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6.520.0 Live Feedback for 4/23/2021


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Update Notes

Please share any feedback you may have from your time playing the game. This includes subjective observations about your gameplay experience. Bugs that you have encountered should be directed to Bug Reports and don't forget the Legend for ACE feedback on Bugs reported!

If you encounter disconnection problems, showstopper bugs or any other issues preventing you from entering or playing the game, please send an email as well as your client logs* to support@crowfall.com.

*Client logs can be found here: C:\Users\[username]\AppData\LocalLow\Art+Craft\Crowfall

ArtCraft Entertainment, Inc.  [Rules of Conduct]

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Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for thou are crunchy and go well with ketchup!

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There needs to be more variety when it comes to racial selection for crafting.  At the moment you have two choices Rat (for single craft, or extra stat cap) or High elf (duo profession crafter) and this is due to the extra jewellery slot you get.  The third ring or second neck simply is an experimentation difficulty reduction piece for a different craft (difficulty reduction stat is universal)

At end game crafting, its fairly typical to have your Experimentation Capped, Experimentation points capped (and unable to increase further), and your Assembly just shy of cap (which will still stay at 98%).  So the only stat available to push is difficulty reduction. hence the above.

Solution?  add +5 experimentation cap to the racial bonus.

This will reduce the amount of min-maxing crafters feeling locked onto the two above races.  Plus inexperienced crafters will no longer be misled on what is best for their craft.  This will enable 3 races to be decent for each craft.  Racial bonus will be best (+5 experimentation vs 3.4 experimentation difficulty reduction), but that margin is now greatly reduced.  For a non crafter these numbers seem insignicant, but when you are crafting high end gear, the caps bring you right on the threshold so these numbers significantly help you with RNGesus

Edited by neven
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Factories
-When copying higher quality gear in factories, dust consumption is no where near what it would be crafting the items,  Even with armour and a single polish per piece, it is still significantly cheaper.  I can only imagine how much cheaper it is for jewellery that can take 500 dust to make a single piece fully polished before.  Dust should be balanced at roughly 60-75% of dust used if a piece being made is polished every step, including the subparts.

-Durability hit to seed item is waaaaay tooo low.  It needs to be balanced around 4 or 5 copies maximum.  If you want more, then make dust match the consumption of polishing every single piece to craft.

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Well, you will have to play in the campaign and not to snowball too hard from the previous campaign.

We will need to play in guild to harvest those component, also to play for keep !

Every campaign must be an almost fresh start, like a new launch : we will have to rush, we will have to fight. Most campaign in the past have been killed by players entering with tons of golds and mat for the keep.

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I hope the NPCs will have a voice audio in the future, its a little boring when you will only hear the game background.

Sometimes, the characters is just attacking instead of skinning the Elk even when the cursor is pointed at the Elk.

The game is certainly not boring but some aspects needed to be added to make it more entertaining. It would also be better if you display the description of the quest or what you need to do for the quest somewhere in the screen because its a little confusing during my first time logging in. Nevertheless, I like the concept of the story made which is kind of interesting.

 

My feedback is based on less than an hour of playing.

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The simple arrows you used to be able to buy from a vendor in the GR temple used to stack to 5000 I believe. Now, when you create simple arrows which have slightly higher damage (34 vs 24) and you can specify what type of arrow you want-they only stack to 500? Even the ones from the vendor seem to have a 500 limits. Obviously hte best solution is to have a quiver, but the interim solution seems a step backwards.

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Grab a cold beer, light the bong, and sit back.  I am sure it's going to be a bumpy ride.

I wanted to discuss some issues I have with the current state of Crowfall.  Topics include (but are not limited to):   Changes made - Crafting - HUNGER DOME and ECS - Infected - Content - Eternal Kingdoms - Alliance.

Changes Made - Two major changes were made in the not so distant past. Passive training tree and Domain choices for character creation are the two that I keep pondering about.

