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Ranger Abilities Need Change


Navystylz
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6.2 Looks to be a very interested change in how all classes work. But in many cases abilities work the same with only tweaked numbers and such. There are some fundamental ability changes I believe the Ranger needs to feel better and for combat to flow smoothly that could help the class a lot.

LMB - Basic Shot

  • This is the skill Rangers start with. Unchainable. Just do basic damage. 
  • This damage needs to be boosted so that clicking the button does a base amount of damage that is sufficient for range fighting, and not a joke compared to the range of other classes and especially being way under what melee puts out. Sure melee need gap close, but they get plenty of ways to do that and then rip your face open.

LMB - Combo

  • Currently the game pushes you into wasting the first 2 shots of the combo so that you can charge the 3rd shot for the special ability, and 6.2 adding a Ankle Shot does nothing move away from this.
  • The combo needs to be changed into a 3 stage charge.
    • Stage 1 - Is also the new basic shot. You can tap or charge and it does same damage. Take .5 seconds to charge into stage 2
    • Stage 2 - This stage will combine the damage from stage 1 and 2 into a more powerful charge shot. Getting into stage 2 activates Double Shots to apply to 2 or 3. Is 1 seconds charge to stage 3. Starts a CD.
    • Stage 3 - This stage will combine the damage from stage 1, 2 and 3 to create a high damage Aimed Shot. It auto benefits from Double Shots/Trick Shots and applies ammo bonus + Ankle Shots. This would be a powerful opener, execute, or with stategic play, something you could slip in mid fight. Would start a CD that makes it so that you can only use LMB stage 1 for a bit until you are able to try for another Aimed Shot. 2 second charge.
  • Charge time in total would be a 3 second charge.

Bow - Damage

  • I think it would be more clear what your damage is doing if the bow was the entirety of your range damage just like for any other weapons.
  • Remove the need for crafting arrows. The basic type of arrow for free would be piercing arrows.
  • Quivers maintain what they already do, but aren't needed for unlimited arrows. You would use them to change your damage to slash/crush/fire/ice. If you absolutely must give these a durability. Make the durability hit on death like normal gear. Not on shot or ability use. At least now if the quiver breaks without a replacement, you still have the unlimited basic piercing damage. Still get your special attack on stage 3 LMB charge.

6.2 has moved some abilities off ranger it seems. But if they still exist as disciplines then I will state what my idea of those would have been.

Forest Step 

  • Make Forest Step equippable in the range tray as well. If used from range tray it will close distance and swap you into your melee tray.
  • Disengage gave Rangers a smooth way to gain range and swap to range tray in one fluid move. 
  • Wardens 'were' the melee/range hybrid, but now it seems like Warden or Brigand will be able to spec more or less into this based on disciplines

Barrage

  • Make this more in line with how Meteor works for Confessors.
  • Rather than lock the Ranger in place firing a bunch of small hits that accomplish nothing (unles damage and healing changed a lot in 6.2), let the Ranger charge it up on a spot and then release it for a one off damage. Depending on your charge is the secondary effect that goes with it. Now that things have been mixed up with 6.2, I'm not sure if this should be a CC effect or something else.

Archer's Stake 

  • Not sure if this exists anymore. Had some useful secondary effect. I trust that if it's removed then Ranger's damage available takes this into account. And it would have to be a really good power to have rolled this into a discipline with the new limited powers/passives granted now.

Luckily other things of consideration were already rolled into 6.2 changes. Will have to test out the numbers and see if it feels good playing it though. 

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The dmg bundle at the start gives AP now so that will probaly compensate for archer stake if removed (Seems like it has) previous archers had 0 way to get AP from the talent tree (AP only came after class split for brig)

Veeshan Midst of UXA

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1 hour ago, Bigbunny12344321 said:

I’m not sure I understand . Rangers do plenty of dmg with standard bow shot. I’m hitting for 1k and some change non crits on a brigand with double shot from 52m . Figure archer would be even more a shot.

All 3 archery basic attack chain do the same dmg but 3rd one procs quiver affect. So people using say crushing quiver would left click forst 2 and only charge 3rd attack to trigger the stun.
There needs to be incentive to charge the first 2 attacks of the chain, Could be something like 1st and 2nd attack gets a stacking buff that that 3rd attack removed the buff and deal 10% each dmg per stack.

Edited by veeshan

Veeshan Midst of UXA

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If your worried about skip casting just require 2 bow draws above 90% for the third shot to activate arrow affect stun , root, burn ect . Otherwise it doesn’t get the added bonus. Don’t think it needs extra dmg. 

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  • 4 weeks later...

 

for a distance dps class it does not play its role in comparison to magic kits like archmage or stormacaller, the dps is very single target because the skills have a ridiculous damage, which would make it almost a remote control class. and will never be favored in 5 V 5 // 10 V 10 format. it becomes fun from a 15+ format

0i9d.png

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25 minutes ago, Zankara said:

 

for a distance dps class it does not play its role in comparison to magic kits like archmage or stormacaller, the dps is very single target because the skills have a ridiculous damage, which would make it almost a remote control class. and will never be favored in 5 V 5 // 10 V 10 format. it becomes fun from a 15+ format

While it may be okayish in small scale, in medium scale they have no ability to choose their target.  Those other ranged dps classes are not limited by projectile pathing.  Archers hit whatever is in front of their arrow.  Makes it extremely difficult to finish a target with any brains.

