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Crowfall is Shipping July 6!


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Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, mandalore said:

The fact that most the posts here loudly proclaim the community doesn't think the game is ready should be a big red flag to the devs.  There's no second chances for the launch; look at cyberpunk.  You launch before its ready and you will effectively kill your game. 

 

This seems on par with some of the other decisions though so lets watch it burn. 

You're wrong unfortunately.  Whether Among us or No Man's Sky or Elder Scrolls Online or Final Fantasy XIV (even a Realm Reborn is pretty bad compared to what it is today).  There is an insane amount of room for a comeback.  If Cyberpunk can deliver 1-2 more meaty patches and drop a DLC I fully expect opinion to turn drastically on that game.  I wouldn't be the least bit surprised to see it nominated for GOTY awards with one more significant patch.

And these second chances have been there forever.  MMORPGs are notorious for launching bug ridden messes often lacking a proper end game, lacking good performance, and definitely lacking polish.  Guild Wars 2's Auction House was down for like the entire launch month.  Core quest chains in ESO were broken and teaming was totally farked among other things.  WOW was absolutely crushed under the server load and you could barely play.  Diablo 3 was a horrible exploitative mess upon launch before it found it's footing with the Reaper of Souls expansion.  Sea of Thieves was poorly received iwth an utter lack of content and despite the same complaints it's still got quite the following.  Etc.  STEAM was utter trash for all of the early years. 

Plenty of people fail when they release broken and buggy and incomplete.  But plenty also arise from the adversity and become successes.  And I haven't even pulled out the really big gun yet:  Star Citizen.  Against all odds, reason, and sanity Star Citizen has progressively made more money every year than it has the year before and their development makes Crowfall seem complete, lightning fast, polished, and laser focused by comparison.


So despite my misgivings and it's numerous issues and lack of completion and polish in many areas Crowfall still has a reasonable chance at success.  Gamers are absolutely terrible at their job as consumers that protect their own interests lol.

Edited by Ralathar44
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2 hours ago, Ralathar44 said:

You're wrong unfortunately.  Whether Among us or No Man's Sky or Elder Scrolls Online or Final Fantasy XIV (even a Realm Reborn is pretty bad compared to what it is today).  There is an insane amount of room for a comeback.  If Cyberpunk can deliver 1-2 more meaty patches and drop a DLC I fully expect opinion to turn drastically on that game.  I wouldn't be the least bit surprised to see it nominated for GOTY awards with one more significant patch.

And these second chances have been there forever.  MMORPGs are notorious for launching bug ridden messes often lacking a proper end game, lacking good performance, and definitely lacking polish.  Guild Wars 2's Auction House was down for like the entire launch month.  Core quest chains in ESO were broken and teaming was totally farked among other things.  WOW was absolutely crushed under the server load and you could barely play.  Diablo 3 was a horrible exploitative mess upon launch before it found it's footing with the Reaper of Souls expansion.  Sea of Thieves was poorly received iwth an utter lack of content and despite the same complaints it's still got quite the following.  Etc.  STEAM was utter trash for all of the early years. 

Plenty of people fail when they release broken and buggy and incomplete.  But plenty also arise from the adversity and become successes.  And I haven't even pulled out the really big gun yet:  Star Citizen.  Against all odds, reason, and sanity Star Citizen has progressively made more money every year than it has the year before and their development makes Crowfall seem complete, lightning fast, polished, and laser focused by comparison.


So despite my misgivings and it's numerous issues and lack of completion and polish in many areas Crowfall still has a reasonable chance at success.  Gamers are absolutely terrible at their job as consumers that protect their own interests lol.

Cyberpunk was removed from the Sony Playstation store and has yet to put back.  It's steam largest amount of refunds for any game, ever.  Might be the wrong game to use as a redemption story.  I've played tabletop Cyberpunk, I'm a fanboy.  2077 was over hyped trash imo and CDRP earned a good reputation with the Witcher 3,  Cyberpunk was no Witcher 3, not even close. 

 

I'm a huge Jtodd fan having played sb live and across all of it's emulated versions.  I'm a fanboy.  Crowfall as it stands is not a good game.  It's got great concepts and fantastic opportunities but it's systems are clunky, complicated for the sake of complexity with no reason other than to brag about how complicated it is (looking at you crafting / harvesting loops) and significantly less in almost every way the KS started.  The testing population has been disturbingly small (50k backers, 100-150 consistent testers with another 100-500 fair weather testers) and has some serious server issues with only a fraction of the testers.  If 20k people show up on July 6th I wonder how they will handle it.  I expect launch issues with any game but the CF team has been notably bad at handling complicated server issues.  I gave them a fair chuck of money across a few different KS accounts so clearly I want the game to work.  There seems to be so much left undone.  Unity doesn't have a good track record of large scale usage. 

