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bairloch

On the subject of open PVP

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In what way would you come up with a PvE game that has not been done before, that also includes you playing against other players?

 

 

There is not much I would be on at this point, but what I would be willing to bet on:

If you play this game, you will be playing against players. You will be able to lose to said players. You will have player enemies, there will be risk, there will be fights to lead to conquest. And you wont be killing mobs for trophies.

 

There are many ways you can play against other players without PvP.  I would assume PvP would be available but I would hope as an optional side, not compulsory.  If it is just PvP, then I'm one of the ones that this game is not for.  I voiced concerns on Coleman's FB and he assured me to wait and see and that's what I'm doing.  But racing -- which both Coleman and I have said we don't like on his FB along with FPS -- seriously, how great is it that he chats with us on his FB? --  so I doubt that but it's one example.  Contestants on Jeopardy play against each other but without a battle which it obviously isn't going to be either.  We're not going into a quiz show.  But that's another example.  If I had Coleman's imagination and enterprising spirit, I might be able to conjure up what else he might be coming up but since I don't, he's the one making his living creating video games, not me.  My point was solely that I don't know and neither do you.  Everyone is jumping to PvP but only those working on the game know if it is that or something else or some mixture.

 

So what your saying is, you don't want to play a game where people battle each other at all.  Wheres the play to crush spirit.  I want to crush other players in game, I don't want to hold hands and skip down NPC lane to waste time gathering things that are only used to battle NPC's.  Well being as that isn't original either I am guessing you don't want to have anything to do with either, whether they are mixed or not, they aren't original... 

 

Play2Crush can be taken more ways than one.  It doesn't have to mean battling other players.  You could even be teaming up with them to battle something else.  I don't want to battle other players and if the game turns out to be that you have to battle other players, I won't be around long.  That remains to be seen.  I don't want to hold hands and skip down NPC land either.  I'd rather gather things and and battle NPC's solo.  However, I am waiting to see what this game is and since I signed up for beta will try it before I judge it.  The teaser says wild speculation and that is all any of us are making wild speculation.

 

However, I'm intrigued by what's been said by the creators and how when the announcement comes some are going to be happy, some are going to be disappointed.  I have a feeling it may just surprise us all.  I am interested in seeing the new direction their planning somewhere between a sandbox and an amusement park games.  It is promising to be something more than either, something in between both and something new and original and that says to me something none of us expect.


Not quite carebear, but sort of cousin to,


meh, grumpy old lady...


Never underestimate grumpy old ladies.

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There abolsutely has to be something for non-PvPers to do.  Because we simply won't be PvPing every second.  And if we are, then this is a giant deatchmatch game, not a true MMORPG.

 

 

The problem with twitch-based, low-health games are 1) The skillcap can be too high and 2) Lag and hit detection play way too large a factor which just make PvP unfun (and large-scale PvP impossible)

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After reading that manifesto, I can't comprehend how this game will not be pvp-centric.

 

That said, ESO is pvp-centric, but extremely watered down and restricted for the pve crowd.

 

That's because you're reading it narrowly.  You can compete with other players for the throne in any myriad of ways besides battling each other which has been done to death and I doubt given the hype it's something that unoriginal.  It says compete with thousands of others for the throne.  It says it's neither sandbox nor amusement park where it's impossible to lose or win.  Maybe how you do your quests decides how well you do.  Not just how fast but how well you do and determine your progress towards winning the throne and if you make the right decisions.  That would be ultra-exciting!  I'd love to see that and it would definitely be original instead of everybody battling each other.  (Yawn.)  You can PvP in any old video game, I'm really hoping for something new and original here.


Not quite carebear, but sort of cousin to,


meh, grumpy old lady...


Never underestimate grumpy old ladies.

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PvP does not have to mean martial combat. And boardroom warriors often talk of crushing their opponents.

Now don't slip into the logical fallacy and claim that I'm suggesting this game will be a CEO simulator. Clearly it won't be only that (guild heads warring could be seen as such), but do not limit your expectations to mere hack and slash.


I'm in this for the Experience, not the XP.

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Politics, hunting big game, if you can make a big name for yourself you can be on top imo, not necessarily pvp. But if your hunting big game making yourself a legend I'm going to kill you and take your stuff, scream like an enraged barbarian as I dance the two-step on your entrails. If I tell people I killed you, they may kill me (infamy) that is a risk any pvp'er will know of.

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Unsurprisingly, considering Crowfall's pedigree, I've already seen a lot of talk about PvP. I'm a guy that doesn't want to be the baddest mutha on the server. I'm the kind of guy that wants to do his part for his guild, contribute however, and know that it's appreciated. That's all.

So when a guy like me sees a lot of calls for open-world, non-consensual PvP, I have a few concerns. If I'm not pushing to be the biggest and the strongest, will there be a place for me in an open-world, non-consensual PvP game? I'd like to think I could still contribute - crafting, exploring, scouting, knowledge - but if every time I leave the guild hall I get ganked, can I contribute?