 

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On 10/12/2020 at 4:35 AM, Darkstar412 said:

Si vous craignez de ne pas lancer de lancer, il vous suffit de 2 tirages d'arc au-dessus de 90% pour que le troisième tir active la flèche affecte l'étourdissement, la racine, la brûlure, etc. Sinon, il n'obtient pas le bonus supplémentaire. Ne pensez pas qu'il a besoin de dmg supplémentaire. 

For the only One dps, Physical Distance

no need a parser for look his Dps in format 5 v 5, 10 V 10 is realy bad.
his best hit is with the bow charged to 100% and the combo make some time when you are in fight
his Aoe are realy without impact.

his ricochet shoot (spécial archer skill) hit at 320dmg in crit on infected armor (3 target) and his root can only root other 24 seconde
the suppresssion shoot it's the best skill in aoe because he is instant cast and can hit to 600 dmg in crit for 5 target

isnt a damage distance... we will say it's an crontrol distance ? who can be impactly in Big Format of players. (root 5 five poeple in a moove in a 20 V 20 or suppresed 5 player pack when it's a keep's defense or other))

I believe some players will be play with an archer can be make the difference in all fight.. 
and doesnt take this just  for an big format

imagine the result of a lot of work//time in Woodworking, leatherworking, blaksmithing for a final result realy bad, because all other dps can Burst easy best like you

other bad think: I'm an Archer and i Need to Depop my target at 64,75 whenever he can burst me before.... and i use my control for this., 

you can sprint when you charge but for 3 shot arrow and you cant retaliate for the rest of cbt.
Switch +Skill+ disengage  20 sec cooldown (100ping) when you can look an myrm grap 8sec or other knight grap..

the 3 charged bow make more damage than ALL skill can you find in the archer kit..... ???????



 

Edited by Zankara

0i9d.png

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11 hours ago, Arkdin said:

While it may be okayish in small scale, in medium scale they have no ability to choose their target.  Those other ranged dps classes are not limited by projectile pathing.  Archers hit whatever is in front of their arrow.  Makes it extremely difficult to finish a target with any brains.

Is it an Archer role to finish people? I doubt so.

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On 10/10/2020 at 8:57 PM, Navystylz said:

LMB - Combo

  • Currently the game pushes you into wasting the first 2 shots of the combo so that you can charge the 3rd shot for the special ability, and 6.2 adding a Ankle Shot does nothing move away from this.
  • The combo needs to be changed into a 3 stage charge.
    • Stage 1 - Is also the new basic shot. You can tap or charge and it does same damage. Take .5 seconds to charge into stage 2
    • Stage 2 - This stage will combine the damage from stage 1 and 2 into a more powerful charge shot. Getting into stage 2 activates Double Shots to apply to 2 or 3. Is 1 seconds charge to stage 3. Starts a CD.
    • Stage 3 - This stage will combine the damage from stage 1, 2 and 3 to create a high damage Aimed Shot. It auto benefits from Double Shots/Trick Shots and applies ammo bonus + Ankle Shots. This would be a powerful opener, execute, or with stategic play, something you could slip in mid fight. Would start a CD that makes it so that you can only use LMB stage 1 for a bit until you are able to try for another Aimed Shot. 2 second charge.
  • Charge time in total would be a 3 second charge.

That's not correct, because you have to time your 1st and 2nd LMB correctly depending on your rotation, stats, recent Triple Shot activation, Rapid Fire cooldown and ability to hit your target.
If you always double tap LMB into fully charged 3rd LMB you are missing damage (not much but still). It is a nice skill celling mechanic, I would not change.

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2 hours ago, ComradeAma said:

That's not correct, because you have to time your 1st and 2nd LMB correctly depending on your rotation, stats, recent Triple Shot activation, Rapid Fire cooldown and ability to hit your target.
If you always double tap LMB into fully charged 3rd LMB you are missing damage (not much but still). It is a nice skill celling mechanic, I would not change.

So you're opinion is that bow using classes are balanced right now?  I really really really disagree with that. 

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Le 12/10/2020 à 00:12, Bigbunny12344321 a dit:

Je ne suis pas sûr de comprendre. Les Rangers font beaucoup de dégâts avec le tir à l'arc standard. Je frappe pour 1k et quelques changements non crits sur un brigand avec un double tir de 52m. L'archer de la figure serait encore plus un coup.

spé Brigand +225 Puissance and the spé archer add just cap distance who can over cap to 64,75 in legndary

but you can add the dmg with craft but the armor can be up to

and when you make 10 seconde for try crit dps  the poeple can be make a lot of action, the control brok this combo to.

he is medium in mono target and very bad in Aoe For real And his "Barrage" is usless if you cant brok this cast


 

Edited by Zankara

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On 10/10/2020 at 12:57 PM, Navystylz said:

6.2 Looks to be a very interested change in how all classes work. But in many cases abilities work the same with only tweaked numbers and such. There are some fundamental ability changes I believe the Ranger needs to feel better and for combat to flow smoothly that could help the class a lot.