          Passive training was a great idea I though.  It did need some tweaks on what was time gated and what was not, but overall I liked it.  Just because I could level a crafter or harvester with out being online all the time.  My skills in Crafting and Harvesting would be on par as everyone else even if I could not log in as much. Yes, a catch up mechanic would have had to been developed.  There could have been easy ways around that, but that is another topic.  Another reason I liked the passive training was because it did time gate.  Now there is no way that a solo crafter can keep up with a guild supported crafter.  So, the only choice I have is to help gather to help the guild crafters get mats so they can level as fast as the other big guilds. Being in a guild is great, but if you like to craft but are not the guild crafter . . . 😞.  So in a big guild you have a small amount of Crafters/people supporting 50 - 100 members.  Just feel this hurts Econ and my feelings.  I want, I want, I want my crafter to be useful. 

          Domains were introduced to make harder choices with more options for class creation, is what I thought, but I could be wrong.  I liked being able to make a pistol Dirge and not be stuck using rapier to be viable.  I do like the current system, but . . . I liked the open system where I could equip any disc no matter class.  I wanna make a Bomb Pally.  I want, I want !! !!  I know this would be a balancing nightmare so I understand. 

Crafting - Oh lord, please make my crafter useful, Amen.  Where do I end?  There is to many ways to begin this topic.  War tribes, Cost, and Why is what I am concerned about.  

          War Tribes is the best place to get gold and gear at the same time.  War Tribe gear is almost as good as top quality crafted gear.  Going to a fight in War Tribe gear is not something people are worried about because it is good freaking gear at a great price.  The only down side is the durability.  Big guilds will farm War Tribes to Gear up and get gold while passing the gold on to the guild crafters.  Giving larger guilds the advantage, it is really noticeable at end game crafting level.  End game is when the crafters start to shine.  Early crafted gear is trash and people don't even put it on player vendors because it's easier to go hit mobs and get better gear.  If you can't sell it to a Newb then it is NPC vendor trash.

          What does it cost to make a crafter? A ton of gold to level the Discs.  A ton of materials to craft gear to get discs to drop.  (insert crafting guide here)  Alot of time, effort, and GOLD.  Price for dom dust is . . .OMFG.  That is alot of time not crafting.  Takes up time gather gold, materials, and time (to finally get some crafting in).  Oh and I forgot . . . time for siege. . . I don't have time for none of that other stuff 🙂 .  Being in a guild can help if your the guild crafter.  All mats and gold should goto the most experienced crafter in the guild until fully maxed.  Then higher level mats will still be needed by the highest level crafter in guild, but then is the time to start others.  Just sux to have to wait cause I like crafting (yes I am one of the crazy ones).  

          So why even make a crafter if you are not in a guild and the main crafter.  hmmm  . . . Because I am crazy and enjoy crafting.  As long as I am in a great alliance/guild, gathering mats for the crafters, and showing up for sieges, I do get pretty much what I ask for crafted.  So why make one?  Just to put it bluntly . . . Don't, unless you are ok with being useless till you max out your crafter and catch up with everyone else.  Oh and enjoy wasting the mats that the maxed crafters could have used to make you better stuff 😛 .

Hunger Dome and ECS - YAY! Hunger dome is out.  HOLY SHoT  ECS with Razer tourney.  Oh wait, I can't get in Hunger Dome on Test or Live.  Wasn't it suppose to come out last patch?  Oh they must be having major issues to only let it be played under snap test conditions.  Wow they are still going on with ECS.  Hmmmm . . . I would love to play Hunger Dome when I just feel like killing someone.  Main concern here is snap tests and gaining enough interest in playing it when it is not avail at all times.  Ok I could play during snap test, if I wasn't busy with siege or IRL stuff.  I would love to come in from a hard day work and jump into a few hunger matches before siege or going harvesting.  Wouldn't it be easier to generate hype and players interest in playin in ECS if it was available at all times?  The only thing I can think is that they are having major (MAJOR) problems and are able to hide it in the small scale.  I have pretty much given up on it till they can make it available at all times.  The problem is I think alot of people are thinking the same thing.

