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Make Enternal Kingdoms More Meaningful!

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Do I give a custard apple pie if you agree with me? Nope.

 

Fact is that without contestable EKs, they are worthless beyond fluff value. It does not matter if someone will allow PvP and conquest in his EK if others are not. I do not gain anything in opening my EK to that if I can't compete for the land, property and accumulated resources in other's stronghold.

 

As for campaigns, sure, they'll be fun to fight in, even do little capture the flag kind of thing but in a long run nobody will be attached to the strongholds in those worlds as they'll be wiped in a month or three.

So the only value PvP has for you is if you can have a base that you can permanently hold that you've won from everyone else on the planet.

 

How do you handle the Uncle Bob issue then?  Is it worth you having your permabase if it means the game fizzles in a year or so?


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The Chronicles of Crowfall           The Free Lands of Azure            RIP Doc Gonzo.

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- Sir, may I siege your land?

- No go custared socks yourself I like my pixels you filthy bad person.

- Okay, have a nice day Sir.

 

- Sir, may I siege your land?

- LOL NOP.

- Oh, okay, may your pixels fare well.

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So the only value PvP has for you is if you can have a base that you can permanently hold that you've won from everyone else on the planet.

 

How do you handle the Uncle Bob issue then?  Is it worth you having your permabase if it means the game fizzles in a year or so?

 

If it can be taken from me and my guild then it's not permanent. If I can withstand enemy sieges and poorly made socks in their cereal at the same time, then yes, I will enjoy that for as long as there is action. If I'm stupid enough to piss off enough people to make people make a zerg alliance against me and make me lose my pixels... well that'd be stupid of me, but it's still would be fun as there is that risk and challenge.

 

Having a lego idle lobby sand castle to chat is certainly not interesting or fun.

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I'm doing my best here to see your point of view Z.. 

 

You don't find value in the strongholds built on the inner, PvP planets because they get destroyed in the server wipes.

 

You don't find value in the strongholds built on the EK's because they are not subject to auto-pvp.

 

I think I have that right.

 

You may be correct.  This game may just suck for you because there's no way to keep the core mechanics of the game in place and still give you what you're after - which is an all PvP areas all the time game.

 

Your character is going to have to be your legend.  Or you're going to have to pick a Dregs planet with a 5 year campaign so you can have quality time with your stronghold.

 

I think there are more players than you think that will opt for PvP in the EK. 


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The Chronicles of Crowfall           The Free Lands of Azure            RIP Doc Gonzo.

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I do find value in the strongholds in the contestable worlds but they won't have much value as they are simply temporary bases. People will only invest enough time in them to hold on to them for few months until victory conditions are met. Think of them as more of a rented summer log cabin rather than an actual primary base, the gem of your "kingdom" and most valuable target of your enemies, which would/should be the EK stronghold.

Edited by Nefastus

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I do find value in the strongholds in the contestable worlds but they won't have much value as they are simply temporary bases. People will only invest enough time in them to hold on to them for few months until victory conditions are met. Think of them as more of a rented summer log cabin rather than an actual primary base, the gem of your "kingdom" and most valuable target of your enemies, which would/should be the EK stronghold.

 

I hear you.  I just don't know how they can make the EK PvP throughout as folks are really relying on it to be someplace they can actually NOT have to PvP.    Just as you see the value of an EK stronghold that means you've won endless battles and held on to what is yours, others see the value as something they've built that will be a hub for their guild and their trade.

 

I think that there are only partial solutions to your issue as it stands now. 

 

One is to create a group of a few 100 or so core players that all agree to open their EK's to PvP and then all of you group together and kill each other with abandon.  

 

The other is to get a bunch of folks that want a campaign that lasts longer than just a few months - that lasts a few years - and put it in the Dreg worlds.  Yes it will be wiped eventually but 2 years is a long time and if you're the winner at the end of those 2 years that has to mean something.

