Jump to content
Search In
  • More options...
Find results that contain...
Find results in...
willwill

Progression? Camelot Unchained & Crowfall Comparison

Recommended Posts

 

I don't understand the hostility or venom between these two player bases, Camelot Unchained and Crowfall.

 

 

Well, I admittedly haven't even laid eyes on any CU forums, but to me it looks to be CU fans getting pissy with CF fans. 

 

IMO:  CU fans went all-in on CU because they thought it was going to be as-good-as-it-gets.  Then CF comes along and punches the MMO market in the face, and all of a sudden CU isn't the biggest bad-boy PvPer in the pond anymore.  CU backers, having already invested money, internalize their frustration a bit before venting on the people excited about the seemingly shinier big bad-boy PvPer to arrive in the pond.

 

Some players don't give a crap about this high school "my dad can beat up your dad" crap...then again, some people here are still in high school.  I've seen CU fans be supportive of CF and vice versa.  Some people backed both, and have no regrets.  Some people backed CU, and regret it now that they're backing CF, and just own up to the regret they feel.  Some people backed CU, and internally perceive it to be a sunk cost, even though they don't consciously understand what a sunk cost fallacy even is - these are the ones coming here and *****ing and moaning.

Edited by mourne

"Food for the crows..."    Nobuo Xa'el

cdinUTh.png

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Here's what's hardcore in Crowfall - if you get ganked, you lose your gear like in Ultima Online (yes, I just totally dated myself right there).

 

And I think tri-realm is the way to go. I played Hibernia in DAoC and having Midgard ambush Albion when they went to take out one of our frontier fortresses was a blast.

 

Plus based on what I've heard of Crowfall combat, skill and tactics should matter as much or more than gear or level (since the power curve goes flat so quickly).

 

Do I think there needs to be a more compelling reason besides taking materials back to your home eternal kingdom to "play sims"? Yes. What is that compelling reason? I don't know. Let's help ArtCraft puzzle it out asap so more people back the game. Because I think we're all pretty bored with the current MMO offerings or we wouldn't be here.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

what a complete waste of time arguing which is better, both are different genre targeting different segments of players, just play whatever u want play both if u have the time, and stop trying to force your 2 cents on others I am sure everyone that knows how to read is able to decide how he/she wants to spend their own $$.

 

my 2 cents

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think there might be another factor causing the strife. Camelot Unchained was announced/kickstarted nearly two years ago, and while it just opened up alpha yesterday it's a very incomplete alpha, really more of a pre-alpha based on usual definitions.  

 

And then here is Crowfall, just announced, kickstarter just started, and the complete core module is promised in less than two years, alpha just a few months away, and teaser footage that looks more complete than CU's alpha gameplay.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think there might be another factor causing the strife. Camelot Unchained was announced/kickstarted nearly two years ago, and while it just opened up alpha yesterday it's a very incomplete alpha, really more of a pre-alpha based on usual definitions.  

 

And then here is Crowfall, just announced, kickstarter just started, and the complete core module is promised in less than two years, alpha just a few months away, and teaser footage that looks more complete than CU's alpha gameplay.

 

If that's the cause of the strife, then there are some uneducated people on the backgrounds of both projects.


 

Sorry you turned into a two-bit carebear whose feelings get hurt over forum banter.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My guild has been involved with CU since their KS (some even before).  While some have been hyped by CU, others have been more cautious since their presentation has been slightly unprofessional (overused CAPS, lack of visual assets, and most PATs being lectures and walls of text... again, lack of visuals).  Meanwhile, we've been also following CF, since it was called Play 2 Crush, and SkyForge.  It really wasn't until they renamed to Crowfall and ramped up their marketing (pre-KS) did some of us get more excited for CF than any other upcoming MMO (excluding Star Citizen).

