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Are support classes going to be viable in the Dregs? I really want to play in the Dregs but I'm a bit worried by how support classes will be able to play solo.

Edited by Bethos

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There must be a mechanic to break the bonds of guilds and any player alliances in the Dregs.  Otherwise it will just be another guild v. guild league with higher rewards, making the intented guild v. guild league obsolete.

Even informal player alliances (i mean no official guild bondage but organized coordination of loot/camp distribution and pacts of no-attack) should be punished/countered with in-game mechanics.

Some people here have expressed their hopes of Dregs not ending up in a battle royal aka a last man standing but seriously how else could it end, everyone singing songs at a campfire holding each other's hands happily dancing while the land turns into oblivion ?! Dregs is supposed to be the worst nightmare, a carnage and a bloodfest with no politics around, everyone fighting against the Hunger on a macro perspective but only for themselves on a micro perspective. 

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There must be a mechanic to break the bonds of guilds and any player alliances in the Dregs. Otherwise it will just be another guild v. guild league with higher rewards, making the intented guild v. guild league obsolete.

Even informal player alliances (i mean no official guild bondage but organized coordination of loot/camp distribution and pacts of no-attack) should be punished/countered with in-game mechanics.

Some people here have expressed their hopes of Dregs not ending up in a battle royal aka a last man standing but seriously how else could it end, everyone singing songs at a campfire holding each other's hands happily dancing while the land turns into oblivion ?! Dregs is supposed to be the worst nightmare, a carnage and a bloodfest with no politics around, everyone fighting against the Hunger on a macro perspective but only for themselves on a micro perspective.

This, if they don't have a system to counter big groups/guilds then I'm probably not going to play Dregs.

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There must be a mechanic to break the bonds of guilds and any player alliances in the Dregs.  Otherwise it will just be another guild v. guild league with higher rewards, making the intented guild v. guild league obsolete.

Even informal player alliances (i mean no official guild bondage but organized coordination of loot/camp distribution and pacts of no-attack) should be punished/countered with in-game mechanics.

Some people here have expressed their hopes of Dregs not ending up in a battle royal aka a last man standing but seriously how else could it end, everyone singing songs at a campfire holding each other's hands happily dancing while the land turns into oblivion ?! Dregs is supposed to be the worst nightmare, a carnage and a bloodfest with no politics around, everyone fighting against the Hunger on a macro perspective but only for themselves on a micro perspective. 

 

That's the thing though. You could help someone out one minute and stab them in the back the next.

If it is a battle royale last/last man standing type deal, then yes, you'll probably have small groups forming to help each other out. But at the end of the day, no one in that group has an obligation to split loot or anything like that.


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Are support classes going to be viable in the Dregs? I really want to play in the Dregs but I'm a bit worried by how support classes will be able to play solo.

 

Maybe supports strategy will consist in stuning enemies, resist and scape, then farm and earn item improvement with monsters, then back again in battle? Although they wont be able to make a 1v1 if they stand between the last ones

Edited by crowrise

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Maybe supports strategy will consist in stuning enemies, resist and scape, then farm and earn item improvement with monsters, then back again in battle? Although they wont be able to make a 1v1 if they stand between the last ones

I guess we'll have to see, I really hope support classes are able to win the Dregs if your a good player. Imo they should still have enough damage abilities to kill other players, without being OP ofcourse.

Edited by Bethos

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This, if they don't have a system to counter big groups/guilds then I'm probably not going to play Dregs.

What system would you propose to counter twenty guys in teamspeak in Dregs, then? Some sort of scaling group effect? So, say, as there's more people in an area the monsters start ramping up in number and hardness as the Hunger wants to consume them all.

 

Even if you make something like that exponential, that just means that there's going to be a certain magic number, three or four or five dudes in teamspeak. There's very few ways to force a free-for-all, because at the end of the day it's the player who is making the decision, whether to aggress or befriend. Likewise, if you want to force a small scale, 1vN or 2vN engagement, you need mechanics to break up groups and encourage people to keep solo or twos or threes.

Edited by Psyentific

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What system would you propose to counter twenty guys in teamspeak in Dregs, then? Some sort of scaling group effect? So, say, as there's more people in an area the monsters start ramping up in number and hardness as the Hunger wants to consume them all.

 

Even if you make something like that exponential, that just means that there's going to be a certain magic number, three or four or five dudes in teamspeak. There's very few ways to force a free-for-all, because at the end of the day it's the player who is making the decision, whether to aggress or befriend.

Camelot unchained tackled this question previously, and the next IT Q&A i am going to pepper it again to mark.. But he previously stated

 

 

One last question, an oldie but a goody. How are you going to break up the zergs that make RvR so much fun!” This is a more complicated one and frankly is the perfect example how I’ve told the team we have to approach RvR holistically (don’t even say it, I know what you are thinking) and not look for a silver bullet (or even arrow) to deal with that problem. Since RvR isn’t our endgame, the vast majority of the world’s map (sorry, I still believe in protecting freshly minted characters, so feel free to mock this choice) is going to be open, unlocked and available for your raiding, looting and RvRing pleasure. But that’s not enough, we will also have very, very limited fast travel options. Moreover, while having lots of extended CC abilities is a tad bit controversial, we will certainly have some CC (as well as resists and ways to clear the CC) so that smaller groups can have a better chance at dealing with larger groups. Having a rather large world map, almost no fast travel, and some CC abilities is a good start but we need even more and we’ll detail that in later blogs. Oh, and no “Pop goes the Arthurian.” When you die, and you will die; don’t expect to simply pop back up and get right back in the fight. It is going to be a lot more complicated than that. IMO, that gameplay style embodies some of the problems with many modern MMOs, death without consequence, “easy in” and “easy out” RvR, 6-year old kids’ soccer match, etc. RvR combat must be fun, challenging, exciting and losing must hurt a bit or it means nothing."

