actual pvp combat does in a large siege. To be locked in animation is just a unneeded consquence in that scenario. 

Edited by sarin

 


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Animation lock is something out of a fighting game. Could theoretically be fine if you like that type of gameplay in a 1v1 scenario. However, I find the idea of counting frames of animations to master the game a horrible design. It also puts a hell of a lot of emphasis on your given frame rate. If you frame rate dips, you're in trouble. It also completely breaks down if you have more than a single opponent.

I mean you are hitting at what I been trying to say. I don't know what the perfect combat system is for this game yet, but animation lock would be bad very bad in sieges.


 


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You haven't played a siege warfare game have you?

 

I have actually but I've also played a variety of combat types in different games and the animation locking (along with proper collision detection) is so much better. You're going to have to play differently and that's a good thing.

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I have actually but I've also played a variety of combat types in different games and the animation locking (along with proper collision detection) is so much better. You're going to have to play differently and that's a good thing.

Ya for PvE in my opinion

 

Ya players will have to play different, they are gonna all stay ranged and be afraid to try to move forward in break in because they are going to be animation locked and get killed.

Edited by sarin

 


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Very disappointing. DF worked despite its aiming mechanics. Especially archery was awful...

 

I hope they will implement proper aiming tools - range finder, visible trajectory and so on.

 

I hope they will implement some FPS basics - increased spread when moving, different rates of fire for different abilities, decent hitboxes.

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Ya for PvE in my opinion

 

Ya players will have to play different, they are gonna all stay ranged and be afraid to try to move forward in break in because they are going to be animation locked and get killed.

 

LOL animation lock doesn't get you killed. Have you actually played any game that did that and did it well? All it does is force you to actually make smart decisions in combat about what skills to use when (and where) because it matters so much more - and pay attention to what your opponent is doing as well because you can take advantage of him as much as you're afraid he'll do to you. There are consequences to your actions when you can't just slide sideways to avoid a hit as you cast that massive damage move. It's either or, but not both at the same time. But you're not sitting there in one long animation waiting to get hit, you're still moving a lot. 

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LOL animation lock doesn't get you killed. Have you actually played any game that did that and did it well? All it does is force you to actually make smart decisions in combat about what skills to use when (and where) because it matters so much more - and pay attention to what your opponent is doing as well because you can take advantage of him as much as you're afraid he'll do to you. There are consequences to your actions when you can't just slide sideways to avoid a hit as you cast that massive damage move. It's either or, but not both at the same time. But you're not sitting there in one long animation waiting to get hit, you're still moving a lot. 

You are thinking in terms of 1 on 1 and small scale, I am thinking in terms of ripping some guilds city down in a large scale siege. We are are in 2 different worlds on our thinking here.

 

Unless they plan on removing city building and warfare as the core part of the maps we will have to disagree.


 


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You are thinking in terms of 1 on 1 and small scale, I am thinking in terms of ripping some guilds city down in a large scale siege. We are are in 2 different worlds on our thinking here.

 

Unless they plan on removing city building and warfare as the core part of the maps we will have to disagree.

I used to play a game called Fantasy Earth Zero. It was a strategic, third person, 50v50 PvP game with free, high skill aim and heavy, heavy animation locking. I'm talking 1-3 second locks on every attack. It was one of the best mass PvP experiences I've ever had.

 

Now I'm not saying Crowfall should have extreme animation locking, just saying that it's possible to have it in large scale PvP.

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the main and imo, only, valid argument against animation lock is the dependency it creates on low latency. Otherwise, animation locks create a measure of play/recognition/counterplay that doesnt exist in a game where either a. all actions are cancellable via macros, or b. all actions are instant and usbject only to a GCD. Both options create a far shallower pvp experience. Latency is going to be less and less of an issue as ISP's get better and better at providing stable /fast connections. 

 

/sorry to those in oceania, but thats life.

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You are thinking in terms of 1 on 1 and small scale, I am thinking in terms of ripping some guilds city down in a large scale siege. We are are in 2 different worlds on our thinking here.

 

Unless they plan on removing city building and warfare as the core part of the maps we will have to disagree.

 

I feel like you're not entirely sure what animation lock is to be honest.

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FPS stands for first person shooter, this game will not be in the first person.  FPS not confirmed.  At most it will have third person shooter aiming. 

Edited by Sheen
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I hope and believe this is wrong. As choppy as DF sieges got imagine adding voxels and destructable terrain into that mix. If it ran smoothly it would be insanely fun but I personally believe any siege with 20+ players would make trying to aim nearly futile.

 

What I think we will see, out of an assumption my previous point is something these guys have already seriously considered, is Elder Scrolls Online style aiming. Personally that works great for me. It's more fun than tab-targetting by leaps and bounds.

"To hell with honor. Win."

A Beginner's Guide to Crowfall (5.8.5 Edition)

 

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FPS aiming or bust.

 

Sorry but I'm putting on my haterade pants right now.

 

 

A few things:

Animation locks kill gameplay.  Sure you have to time things, but it makes the gameplay feel cheesy and as if its 'playing itself'

 

I cannot believe the FAQ says "we have to make sure the game doesn’t get too “twitchy” (i.e. require lightning fast reflexes or too much button-mashing)." 

>>What are we trying to create here?  Watching the KS video, I understand Gordon might be getting a little bit older and wants to play his brain-child game too but seriously come'on. What is wrong with all these newb-carebears not wanting to actually have to AIM a damn mouse at a target!?!  You have an entire eternal kingdom all to yourselves to hide in.  Dont make the entire game a dumb button smashing skill fest like Wild-crap where you cant even see the ground anymore because its turned into a 'light up floor'

 

Anyone who calls Darkfall <> Quake is a complete noob who understands nothing about either game. Now please shutup and stop ruining more MMo's before we all go back to AOL chatroom's and sh***y MUDs'

 

 

See you

Edited by cattboy

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I mean you are in a large siege and you are in animation lock and get 0'd by the enemy because you can't react to get out ... it's almost as bad as being cc'd to 0 isn't it? 

 

If 0.5-1.0 seconds of animation lock causes you to die in a large siege I think you have bigger problems than animation locks. Maybe you should work on your positioning because wtf are you doing in a place in which you can be killed in less than a second or two?

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