40 minutes ago, Andius said:

W/HoA were held up as like these mystical forces of highly skilled players with legendary theorycrafters chained to a desk in some deep dungeon holding all the arcane secrets we could use to win if only we knew them.

wiDfyPp.png

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Posted (edited)

When they pulled passives without attempting to work on it, you just knew it was doomed. The way it was done was bad, but wtf some of the stats on there were things no mortal eyes could of seen. Immunity control? Nature resist? Is anyone really padding these numbers? Seriously thought these were placeholders. Also a metric ton of critical strike, it was so bizarre.

The PvE is about as engaging as what activision has turned into WoW. It's just a giant mess of leveling extremely fast, because there is a level skip option. (Sacrificing)

Edited by Impossum
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Has any MMORPG ever launched been "ready" to launch when it did? 

I played through sb.exe, I played through F5ing the Darkfall store for days, I played through DF2 launching without 1/4 of the classes (the only healer class), I've played through countless early access failures since then. 

If you are a fan of hardcore PVP games you show up on July 6th and have some fun. We don't get too many of these hardcore PVP MMORPG launches anymore and as launches go this could potentially be the smoothest of the bunch. 

I first found out about Crowfall in December of 2014 when the play2crush.com website launched. I've been waiting over 5 years for this. For better or worse I hope to see you all on July 6th. 

Blazzen <Lords of Death>

YouTube - Twitch - Guild

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I'm gonna pass on launch, this current Dregs build/ruleset and how everything fell together simply isn't what I hoped the game would be. But my account is still there, if/when they change the rulesets, try different things, maybe game matures a little more, gain more tech and mechanics, then I might drop in.

 

I expect first few months will be rough, but Albion went through the same and thrived, hopefully CF can evolve and become a good niche MMO as well.

 

At least performance seems much better in large scale lately from the videos I've been watching, so the rest is just a matter of game evolving and trying different rulesets for CWs, and implementing new mechanics. 

 

 

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Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, MacDeath said:

No, SOME of these people were very involved in those games, but some OTHER key people are missing. The creative force behind UO and SWG, wasn't Gordon Walton, althought he did good work there, it was Designer Dragon, Raph Koster https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raph_Koster

And although JTodd WAS the creative director on Shadowbane, he too had lots of help. Did all of those key people follow him to Crowfall? No, they didn't

Cool. Ever heard of personality conflicts or creative differences?

Fallout 1 is one of my favorite single player games ever. Would Fallout 4 no longer suck if all the original devs had made it? Probably not.

People get old and boring. Thankfully these guys didn't.

Edited by Retchet
I said Fallout 1 is my favorite game ever but really Crowfall might be now.
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Crowfall redefines the action of "Jumping in the dark". :D

Good luck and hoping for the best. ;)

Catelyn: War will make them old, as it did us. I pity them.
Mathis: Why? Look at them. They're young and strong, full of life and laughter. And lust, aye, more lust than they know what to do with. There will be many a bastard bred this night, I promise you. Why pity?
Catelyn: Because it will not last. Because they are the knights of summer, and winter is coming.

A Clash of Kings, Chapter 22, Catelyn II.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Crowfall Discord Channels: international (english) - italiano

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, blazzen said:

Has any MMORPG ever launched been "ready" to launch when it did? 

I'm not expecting anyone to understand, but I suffered through approximately 5 years of DayZ development. I personally submitted hundreds of bug reports, most of which were absolutely game-breaking exploits. The game went live almost 2 years ago and yet to this day whenever I log in I can almost instantly corrupt my player-state and begin cascading faults to the point of disaster. And yet despite still being broken and having nearly 1/8th of the content Crowfall has, a lot of people are still playing it. People are still making mods for it. There is even a black market on eBay for selling "kits" and rare gear like landmines. There is no leaderboard, no friends list, nothing even remotely resembling anything like a game as we know it. 

That game is one of THE WORST games ever made and I admittedly sank thousands of hours into it. When it killed my PC, I bought a PS4 to play it there. It's a murder simulator where you and your friends can drive a car 120kph on a 64 sqkm map and yet you still can't lean out of the window and fire a pistol. If you get in a car, one of the original selling points of the game, you are literally a sitting duck with nothing to defend yourself except driving fast and swerving when someone starts shooting at you. That game is as BROKEN of a promise as a game can get.