 

I know that neither of these solutions is 100% great.  But they might take the sting off a bit.   Thanks for sticking with this long enough for squishycore folks like me to see your point of view.


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The Chronicles of Crowfall           The Free Lands of Azure            RIP Doc Gonzo.

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They made EK so that it's optional to players.  We have so many other rings/bands that have pvp/battles, why does EK have to be on par with the other rings/bands?  Also, if they made all the changes you suggested to EK, then the actual campaigns and the actual gameplay during campaigns will become a little meaningless, since it will be the permanent personal kingdoms that matter more to players.  Also, if you really want EK to be "more meaningful", it will slowly become like other typical mmorpgs, or just a wannabe strategy game with no real end, while campaigns merely act as large scale dungeons for resources and materials.   

 

I think their idea of consensual battles between personal kingdoms is enough for EK.


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How about making a cluster of worlds just as EK and make them permanent, open to settlement, and open to PvP and territorial conquest?

 

Carebears will sit in their personal EK and fap to their trophies while roleplaying ponies and rest of us can compete in contestable set of EKs while not doing campaigns. The main difference with this cluster of EKs would be that there would be no need for players to set rules as rule set will be the same (guilds will be able to move in, settle, and fight over land and property), while individuals and guilds will also be able to bring resources from campaign worlds.

Edited by Nefastus

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Here's an idea. We heard mention of resource trainer NPCs, yes? What if they require resources. What if, the better roof over their head, the faster they train you. Or their skill training cap is higher. What if they wilt if you don't bring food back, or wood for the fires.

 

Now is your EK meaningless? You can't train worth beans because your NPC is sickly back in your EK. You need to win, to build him a nice house, to keep him fed and warm. Now your training in earnest. Now you're fighting in earnest. Now it matters.

 

And, to fight off cries of pay to win, their house is not your house. So the free castle you get for backing at 1k or whatever doesn't have an effect. You have to slap a hut together for them at the start and improve it.

 

I'm making a thread for this...

Edited by bairloch

I'm in this for the Experience, not the XP.

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How about making a cluster of worlds just as EK and make them permanent, open to settlement, and open to PvP and territorial conquest?

 

Carebears will sit in their personal EK and fap to their trophies while roleplaying ponies and rest of us can compete in contestable set of EKs while not doing campaigns. The main difference with this cluster of EKs would be that there would be no need for players to set rules as rule set will be the same (guilds will be able to move in, settle, and fight over land and property), while individuals and guilds will also be able to bring resources from campaign worlds.

I think that sounds reasonable.  It's no different than a group of folks just banding together except (gonna contradict myself here) there's a different feel when it's a whole planet rather than just a chunk of one. 

 

OK maybe the slamming of the carebears was not reasonable but I'm erring here on the side of discussing something rather than reacting to it.  :-)


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The Chronicles of Crowfall           The Free Lands of Azure            RIP Doc Gonzo.

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Why would we be teleporting between EKs?  :blink:

From the descriptions I have seen, and this quote from the Kickstarter FAQ

 

Every player starts with a small personal Kingdom. This is sort of like a Minecraft realm – it’s a world that you own, that other players can come and visit (if you let them.)

You control the administration of your Kingdom. That means you can invite player in, kick them out, grant them land, charge them taxes, set the import/export rules and turn on and off player-versus-player combat."

 

While its not explicit, if every player has a personal kingdom, I am pretty sure they will all be instanced.   I am not happy about this because I enjoy explorations of worlds in RPGs I play but I don't see how it would pan out otherwise.  If the kingdoms (housing) is not limited, then how would they flawlessly join all the kingdoms in a seamless world/server. Just an opinion but I would love more info on this as well.

Edited by Operator

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From the descriptions I have seen, and this quote from the Kickstarter FAQ

 

Every player starts with a small personal Kingdom. This is sort of like a Minecraft realm – it’s a world that you own, that other players can come and visit (if you let them.)