Infected - Is this a "Starting Zone" or a "Campaign"?  It has quests so it must be a starting zone.  It has pvp and siege times so it must be a campaign.  Wait, no one can win so this must be a starting zone.  Damn, I am confused.  Who ever said that starting zones can't have pvp or siege times? So why is this current version in the FvF (Faction vs Faction) Campaign area?  OK, I can understand that there needs to be something there as a place holder till ACE wants to run 2 campaigns at the same time (FvF and Dregs).  Is that why that map is in the Infected area?   Still have no clue, but don't make sense to me to release like that.

Content - Current in game content:  Pack Pigs, Keeps, Forts, Outposts, Harvesting, Crafting, PVP, General Chat, War Tribes, Event tab, glory cards.  Seems like quite a bit, if players chose to do it.  I think I heard that somewhere.  Let's examine 😮 ! 

          Lets start with Keeps.  Not an option if not in a large guild.  A smaller guild could take one once they get the gold to buy a seed, and hold it till attacked.  Once they got it, it's a good bet they will struggle to try to build it.  Especially since all the big guilds are gobbling up the Forts and pigs.  So lets move on to them. 

          Smaller guilds will get ran over by the Zerg during a fort battle and might be able to sneak win a few.  This will not be fun for most since the goal will be to avoid all PVP. 

          Pigs are a way to go to avoid the zerg as much, but big guilds run in groups to avoid getting run over by other groups and will run over you. And you can harvest more then the pigs will give you with slightly less risk due to event tab. 

         OH Event tab, is a good place to look for a fight.  It tells others your location for some actions and spawns of boss mobs.  Don't go unless you have a group.  So that one is content for some. 

         Outposts are fought over by big guilds for leader board points.  Sometimes there are glory cards for the small guilds to get in some content here. 

          Glory cards are content for all but only competitive for large guilds unless the card mentions Landless guilds or per member.  But even that gets skewed  by large guilds locking down the area. So the larger guilds tend to get the per member ones also. 

          Harvesting and crafting are linked due to needing the materials to craft.  Harvesting is best done in off hours if you are able to play then due to IRL stuff.  Can be rough if you don't have a group with you, watch for the zerg. 

         War tribes are good place to get gold, gear, glory card items.  That is why they are fought over and usually covered by a larger guild.

          General Chat is a good place to help others asking questions.  It can also be quite entertaining on who is crying, dying, or whining!  Over all good time as long as you don't get butt hurt over the silly talk that some say just to try to get a rise out of peeps.

          So for content looking at it from a solo or small to medium guild the tally comes in as:  General Chat is the biggest piece of content that any size guild can get involved. 

Second place goes to PVP.  Never hard to find if you don't expect to live any way.  Event tab could be second also but only as a tool for pvp. 

Next is all tied for third place because it all depends on how many large enemy groups are running around on the (what I think is alittle small, seems smaller due to places I can't hide 🙂) map. War Tribes, Harvesting, and Pigs are content but only till you get killed 4 times in an hour or so trying to do each of those things as solo or small group depending on prime time. 

Glory cards depend largely on what the card says. Then on being able to gather or fight enough to outweigh the larger guilds.  And stay way from the zerg.

Keeps, Forts, and outposts will be mainly only content for Large guilds.

         There is no content is a fair assessment from someone that wants to play in a small guild and can mainly play during Prime hours.  The best options for content are General Chat and going to to try to solo gank.  The other options are not there at all if larger guilds own the map. Which makes the maps feel small for some but to big for the other group that doesn't need to hide to have content.  I bet New players feel this more then most and determines if they stay or leave.

Eternal Kingdoms - Damn some of these look great.  Only problem here is that if someone wants to set up a Vendor EK then they tend to run a macro or something to keep it logged in.  There should be a box or something to check to keep it active if it has vendors up.  Something. . . I know it cost ACE to run those servers and the resources it would take to keep everyone ek active at all times.  

          There are other issues, but that really effects the Econ and can't really test it with out every EK running some outside program to stay active.