My point is that people do things that don't really make any sense. Why would I sink four thousand hours into a game like DayZ when it was so broken? Because there was and is nothing else like it. Nothing else evokes the raw adrenaline you get when you're nonchalantly exploring an area and some unpleasant person who has been hiding in a port-o-potty for six hours straight blasts open the door and starts trying to dice you up and take your friggin can openers.

Anyone who hasn't played this game since they fixed the frame rate and network lag issues in March and are still going to talk poorly made dergs on it are the same people who probably bought DayZ in pre-alpha and are still to this day demanding refunds on the company's bug tracker. Even if they actually DID like the game and played it, would you want to play it with them? I know I don't.

Even if this game only had 100 total players on at any time after launch, I will still have gotten my money's worth before it even came out.

I can't wait to see you at launch, blazzen.

 

Edited by Retchet
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12 hours ago, mandalore said:

The fact that most the posts here loudly proclaim the community doesn't think the game is ready should be a big red flag to the devs.  There's no second chances for the launch; look at cyberpunk.  You launch before its ready and you will effectively kill your game. 

 

This seems on par with some of the other decisions though so lets watch it burn. 

The crowfall funding page went on vacation.

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As an original UO release day player and SB player (Treachery, Mourning) and low-end backer, here are my thoughts.

I haven't played beta, as I like to just wait and play when release comes, so I have no insights on the state of the mechanics and technology.  So I defer to others on those judgments.  I have another point to make.

As has been stated many times above, almost all games have issues on release.  But it seems the key to success for games like Crowfall are the design aspects encouraging player-driven and immersive play.  There is a customer base that is tired to death of the smooth-running, beautiful and soulless theme parks/Skinner boxes where your end game is running endless repetitions of dungeon instances to gear up to run another higher level set of endless repetitions of dungeon instances.  Many people who like PVP, and have lots of fun with the very popular last-person standing games, hunger for PVP to happen in a richer context.

These are the folks that, if we were ever to go back to those days, you'd find them as children making little forts out of sticks, using mud and garden hoses to make little rivers and dams.  The PVPers who also love Minecraft.

Crowfall aspires to set the table, then let players jump in and run with it.  What happens next - who wins, who loses, who builds a lasting successful war machine, a beautiful and much visited kingdom, an immersive RP/PVP storyline - that's all up to us.  That is where the energy will come from.  Either it catches the imagination or it doesn't.  If you don't find that spark, that sweet spot, no amount of smooth animations and glossy graphics will save you.

I don't doubt the improvements needed.  SB had an original nightmare concept that you had to maintain fortress walls with gold, piece by piece.  They ended up fixing that, and putting time into improving things, and things did improve.  These same folks are at the wheel now.    I am not being a Pollyanna.  But I think we will only know if they found the magic in that release day and immediate aftermath window.

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It seems crazy to me that people are fine with this launch because they are fully convinced that CSE will be magically fixing all the issues post-launch. They have been at it for so many years already, yet there's still so many basic issues that never got fixed or changed during that time.

Also, what happens if there's only 1000-2000 players at launch? It's not financially feasible for CSE to continue working on a game with such little interest.

I mean this launch thread has been up for more than 24 hours and it has not even broken 100 replies. If I was working at CSE right now, I would feel very unsafe about my current job.

7ug90hM.png


 


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32 minutes ago, macavity said:

It seems crazy to me that people are fine with this launch because they are fully convinced that CSE will be magically fixing all the issues post-launch. They have been at it for so many years already, yet there's still so many basic issues that never got fixed or changed during that time.

Also, what happens if there's only 1000-2000 players at launch? It's not financially feasible for CSE to continue working on a game with such little interest.

I mean this launch thread has been up for more than 24 hours and it has not even broken 100 replies. If I was working at CSE right now, I would feel very unsafe about my current job.

CSE is that other game company doing Camelot Unchained.

macdeath_sig.png

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6 hours ago, blazzen said:

Has any MMORPG ever launched been "ready" to launch when it did? 

I played through sb.exe, I played through F5ing the Darkfall store for days, I played through DF2 launching without 1/4 of the classes (the only healer class), I've played through countless early access failures since then. 

If you are a fan of hardcore PVP games you show up on July 6th and have some fun. We don't get too many of these hardcore PVP MMORPG launches anymore and as launches go this could potentially be the smoothest of the bunch. 

I first found out about Crowfall in December of 2014 when the play2crush.com website launched. I've been waiting over 5 years for this. For better or worse I hope to see you all on July 6th. 

The problem with new MMOs is they're competing against games with multiple years of development on a live product. Crowfalls continuous dilution of content has left it in a threadbare state. Hopefully they get enough money to continue adding depth to the current systems because as they stand its pretty meh. 

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Posted (edited)

RIP Crowfall, you were only good for having us dream of an MMO that was never meant to be. 