You control the administration of your Kingdom. That means you can invite player in, kick them out, grant them land, charge them taxes, set the import/export rules and turn on and off player-versus-player combat."

 

While its not explicit, if every player has a personal kingdom, I am pretty sure they will all be instanced.   I am not happy about this because I enjoy explorations of worlds in RPGs I play but I don't see how it would pan out otherwise.  If the kingdoms (housing) is not limited, then how would they flawlessly join all the kingdoms in a seamless world/server. Just an opinion but I would love more info on this as well.

 

 

Yea I was hoping the kingdoms weren't going to be instanced as well.  :mellow:

 

Hopefully they find a good work-around. <_<


Community Moderator - http://killonsight.info/

The Dark Forest beckons...

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They're saying 9 acres to start. Not exactly huge, but for one person, a good bit of land to wander through.

 

I don't see how they can say "no instances" though. Even though I was really excited when they did. How can the EK be anything but?


I'm in this for the Experience, not the XP.

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Guys...your prayers have been answered. http://community.crowfall.com/index.php?/topic/3015-crowfall-end-game-trials-of-the-gods-idea/ I made this post inspired by what I read from you guys here, I was thinking in my mind the same thing for a while now....

 

I love the throne idea, but why stop there!

 

Anyways I hope you enjoy the post and discuss what I've suggested.


-Truthe Yashikawa

The Lantern Watch - A Crowfall-first guild.  Welcome Home.

http://crowfall.shivtr.com/

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I think the Eternal Kingdoms will only really work if its own persistent world. Instead of each player having their own private box. This would make the Eternal Kingdoms much more interesting and dynamic than they are as proposed now. This way Kingdoms can grow and shrink over time. War between Kingdoms would be simpler as well. It would also encourage more interplayer development of the EK.

 

I think this a potential solution to PvP in the Eternal Kingdoms.

 

1) Inside Kingdoms there will be some kind of guard system to discourage PvP.

2) The amount and type of guards could be chosen by the monarch. This adds to the management aspect though.

3) As you get further away from the capital or other towns, the number of guards would decrease.

4) Outside the Kingdom it would obviously be a FFA.

5) People can PvP, but then they'll have to fight the guards (who may or may not be killable).

6) Some kind of Bounty system could be set up for people who kill others within Kingdoms. This will discourage people from just killing anybody on a whim. There are actual consequences to killing people in the EK.

 

What do you guys think about any of this?

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Guards, defend me!

"We are the Goon Swarm. Your kingdom is irrelevant and will be destroyed. Resistance is futile"

 

FUUUUUUUUUUUU


Yeeeeup. This is a great idea.

 

Edit: This was aimed at any idea of making it a huge persistent world for all players. That is a terrible idea.

Edited by Tyroki

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It's mostly the "we dont want any more meaningless badges" in their initial text on play2crush.com.

just to do the ol' switcheroo and tell us "but these badges are cool" aka the EK

 

 

I, personally felt like "they're kiddin now, right?"

 

Don't treat us like fools is what I'm saying. Don't try and lure us in with stuff like that and then say "oh well, semantics"

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mLJqQWWWwP0

 

Interview with Todd Coleman and Gordon Walton about their thoughts behind the world design decisions which is unique in my opinion - you don't even need to bother with the EK, Freeze. 

Just join a new campaign with your guild and build a home/castle on the FFA Dregs server and have fun - you'll be very wealthy in the end, 

but campaigns can take months.

It was boring when CN owned 85% of total cities on the map - and I'm glad they have some sort of reset and victory conditions related to the different campaigns.

It's like some other says here, EK is like sanctuary for eternal heroes/gods a place to rest his/her axe or sword.

Edited by Mythx

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Crowfall Game Client: https://www.crowfall.com/en/client/

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Mythx unfortunately even in current dumbed down EK state we'll have to bother with EKs by salvaging gear and resources back in order to craft gear for future campaigns. Which still doesn't give any meaningful value to EKs as they still are just big fluffy safe zones.

Edited by Nefastus

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