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What system would you propose to counter twenty guys in teamspeak in Dregs, then? Some sort of scaling group effect? So, say, as there's more people in an area the monsters start ramping up in number and hardness as the Hunger wants to consume them all.

 

Even if you make something like that exponential, that just means that there's going to be a certain magic number, three or four or five dudes in teamspeak. There's very few ways to force a free-for-all, because at the end of the day it's the player who is making the decision, whether to aggress or befriend. Likewise, if you want to force a small scale, 1vN or 2vN engagement, you need mechanics to break up groups and encourage people to keep solo or twos or threes.

I have no idea how they're going to do it but imo they really have to find a way to keep groups as small as possible. If they don't have a way to do it then I don't really see the point in playing Dregs if I'm going to get slaughtered by guild/big groups.

 

I would like to see random spawning so it won't be easy to find your friends.

Edited by Bethos

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I have no idea how they're going to do it but imo they really have to find a way to keep groups as small as possible. If they don't have a way to do it then I don't really see the point in playing Dregs if I'm going to get slaughtered by guild/big groups.

 

I would like to see random spawning so it won't be easy to find your friends.

 

Like in other survival games that are currently available?  People never get on voice chat and find each other.  The more people that manage to reach each other, the larger and more formidable the group becomes.  The Dregs WILL end up being another GvG venue.  It's just how people work.  They will always look for an advantage and numbers will always be an advantage.

 

Edit:  I guess they could make it so that if more than 3 people are in one place at one time, a bunch of mobs spawn on/near them.  That would keep people from grouping up or would put them at a significant disadvantage if they do.  Even with a group of 2, if you run into another group of 2, that's more than 3 and you have mobs to worry about as well as other players.  If you survive it, you'll likely have spent significant resources doing so.

Edited by trik81

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The shadow campaign is more based on guild vs guild events, @Trik81.

I've been in some ancient quality shadowbane guilds like TSB, but I don't have too much quality time at the moment,

so I will be mostly solo in #the Dregs campaign, m8.

 

I understand the stated goals of each campaign type, what I'm saying is that people in guilds on voice chat are not going to care if the ruleset is FFA or GvG.  They are going to play as a team until everyone else is eliminated, then they can fight amongst themselves knowing that someone in their guild will get the end rewards.  In fact, they may even split the rewards at the end regardless of which guild member "wins".

Edited by trik81

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I understand the stated goals of each campaign type, what I'm saying is that people in guilds on voice chat are not going to care if the ruleset is FFA or GvG.  They are going to play as a team until everyone else is eliminated, then they can fight amongst themselves knowing that someone in their guild will get the end rewards.  In fact, they may even split the rewards at the end regardless of which guild member "wins".

 

This. While Dregs may prevent concrete in-game parties from forming, while it may randomly scatter everyone on entry, there is nothing stopping me from getting my guild, getting on Teamspeak, and facerolling everyone five to one.

 

The only way I can see to prevent this kind of metagroup play forming is forcing players to be in ones, twos, maybe threes. As above, if there's more than N people in the same area, monsters until there isn't.

Edited by Psyentific

Hardcore gamer & tabletop enthusiast. Enjoys roleplaying, pretending to be stupid, and one-sided fun.

Goodposting 101: How to Keep the Forums Clean

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If people use voice chat then that's what they do, but you still make them jump through that hoop, because it's dregs

 

That's not really a hoop though.  Any PvP based guild worth their salt already has Ventrilo, Teamspeak, Mumble, Skype or some other form of voice chat setup.  If they want a true free for all, there will have to be in game measures that harshly discourage grouping.  That said, even with those mechanisms in place, people from the same guild can still coordinate and not attack each other.  Even hiding names/guild affiliation wouldn't completely prevent this.

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So far the only way I can think of for the dregs to not become another GvG is the rewards of winning the campaign not to be worth it for Guilds. 

 

A guild that wins a campaign in the sadow can take back X% of the resources, rewards, items, whatever. Even though the stuff in the drags should be better to compensate for the more difficult world, the fact that only one or a very limited number of players can win the campaign and profit from it should make it more beneficial for a big guild to participate and put their efforts in GvG.

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That's not really a hoop though.  Any PvP based guild worth their salt already has Ventrilo, Teamspeak, Mumble, Skype or some other form of voice chat setup.  If they want a true free for all, there will have to be in game measures that harshly discourage grouping.  That said, even with those mechanisms in place, people from the same guild can still coordinate and not attack each other.  Even hiding names/guild affiliation wouldn't completely prevent this.

 

We certainly can argue the degree of effectiveness but it is something because it's the not same experience where you let people create a guild in that campaign or form a group. By default the server has to be different from the GVG campaign. I know all the guilds out there are amazing and super hardcore and nothing is ever a problem for them but the developers still make every effort.

Edited by oberon

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Let's keep mechanic assumptions to a minimum.  I think if anything is true so far, then the vision for this game will deliver a product in this environment that is very creative.

 

The description of the Dregs already alludes to the rule set, "Every-man-for-himself."

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What if they run a system where if you're within a certain vicinity of someone, assuming they're out of stealth, both players get tagged with something called 'eternal bonds'. This would have a certain effect on each player until the other(s) you came in contact with are eliminated, breaking the bonds.


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