To people whom are thinking this game will make a come back, let me remind you this, this game has failed to take up proper shape and actually start feeling like an MMO in 6 years of funded development, it is not getting anywhere. It will die out in few months, they will keep server's up until some time and then they will run out of funds to keep servers and eventually servers will shut down as well and no one will remember this game other than us.

But then again, at this point it is pretty clear ACE can't make this game a reality. So we may just as well be over with it.

Edited by Eren
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Posted (edited)
On 6/3/2021 at 8:40 AM, Ralathar44 said:

Oof, this is bad news.

- Game feels like it still have like 1+ year of development left to be completed

- Siege timers are still going to MURDER player retention.  Example: ever since the NPE rolled out there are two forts I've wanted to take but they only become siege available once a day for 1 hour and I can't plan my entire life around your stupid timers.  People looking for PVP and given no real reason to PVP either log off or go gank people farming and progressing because they're bored....which is not ideal for either party.

- High geared/vesseled people in God's Reach is still quite a significant issue as they are so powerful relative to the average god's reach player they can easily take on multiple players at once. 

- Speaking of the difference between a fresh 30 and a geared 33+ in general is insane.  Large power gaps is anathema to PVP because the core conceit of PVP is that skill matters.  When someone is literally powerful enough to take on multiple normal players skill does not matter. 

- Despite this being a PVP first game theoretically all progression is actually PVE centric.  With no PVP rewards and lucrative PVE rewards the optimal way to play will always be to avoid PVP as much as possible so you can PVE your way through progression.

- The PVE progression curve grind is long so your average player upon release is going to take multiple months of PVE grinding before they are competitive.  Only no-lifers (of which I qualify) will progress quickly through the ranks.  This means with the large power gaps provided by that grind the game quickly becomes a case of haves an have nots.  Either you have stupid amounts of time to dump into the game or you will be significantly less powerful than someone else.  While some of this will even out after launch amongst whatever population stays via suvivorship bias it also becomes more and more oppressive to any new players/guilds that show themselves after the launch rush since they'll be entering a world of primarily geared/vesseled players and that is a truly dergsty experience.

- Skypoint is now just a harvesting location thanks to the gold drop changes.  Alot of people have moved out of Skypoint because it's more effective to gold farm elsewhere.  The need to constantly deposit to limit your risk and the occassional gank lowers your effective gold per hour significantly.  This is only going to get worse with more population and more players competing for the same amount of resources. 

- The current war tribe camps and harvesting nodes allows slow but consistent progress to the current population.  It cannot handle a massively increased population.  If the game actually gets a significant burst of new people then there will be too few resources spread too thin amongst too many players.

- There are still significant coverage gaps for people who enjoy the dregs ruleset resulting in them being bored for sometimes days at a time.  Meanwhile people who prefer the Shadow ruleset are completely SOL since god's reach offers a severely reduced, nuetered, and inconsequential faction PVP experience.  No rewards, no goals, half the actual keep/etc mechanics, and all timers preventing you from actually playing the PVP.

- Load times after the last major patch took a big hit and that needs to be cleaned up still.  I went and fixed myself a sandwich and came back and it was still loading on an SSD.  That's not great. 

- Many more things .  Man, I know yall have to release eventually and I'm guessing your running out of runway (ability to cover operational costs) but man this is going to be a really rough release even by MMORPG standards.  This feels closer to Age of Conan level of release than it does to even Elder Scrolls Online level of release.

At least age of conan was fun and pushed some boundaries when it came out, this game is so mundane and boring. Its like fortnite and guild wars 2 if they took all the boring, uninspired parts and made it into crowfall. This game is gonna flop so freaking hard if they release in July lol. Guess they realize they have no talent and delaying the game is hemorrhaging cash too much. Alpha/beta has been dead for years.

"Has any MMORPG ever launched been "ready" to launch when it did? 

I played through sb.exe, I played through F5ing the Darkfall store for days, I played through DF2 launching without 1/4 of the classes (the only healer class), I've played through countless early access failures since then. 

If you are a fan of hardcore PVP games you show up on July 6th and have some fun. We don't get too many of these hardcore PVP MMORPG launches anymore and as launches go this could potentially be the smoothest of the bunch. 

||||||||I first found out about Crowfall in December of 2014 when the play2crush.com website launched. I've been waiting over 5 years for this. For better or worse I hope to see you all on July 6th".|||||||| 

LOL darkfall was in such a better state than crowfall will ever be, for all its faults and lack of quality content for certain playstyles Darkfall was a phenomenal game with an amazing engine 

Edited by IsilithTehroth
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