 

I think if CF ramped up and went KS closer to CU's KS, it would be completely different.  Unfortunately, many players already have vested interest and $ into CU, so they're a bit reluctant to jump over and re-invest into CF.  Although, I'm pretty sure many players will eventually do that anyway once they get into the alpha and beta tests.  The constant delays on Alpha and the lack of visuals from the CU team compared to the development efforts of Star Citizen and now CF are taking their toll on CU fans.  But, CF's momentum and community connection needs to continue like we see in Star Citizen (SC).

 

Unfortunately, since CF and CU are more similar than CF and SC, there will be community strife between CF and CU... each defending their choices of which game to support.  Personally, while I think it's great to see more PvP sandbox MMOs in development, I don't think there's room, long-term, for more than 1 popular one.  So, may the best one win ... long-term.


> Suddenly, a Nyt appears in the discussion...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

the main problem for cu is that they decided to re-invent the wheel by building almost the entire engine from scratch, just couldnt figure that part, imo time and resources could have been better spend elsewhere.

 

my 2 cents.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, I admittedly haven't even laid eyes on any CU forums, but to me it looks to be CU fans getting pissy with CF fans. 

 

IMO:  CU fans went all-in on CU because they thought it was going to be as-good-as-it-gets.  Then CF comes along and punches the MMO market in the face, and all of a sudden CU isn't the biggest bad-boy PvPer in the pond anymore.  CU backers, having already invested money, internalize their frustration a bit before venting on the people excited about the seemingly shinier big bad-boy PvPer to arrive in the pond.

 

Some players don't give a crap about this high school "my dad can beat up your dad" crap...then again, some people here are still in high school.  I've seen CU fans be supportive of CF and vice versa.  Some people backed both, and have no regrets.  Some people backed CU, and regret it now that they're backing CF, and just own up to the regret they feel.  Some people backed CU, and internally perceive it to be a sunk cost, even though they don't consciously understand what a sunk cost fallacy even is - these are the ones coming here and *****ing and moaning.

Ironically, If I had not already invested into CU, I would not now.  I have little interest in CU after understanding the direction of Crowfall.  I will give CU and honest evaluation, but Crowfall has my attention right now.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@OP-The Eternal Kingdoms aren't the game, they don't even really mean that much. They are basically just consolation for those upset that they lose all their goodies at the end of a campaign.

 

The real meat of the game, campaigns, starts with 3 faction PvP at the most care bear end of the spectrum and FFA PvP with full loot enabled at the other end.

 

It's not the hardcoreness of this title I have doubts about. It's the depth of it's persistence.

Edited by Andius

"To hell with honor. Win."

A Beginner's Guide to Crowfall (5.8.5 Edition)

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think there might be another factor causing the strife. Camelot Unchained was announced/kickstarted nearly two years ago, and while it just opened up alpha yesterday it's a very incomplete alpha, really more of a pre-alpha based on usual definitions.  

 

And then here is Crowfall, just announced, kickstarter just started, and the complete core module is promised in less than two years, alpha just a few months away, and teaser footage that looks more complete than CU's alpha gameplay.

And you know this how? Because you're breaking the NDA? Crowfall has shown bits and pieces of 5-10 second video clips pushed together.

 

Funny, we'll see "end of summer" when alpha starts for crowfall, where it is compared to CU which also launches in 17 months.

 

Where do you think Camelot unchained would be, if they just bought their world engine ?   Do you think their engine just magically appeared ? Do you know how much work goes into making an engine, let alone an engine running 1000 people in a zone without it being a slideshow?  How about reading your wonderful "Crowfall" unity 5's post. I'll quote it...

 

 

As a team that has built more than their fair share of game engines as both hobbyists and professionals it's hard to overstate how much time was saved by not having to wrangle all these third party libraries and make them play nice with one another

 

Yeah. Congrats, enjoy the Unity 5 engine, but don't come shat on a developer for creating their own PhysX based engine that has amazing FPS for the type of game they are creating.  Let alone also releasing ahead of schedule the stand alone alpha builder

B-9hoD_XEAASWdv.png

 

Original Picture taken from the engine creators twitter

https://twitter.com/EvilGlee/status/571783019532591104

Edited by willwill

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

what a complete waste of time arguing which is better, both are different genre targeting different segments of players, just play whatever u want play both if u have the time, and stop trying to force your 2 cents on others I am sure everyone that knows how to read is able to decide how he/she wants to spend their own $$.