Alliance -Well that didn't work.  Mega guilds turned to mega alliance back to mega guild due to the lack of a scoring system properly worked out.  An alliance shouldn't be fighting each other for conquest points and is the main reason for the mega Guilds. Blazzen mentioned another UI that showed Alliance points.  At end of Campaign totals are taken from each guild and the points are given to the alliance they are in at end of campaign.  There just needs to be a better scoring system or something in place where the guilds in the alliance don't have to compete for any type of points.  I mentioned Alliance points only.  If the guild is in an Alliance then all points are totaled no matter which guild capped what.  Then there could be a UI maybe that showed the points each guild contributed.  The hard thing is when the alliance is running together, 3 guilds standing in the circle of a fort.  How is the capture determined?  I say the same.  As alliance, the system recognizes if player x is in an ally and capture is done that way.  

The End  Thanks for your time and any input.  I know there are alot of issues I didn't mention.  Put them in here too.  Told ya it was going to be a bumpy ride.  Hope you didn't spill the beer or the Bong water.

It was suggested that I post this here.  This is my feedback after playing again for a bit.  I noticed there was no more suggestion tab also.

Edited by DarnHippy
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1st Feedback:  Put a sacrifice shrine near the runegates in infected PVP areas.  If you're leveling through otw to Skypoint it can be pretty annoying to find sacrifice altars.  The Hero statue outposts only have them sometimes.  Forts don't have them.  Which means you either have to hope you get lucky with outposts or go to a keep just to sacrifice your drops for personal exp.

2nd piece of feedback:  Towns Destroyed by hunger look neat but they feel empty.  It'd be neat if they had some creepy hunger inspired PVE mobs in them with a captain level enemy (1 tier above elite) to give them more flavor.  Bonus points if you tied them into the PVP somehow since this would also give another small sale objective outside of Outposts that people could do things at and get some minor PVP rolling.

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Hey!

I noticed that a lot of my feedback about the infected realm was just incorporated into the game, just want to say it's super cool and I'm glad you guys listened to the feedback it makes me super excited ❤️ 

Also the import changes for the DREGS I'm happy about that too and the water is cool

Since I last gave feedback I joined a smaller guild Corvus Citadel, and we're part of an alliance with a bigger guild Valeria

Right now, I'm not seeing a lot of point to being in an alliance with someone. We help them capture objectives, and give them numbers to fight the other zergs, but we don't really get a share of the victory. They stand in the fort and cap it while we stand outside, they get to win and we don't. It seems to be causing some tension. I think it would be cool if alliances were a more permanent thing each campaign, and our campaign points all went into a shared pool, that way I could go cap an outpost or a fort and it would be helping to overall goal. There can be benefits to being an alliance leader like maybe they get more rewards, or maybe you have reward tiers for top alliances, top guilds, top individuals. I also feel like the individual rewards are somewhat lacking. My guild got some rewards from the last campaign, but the individual rewards were just export tokens, which I already reduced my inventory down and exported everything before the campaign ended, so it was somewhat of a letdown. As a newish player, I'd like to get like a cooler horse or a pick of a good piece of gear because that's what I struggle with most as a fresher player.

The other thing that I learned in DREGs is that the sieging of keeps isn't fun right now. Most keep sieges quickly end with the defenders blowing up the bane trees and the siege ends. I think the bane trees are super cool lore wise, but the defense of the keep should be a defense, not a attack the tree thing IMO. It also helps with the zerging aspect of DREGs, the bigger guilds will have to dedicate forces to hold the keep for the full hour, meanwhile this leaves forts open, do you split your forces to try to also hold the forts or attack other keeps?

I think it would be super cool if the bane trees did something. Like the attackers could capture them and they would spawn in some NPC reinforcements, or act as a little respawn point and then the defenders could destroy them. In a slightly different direction, the bane trees could spawn NPCs that are hostile to the holders of the fort, and constantly try to reach the life tree. Destroying the bane tree could be like a little boss fight and maybe you can get some loot from it. OR combining both ideas, the trees spawn mobs, attackers can attack the mobs to capture the tree and spawn ally NPCs that attack the keep, defenders can attack the tree to destroy it and it spawns some keep guards around it, the attackers can attack the guards and regrow the tree after a certain amount of time.

IDK if that's all complicated, but as long as the bane trees serve as some kind of purpose more than just to end the siege quickly, they should benefit the attackers somehow. 