So my suggestion is, make the combat as realistic as possible. By that, I mean no health bars, no healing potions or magic, no trading blows for five minutes. I'm talking a flurry of action, a lot of luck and a lot of skill, and a body on the ground bleeding moments later.

A system where the guy who doesn't have all the best gear still has a realistic chance of defending himself if he's done his homework. A system where the aggressor really has to want the other guy dead, because he's truly risking his own life by starting something.

That would be something truly different.

Guilds need support characters too..not everyone has to be the "baddest mutha" however, if you know your role in battle you matter. Also, you find a group of individuals that appreciate your contribution and the "baddest muthas" use you being ganked as a good reason to go "hunting"


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Guilds need support characters too..not everyone has to be the "baddest mutha" however, if you know your role in battle you matter. Also, you find a group of individuals that appreciate your contribution and the "baddest muthas" use you being ganked as a good reason to go "hunting"

 

Well aware. I, like you, have done this before. And, like you, I know that there won't always be someone there to watch your back. In a perfect world... but Crowfall won't, can't be.


I'm in this for the Experience, not the XP.

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I liked the way EVE allowed FFA PvP with their differing levels of security, down into outright lawlessness.  Increased risk if you wanted to screw around in high sec, but still giving you the choice to.


"Food for the crows..."    Nobuo Xa'el

cdinUTh.png

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It worked ok early on. But by about year 3 it became largely meaningless. Players had enough SP that they could hunt in high-sec and take out any police sent to stop them. At that point, the peaceful option disappeared from the game. If you didn't want player conflict, too bad. That is now what the game is about.

Played for 9 years before I finally couldn't stomach it any more.

I believe I read in a dev post here that players will have to police themselves. Something like a "police" faction. If that's the case, the EVE system won't work unless the players themselves take it very seriously, don't you think?


I'm in this for the Experience, not the XP.

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yeah...SB and EVE did it best, imo

 

i'm interested to see what comes here and hope it's "what's next" with those foremeost in mind

 

graphics, mechanics, doodads and  such are frills and sizzle

 

i wanna see the steak, then i'll know more...

 

for those concerned about ONLY being a Warrior or such, i doubt you'd have to worry...there's plenty of other things that are needed to make a War work, and all are valuable from support classes in Combat, to those who gather resources and make things...i would be truly Surprised if at least all of that is not going to be present in this Game

 

more after some Reveal....

 

Excelsior!


FIQw0eP.png

let the Code build the World and it's Laws....let the Players build the rest...

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As the OP, I want to make it clear that I'm not concerned about being "forced" into being a warrior. I want to fight. I'm good with that. I'm not ok with having to spend all my time fighting because the other players make it impossible to do anything else. I, as a reasonably skilled player, should be able to effectively defend myself, even if I'm not fully kitted out, buffed to the gills and min-maxed into oblivion, as most PvP games devolve into.


I'm in this for the Experience, not the XP.

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Yes, you get instakills, but it might be the tough guy getting instakilled by the farmer, if the farmer gets lucky. That's the system I want.

 

I would rather have a combat system based around outplaying an opponent, blocking hits, and overall being the better player, than "luck"...

 

While not stated, I also think any form of RNG is bad, in any game, ever, since the dawn of time.


 EOWWuhQ.png 
 

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Play2Crush can be taken more ways than one.  It doesn't have to mean battling other players.  You could even be teaming up with them to battle something else.  I don't want to battle other players and if the game turns out to be that you have to battle other players, I won't be around long.

"Play to Crush" Is pretty much the slogan for Shadowbane, a trademark of sorts. Now while I am fairly certain that'll translate to PvP in this game, and I am fairly sure we'll be playing against other players primarily (if only) in this game.

Edited by nehemia

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Hopefully they have the option of 'economic pvp' and 'logistic pvp'.

 

Amateurs talk tactics, professionals talk logistics.
~ Modern Military saying

Edited by youma

 Click here to join the Crowfall Discord chat community

Sekket on Mourning. Bhorov on Test Server. Youma the Pirate wherever TSP has sailed.

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I would rather have a combat system based around outplaying an opponent, blocking hits, and overall being the better player, than "luck"...

 

While not stated, I also think any form of RNG is bad, in any game, ever, since the dawn of time.

 

Luck and RNG aren't the same thing. Plenty of FPS players die because the other guy got lucky. No number wizardry involved.


I'm in this for the Experience, not the XP.

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Luck and RNG aren't the same thing. Plenty of FPS players die because the other guy got lucky. No number wizardry involved.

 

No, but they are related, and RNG can be a form of luck, such as critical strikes, which are simply based on a number. Many of these watered down themepark games also have an RNG dodge stat, instead of having players actually dodge. What a joke.


 EOWWuhQ.png 
 

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