 

my 2 cents

 

Got to agree here. It's only money and is easy to come by. $60 or so for CU, $215 for CF, makes no difference. Play both, enjoy both, or pick.


 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think there might be another factor causing the strife. Camelot Unchained was announced/kickstarted nearly two years ago, and while it just opened up alpha yesterday it's a very incomplete alpha, really more of a pre-alpha based on usual definitions.  

 

And then here is Crowfall, just announced, kickstarter just started, and the complete core module is promised in less than two years, alpha just a few months away, and teaser footage that looks more complete than CU's alpha gameplay.

The problem is gamers nowadays do not know what an Alpha is,  beyond a advertising gimmick these days.   Yes KS was 2 yrs ago,   How long does it take to make a Game Engine from scratch,  that will support massive battles, then make the tools required for spells/skills,  characters,  buildings.  Of course it has taken some developement time.  Does anyone know Unity's max players in any of the titles it is used in???

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What game/design do you hold high on a pedestal that would be a better direction to go in? And why? Examples of features and why they would result in a better overall experience for all and not just you personally, unless you plan on playing a lone.

I think its going in a great direction as is. People are reading into EK's more than its worth. They are there for players to use or neglect. Like pvp alot? Turn on EK pvp and kill till your ready for a new map. Wanna strategy plan a new castle and have a few guilds storm your base? Go for it. want it to be a giant ball of dust that you never step foot in and jump happily from one campaign to the next? I'm not stopping you.

It's tool/glorified lobby/whatever else you decide to turn it into. It only becomes end game if you want it to be endgame.

At this point I don't know whats more disheartening. The fact that players focus too much on a small aspect of a game they can ignore, or the fact they want to see something that they can ignore/never bother with and have it tossed that would be of use to someone else.

 

But it is more like a private server since you could be kicked from it for killing the "EK" owner? 

Sure, but if the owner had pvp turned on you and pk'd 'em and they kick you for it? Why the hell is pvp turned on in the first place?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And you know this how? Because you're breaking the NDA? Crowfall has shown bits and pieces of 5-10 second video clips pushed together.

 

Funny, we'll see "end of summer" when alpha starts for crowfall, where it is compared to CU which also launches in 17 months.

 

Where do you think Camelot unchained would be, if they just bought their world engine ?   Do you think their engine just magically appeared ? Do you know how much work goes into making an engine, let alone an engine running 1000 people in a zone without it being a slideshow?  How about reading your wonderful "Crowfall" unity 5's post. I'll quote it...

 

 

Yeah. Congrats, enjoy the Unity 5 engine, but don't come shat on a developer for creating their own PhysX based engine that has amazing FPS for the type of game they are creating.  Let alone also releasing ahead of schedule the stand alone alpha builder

Don't go comparing apples to banana's both have very different idea's of where they want to take their games. If Camelot Unchained wants to build their own engine and do things their way, that's their call. Its perfectly viable for them to build from the ground up on foundations they have laid. Its their plan and vision that they are making reality.

CF is a game based mostly on survival, exploration, destructibility and to a lesser extent building. They simply chose to go with the route that fits them and their vision best and how they believe will get that vision made into a reality that we all can enjoy.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And you know this how? Because you're breaking the NDA? Crowfall has shown bits and pieces of 5-10 second video clips pushed together.

 

Funny, we'll see "end of summer" when alpha starts for crowfall, where it is compared to CU which also launches in 17 months.

 

Where do you think Camelot unchained would be, if they just bought their world engine ?   Do you think their engine just magically appeared ? Do you know how much work goes into making an engine, let alone an engine running 1000 people in a zone without it being a slideshow?  How about reading your wonderful "Crowfall" unity 5's post. I'll quote it...