One other thing I noticed with this update is that the camps seem a lot smaller, this isn't necessarily bad because it sort of promotes rotating between different camps, but there needs to be more camps to rotate to I think. Also it would be cool to have more double camps right next to each other, maybe with different mob types. Like what if a centaur camp and a fae camp spawned next to each other and they had a little spot where they would fight each other sometimes. That would make the world feel more alive I think, but idk if that's out of scope. 

Also I like the main game, but I don't want to do hungerdome, let me turn off those notifications lol, if you turn this game into hungerdome I will be sad, but also get that amazon twitch $$.

Also my guild buddies are saying they can do 3k AoE hits with Alpha Neck breakers with Heavy weapons and that's like almost half my HP so if that's true plz nerf I'm dying out there. 

Really liking the game so far still, I think I want to get into some gathering next even though it seems super daunting with the amount of materials that are needed. I also apparently have to start my gathering journey in the infected because I can't do damage to anything is dregs haha.

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18 minutes ago, MacSlain said:

Right now, I'm not seeing a lot of point to being in an alliance with someone. We help them capture objectives, and give them numbers to fight the other zergs, but we don't really get a share of the victory. They stand in the fort and cap it while we stand outside, they get to win and we don't. It seems to be causing some tension.

This seems more like an issue with the terms of your guild's alliance than in-game systems. Good feedback though.

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There is definitely some issue with the terms of the guilds alliance, I agree. The issue I have with the in game system is that if I capture an outpost I'm not contributing to the alliance winning because the points go to my guild when we're supposed to be stacking it all on one guild or w/e. That might still just be a personal alliance issue tho haha.

Anyway I came back because I had a couple shower thoughts. The reason defending a keep for an hour is bad is because it's boring to sit in an empty keep if no one comes to attack, by adding mob spawns to keep defenses it makes the defense always engaging and rewarding.

Also if you add NPC - NPC fighting, make them deal reduced damage to each other, so that players can find them fighting and are the biggest impact in an NPC - NPC fight =P

 

Edited by MacSlain
stuff from previous post was also in this one when it didnt need to be
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I'm happy to be able to play the beta, and test everything I can.
At the moment I can say that the game is really visually pleasing. The combat is very fluid and fun. By including sand box elements it also adds an extra point, since there are few games that combine rpg + sand box.
The only problem I have so far (I'm level 8) is that some map elements disappear as I get closer to them. For example, I kill 5 wolves and when I get close to looting they become invisible. I only see the buttons to collect the loot but I can't see the corpses to remove the skins. Another point in favor, it seemed very good that they added a button to grab the entire drop ^^, something good would be that the drop of monsters of the same type will also be consolidated, going back to the previous example, if I kill 5 wolves and there are 5 wolves in the same place, when pressing G to collect everything, it would be nice to be able to collect the loot of the 5 wolves by pressing the G key only 1 time and not having to do it 5 times. They are just advice from someone who has played rpg for more than 20 years.
I hope that in the future the game will not be P2W since it is a game with a lot of potential and it promises a lot.
Thanks once again!

 

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Currently, Crowfall lacks a Hubworld; a persistent location where the population is funneled when not actively doing some other activity. A place where people can interact, use basic services, etc. The temples in GR and Infected are the closest thing, but there is just little reason to hang out in these areas. They're small, they're not terribly impressive or immersive, they're very function focused, etc. So they end up just being pit stops, basically. Guild EKs can function like a Hubworld for a given guild, and maybe one day there will be popular public EKs, but this splits up the player base to the point that it doesn't feel like an MMO. Currently, there's just not a good public place in a persistent world to hang out. Hubworlds/cities are really a cornerstone of MMOs. Having a persistent castle and city area that utilizes the impressive assets that Crowfall has would be a really nice addition to the MMO side of things.

Another common complaint is that the economic/trade systems are confusing, difficult to navigate, and too fractured among EKs. The EK system almost works, but there's a lot of pain around spinning up EKs, managing them, searching through EKs to find markets, searching through markets to find vendors/items you want. It's all just really time consuming and frustrating right now. In addition to this, it tends to fracture the player base too much, and it produces a player-driven market that simply isn't inclusive (most players won't be able to engage in any real capacity).