LMB - Basic Shot

  • This is the skill Rangers start with. Unchainable. Just do basic damage. 
  • This damage needs to be boosted so that clicking the button does a base amount of damage that is sufficient for range fighting, and not a joke compared to the range of other classes and especially being way under what melee puts out. Sure melee need gap close, but they get plenty of ways to do that and then rip your face open.

LMB - Combo

  • Currently the game pushes you into wasting the first 2 shots of the combo so that you can charge the 3rd shot for the special ability, and 6.2 adding a Ankle Shot does nothing move away from this.
  • The combo needs to be changed into a 3 stage charge.
    • Stage 1 - Is also the new basic shot. You can tap or charge and it does same damage. Take .5 seconds to charge into stage 2
    • Stage 2 - This stage will combine the damage from stage 1 and 2 into a more powerful charge shot. Getting into stage 2 activates Double Shots to apply to 2 or 3. Is 1 seconds charge to stage 3. Starts a CD.
    • Stage 3 - This stage will combine the damage from stage 1, 2 and 3 to create a high damage Aimed Shot. It auto benefits from Double Shots/Trick Shots and applies ammo bonus + Ankle Shots. This would be a powerful opener, execute, or with stategic play, something you could slip in mid fight. Would start a CD that makes it so that you can only use LMB stage 1 for a bit until you are able to try for another Aimed Shot. 2 second charge.
  • Charge time in total would be a 3 second charge.

Bow - Damage

  • I think it would be more clear what your damage is doing if the bow was the entirety of your range damage just like for any other weapons.
  • Remove the need for crafting arrows. The basic type of arrow for free would be piercing arrows.
  • Quivers maintain what they already do, but aren't needed for unlimited arrows. You would use them to change your damage to slash/crush/fire/ice. If you absolutely must give these a durability. Make the durability hit on death like normal gear. Not on shot or ability use. At least now if the quiver breaks without a replacement, you still have the unlimited basic piercing damage. Still get your special attack on stage 3 LMB charge.

6.2 has moved some abilities off ranger it seems. But if they still exist as disciplines then I will state what my idea of those would have been.

Forest Step 

  • Make Forest Step equippable in the range tray as well. If used from range tray it will close distance and swap you into your melee tray.
  • Disengage gave Rangers a smooth way to gain range and swap to range tray in one fluid move. 
  • Wardens 'were' the melee/range hybrid, but now it seems like Warden or Brigand will be able to spec more or less into this based on disciplines

Barrage

  • Make this more in line with how Meteor works for Confessors.
  • Rather than lock the Ranger in place firing a bunch of small hits that accomplish nothing (unles damage and healing changed a lot in 6.2), let the Ranger charge it up on a spot and then release it for a one off damage. Depending on your charge is the secondary effect that goes with it. Now that things have been mixed up with 6.2, I'm not sure if this should be a CC effect or something else.

Archer's Stake 

  • Not sure if this exists anymore. Had some useful secondary effect. I trust that if it's removed then Ranger's damage available takes this into account. And it would have to be a really good power to have rolled this into a discipline with the new limited powers/passives granted now.

Luckily other things of consideration were already rolled into 6.2 changes. Will have to test out the numbers and see if it feels good playing it though. 

 Post this in the feedback section 

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On 11/9/2020 at 9:10 AM, ComradeAma said:

Well, my Aimed Shot disagrees with you either.

unknown.png

Ah yes, the 8.9k in ~5 seconds on my plate-wearing Crusader from 60+ meters away. I remember that, was 6.1 (on live) though, not sure if Rangers got weaker now but it seems meta is turning into Wardens with traps on hit anyways, right?

notepad_2020-10-15_11-02-24.png?width=10

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Over time the direction ACE has gone with archery is that its primary advantage is range. I think a lack of mobility and the long channel is generally a fair trade off for superior range, but the question is one of "how much range is enough to make up the difference" rather than "how do we make archers work like confessors"

I do agree that the three shot combo requirement on an ability designed to have tradeoofs for channel time versus damage feels bad. I'd much rather see the procs function as a scaling %chance that is higher the more the bow shot is charged with an internal cooldown. It feels really odd and broken to whiff 2 short clicks just to get a proc on a held third click.

If in stead you had a limit of, say, one proc per 5 seconds that only activated at 90%+ charge, you could leverage what's unique about bows (the "when to release the shot" gameplay) in a way that feels a lot better.

LMAO my website is broken please click this to apply to Flames of Exile (maybe, if that's not busted too)

On 5/11/2015 at 1:48 PM, CAWCAWCAW said:

Rub rock on face and say "Yes food is eaten now time for fight"

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