 

Yeah. Congrats, enjoy the Unity 5 engine, but don't come shat on a developer for creating their own PhysX based engine that has amazing FPS for the type of game they are creating.  Let alone also releasing ahead of schedule the stand alone alpha builder

B-9hoD_XEAASWdv.png

 

Original Picture taken from the engine creators twitter

https://twitter.com/EvilGlee/status/571783019532591104

 

Regardless if you have backed both and or are a fan of both, there is no real constructive purpose to CF vs CU discussions. Could have had a discussion about CF's progression and EKs without any mention of CU (not that there aren't already countless EK threads).

 

If you don't want people "shatting on devs" from another game you like, don't bring them to the discussion.

 

Not sure how the CSE team can model server/client load with future assets at this point to guarantee 1k people and amazing FPS, but I don't know much about game development. If it turns out that way and it looks top notch, great, all the extra effort with an original engine will have paid off.

 

If ACE can pull off X people and X FPS with current or future art, along with voxels, great.

 

Both are taking risks and I'm assuming neither know exactly what will happen. Not like Unity has a huge track record for games such as this, it isn't really a total easy button. Luckily the CF team looks to have talent and hopefully going with Unity and VF pays off.

 

Whatever happens, just remember where you are at. Some of your wording is showing where your loyalties are, which is fine, but comparing or trying to pit two products against either other in one camp's forum isn't going to go anywhere. "Your wonderful Crowfall" seems like something a non-CF fan would say.

 

It's like going to a Chevy forum and going "Lets compare Ford vs Chevy" and then getting offended when the majority are for Chevy. Doesn't make a lot of sense. Gaming (like most things) is very personal and subjective, logic and being objective doesn't have a ton of room to work.

 

I'm also following EQN/Landmark and could link a bunch of pretty damn amazing player made creations using Voxel Farm within the Forgelight engine. Doesn't really prove or mean much. Glad the CU team is making progress, but it honestly still looks pretty unexciting visually. The spell crafting stuff looks promising, but again, different game, different design, all can exist and entertain us all.

Edited by Allein

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Nice update today about the Instanced pvp tournaments and such. Is this guild wars 2 now?     The recent copy/pasting of CU already announced features is funny.  But, i guess that tells you they were good ideas to begin with? 

Yes, this is GW2 now.

 

Move along


 

This game looks like a larger scale version of marvel heroes so far with forts.  - nephiral marts 7 2015

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

...  The recent copy/pasting of CU already announced features is funny.  But, i guess that tells you they were good ideas to begin with? 

 

Interesting accusation... care to elaborate?  Perhaps with an example?

 

Although, there may be a few similarities, CU is taking a more traditional approach, while I find that CF is evolving the features in a positive and refreshing direction.

 

For example, since you're going off today's update, character progression not being XP level based... is something that Elder Scrolls has been doing for MANY years.

 

Between the 2 upcoming MMOs, CU is going to appeal to players that prefer more familiar MMO features, while CF is going to appeal to players looking for a more evolved set of features.  In a way, CU is sort of boxed in, since they're riding off of DAoC... in somewhat of a DAoC v2.  Meanwhile, CF is a new IP with the ability to start completely fresh.  Although, there may be a lot of Shadowbane fans, CF is not SB v2.

 

The expectations by each community is quite different.  Not that one is right or wrong, just catering to different types of players.


> Suddenly, a Nyt appears in the discussion...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So you're saying EK's won't be instanced and connected to the campaign that you're in where everyone else can join and leave whenever they feel like it, and as they please ? And there is no zoning between the two or does it have a special connected corridor we've not been told about? 

 

The devs have stated that they're leaning towards locking a character into a Campaign once it enters, or at the very least having a penalty for leaving a Campaign before it ends.

 

So, no you won't be able to head back to your EK mead hall (been playing Skyrim a lot lately) after a scuffle in a Campaign, unless it was the final scuffle in that Campaign.


soli deo gloria

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My question is, in FFA, is the only winner our of thousands 1 person?

 

That's a good question that I haven't seen answered authoritatively, even in other posts where it's closer to the central topic.


soli deo gloria

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...