I think most of the tools exist to improve these areas, and a few extra additions would go a long way to improving the feel of Crowfall the MMO. So I would suggest:

  • Create one non-player owned, always-up Eternal Kingdom server utilizing the castle, free-city, and other assets to build a Hubworld for Crowfall.
    • One world themed for each faction would be awesome.
    • Allowing players to invest in the space as a kind of shared faction EK would be interesting.
  • it should have a full array of basic services (bank, NPC vendors, basic crafting tables, etc.)
  • it should have ample player vendor space spread throughout the entire map.
    • Obviously, some limitations on vendor ownership would be helpful, but may not be necessary.
    • Being able to use these vendors as adverts for player-driven EKs would even be helpful.
  • it should probably have relatively high tax rate (taxes are still planned yes?) to encourage players to use Player EKs, if available to them.

Additional suggestions:

  • Bidding on vendor slots would be an interesting gold sink.
  • A 'Market' building that just functions as a way to search active vendors within a single EK would be a nice middle-ground between vendors and full auction house.
    • This would be beneficial even if you still have to walk to the specific vendor to buy/sell.
  • A simple 'Message Board' building in the Hubworld would be one possible way to implement EK/Guild advertisements.
  • Being able to sticky or favorite EKs would be very helpful.
  • I would recommend moving Infected into 'Starter Worlds' band, and rename GR to 'Tutorial.' This probably makes more sense once Shadow campaigns exist. With this, It may make more sense to swap positions of EK band with 'Starter Worlds' band. So that progression is Tutorial -> Infected -> Hubworld -> Shadow/Dregs.
  • Being able to do world selection at a gate from within a Hubworld would be a huge immersion/QoL improvement.

The main idea is to build a persistent Hubworld area for players to socialize in outside of campaigns. Also, to provide a more accessible and inclusive space to set up a vendor with a low barrier to entry, but with sufficient taxes to encourage additional player-driven markets.

Edited by Pystkeebler
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The EK crafting buff should be reverted back to the way it was. There's no reason why we can't have that buff at full power now that we can't import materials into campaigns.

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3 hours ago, Pystkeebler said:

Currently, Crowfall lacks a Hubworld; a persistent location where the population is funneled when not actively doing some other activity. A place where people can interact, use basic services, etc. The temples in GR and Infected are the closest thing, but there is just little reason to hang out in these areas. They're small, they're not terribly impressive or immersive, they're very function focused, etc. So they end up just being pit stops, basically. Guild EKs can function like a Hubworld for a given guild, and maybe one day there will be popular public EKs, but this splits up the player base to the point that it doesn't feel like an MMO. Currently, there's just not a good public place in a persistent world to hang out. Hubworlds/cities are really a cornerstone of MMOs. Having a persistent castle and city area that utilizes the impressive assets that Crowfall has would be a really nice addition to the MMO side of things.

Good luck with this. I know this has been an issue since 2018. What? did you say its 2021 now? Look over there --> Hungerdome.

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Feedback on crafting requirements:

Low to mid tier crafting needs drastic cuts to the materials required.  Right now there is no real ability to learn, experiment, and play around and enjoy the system.  Resource requirements are so high that you need to have a plan or you're farked and any failure or wasted resources feels crushing right now.  IMO poor/common crafts should require about 100% less materials, uncommon/rare crafts should require about 50% less, and epic/legendary should prolly require less too but I'm not experienced enough at those tiers to really say, but 20%/10% less sounds more fair. 

I'm totally ok with end game crafting being a grind fest.  But early game "get your basics" should be trivial to accomplish and mid game "ok now get actual decent gear" should be pretty achievable.  This is especially the case with greens/blues dropping from mobs even in infected. 

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1 minute ago, Ralathar44 said:

Low to mid tier crafting needs drastic cuts to the materials required.  Right now there is no real ability to learn, experiment, and play around and enjoy the system.  Resource requirements are so high that you need to have a plan or you're farked and any failure or wasted resources feels crushing right now.  IMO poor/common crafts should require about 100% less materials, uncommon/rare crafts should require about 50% less, and epic/legendary should prolly require less too but I'm not experienced enough at those tiers to really say, but 20%/10% less sounds more fair. 

I'm totally ok with end game crafting being a grind fest.  But early game "get your basics" should be trivial to accomplish and mid game "ok now get actual decent gear" should be pretty achievable.  This is especially the case with greens/blues dropping from mobs even in infected. 

I agree on the low end. Everything costs too much and resource gain to durability loss is off for new and lowbie players. I wouldnt make any adjustments to mid/late game at this time.

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Feedback on Eternal Kingdom crafting via StoneMason:

I get that this is tied in with monetization so the resource amounts are set higher than normal.  But for a basic homestead it takes nearly 5,000 each of stone/ore/wood. (requires 3 grasslands that require 10 soil each, each soil requires 8 mulch/gravel/ore stuff, each of those requires 20 wood/stone/ore). That's a bit excessive IMO.  And that's just for the land, you need to make the building and etc afterwards.  I've played alot of games with housing and by far this is the hardest housing to achieve.  ESO  you can get a small room for free and then upgrading from there doesn't take much fo the next few sizes but the big sizes are very expensive.  That seems more fair.

For parcels that hold guild halls and larger buildings?  Sure make that stuff a grind.  That's guild oriented group goals.  But for a small house and maybe a few crafting tables and a chest on a tiny parcel?  That should be realistically achievable by most players without a ton of grinding.

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18 hours ago, Doomshadow said:

The simple arrows you used to be able to buy from a vendor in the GR temple used to stack to 5000 I believe. Now, when you create simple arrows which have slightly higher damage (34 vs 24) and you can specify what type of arrow you want-they only stack to 500? Even the ones from the vendor seem to have a 500 limits. Obviously hte best solution is to have a quiver, but the interim solution seems a step backwards.

The best solution is to just get rid of arrows entirely and make all the vendor tier and low tier arrows low tier quivers.

There's no other weapon system in the game that uses ammo, and even arrows have a built in system to make them obsolete. Even at 500 the stack size is big enough that ammo conservation is not a tactical consideration in combat. All equipped items are consumable so they aren't adding a unique resource mechanic. They are literally pointless micromanagement for the sake of micromanagement.

When I asked about arrows the answer given on dev stream was "we haven't actually thought about it in a while, maybe sometimes we want to make things feel bad so they feel good when you progress past them" but this is literally only present for arrows and not every template that uses arrows actually progresses past them. There's no progressing past arrows for the majority of characters that actually use them as doing so requires completely changing your build. Plenty of templates have access to archery that would require a disc or race change to have access to quivers. That's not progression. Its you being stuck with more micromanagement because you decided to not spec for a more specialized archery template. You're already worse at archery, have less abilities, and do  less damage and  range, and this would still be true even if arrows were all converted to lesser quivers with the same stats.

There's no "you have to progress past bullets" for guns. There's no "you have to progress past reagents" for magical attacks. The only similar kind of item progression is unlocking armor types, which is a function of finishing a build. Armor types are actually functionally identical from a micromanagement perspective. Cloth might be worse than plate but the mechanics of both work the same. Arrows alone place a unique additional cost in micromanagement on builds that in no way pays off in additional power, strategic considerations, or build decisions. Whether you can use quivers or not is determined at the point you designed the build and is more a function of how good you want to be in bow tray than whether or not you want a QOL enhancement.

If arrows are a balancing metric to prevent archery from being overpowered why do quivers exist, and why can I carry around a stack of arrows easily big enough to finish hours of combat? If they're a progression feel system why do only bows work this way and not other kinds of ranged attacks?

Arrows don't make sense from a balance stance or an economic stance. They're just kind of this relic of early design that has manifested in a unique QOL black hole for certain templates.

LMAO my website is broken please click this to apply to Flames of Exile (maybe, if that's not busted too)

On 5/11/2015 at 1:48 PM, CAWCAWCAW said:

Rub rock on face and say "Yes food is eaten now time for fight"

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