chancellor

Paladin Class

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Dodge tanks only play second fiddle when up against raid bosses than can practically one-shot them.  In PVP on the other hand, I think Dodge tanks have a marginal edge over the competition, ESPECIALLY in a game without primary healers.

 

Reason being is the ability to avoid crowd control and debuffs.  That mitigation tank may take reduced damage from your Enfeebling Strike attack, but he's still suffering the debuff.  The dodge tank can potentially avoid the entire thing and not suffer any drawbacks.

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Typically it seems very hard to balance avoidance tanks, they seem to never quite dodge enough to be useful or they dodge way to much and become overpowered.  Since the avoidance will most likely be active and not some passive system this shouldn't be the case in Crowfall.   

 

In my opinion when playing an action style combat game movement is king.  The more you can move around and avoid damage and sometimes even avoid focus from your enemies the better off you are.  With no dedicated healers and the likelihood of no static tank and spank type fights I feel like the Templar will be slightly better than the mitigation type tanks in larger scale fights.  Although if the Knight has the ability to block any and everything while he has his shield raised then he could be crazy hard to kill in the hands of an excellent player who is paying attention to incoming attacks.  

 

Depending on the damage difference between 1h+shield and 2h and what style of defense you prefer to have it should be a pretty easy choice on which to play that best fits your play style.  The best part of it will be that they should play very differently and yet fill the same bruiser/harasser/blocker/peeler roll typical of MOBAs.    

Edited by Belaz

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Belaz, when they mentioned his shield block skill, they specifically stated he was only able to block what he was facing, so get behind him and shield block can't do anything.

 

That said, the knight is prolly going to be more useful in sieges because you know where attacks are coming from. Templar will prolly be more useful in the field where all that movement will come in more handy.

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I didn't mean blocking in every direction I meant blocking everything as in all the damage and conditions as if it didn't hit.  Things like poison arrows or fireballs that leave a burn effect or as mentioned above some curse of weakness or something that slows/roots.

 

Knowing what to block and knowing what to simply try and avoid by knowing animations and what others archetypes have for abilities will separate the standard knight from the super knight.  It should also make them pretty tough to kill in an even numbers fight.   

 

Knight feels more like it is suited to be a team protector and Templar feels more like an interceptor and enemy harasser.  

 

Plus the myrmidon is now in the mix and he seems to be a mitigation based dual wielding tank.  Which gives those who want to be a bit less of a glass cannon more options. 

Edited by Belaz

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Here's to the Paladin and in Hopes that it will live up to its name again in Crowfall, cheers.

 

                                                  Jamadin

                                                    Paladin Battle Master

 

Speechless! Jamadin, you said it! 

 

Though also having survivability and being a self-healing tank is fun, too.

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paladins are priest who became warriors while templars are warriors of the church. There is a big difference. To make paladin a synonym of a templar is a mistake in my opinion.

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paladins are priest who became warriors while templars are warriors of the church. There is a big difference. To make paladin a synonym of a templar is a mistake in my opinion.

I don't accept this definition. 

what's your source for this idea?

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Well historically templar knights appeared in the middle ages. They lasted for 2 centuries leading the crusades for the pope. Eventualy they grew to be a great power.After the holy land was lost the king of france philip the 4th used this opportunity to disband the templars. Being a relative of the pope made it easier. They were used for the churches wars then when they grew in Power they were struck down by the same people who gave them life.

Paladins from what i read are more legend then history. So depending on the legend you use they could be similar because some do fight for god by fighting for kings since kings were given the right to rule by god.

Edited by tduran91

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Hey belaz i see your picture is from ironclad great movie but the templars assisted king john at that time. Still a good movie though. Probably what the templars should have did.

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Will the Paladin be a sub-class for the for all of the tank classes once you advance your character along enough, or will it become its own special Archetype?

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Hey belaz i see your picture is from ironclad great movie but the templars assisted king john at that time. Still a good movie though. Probably what the templars should have did.

 

Good eye, that movie had some pretty accurate fighting styles with the great sword.  Good movie indeed. 

 

The picture actually strikes me more as the Champion Archetype, but as you can probably guess I approve of 2h weapons. 

 

Paladin will only be a progression class for the Templar, most of us are guessing it will have part of the Templar skillset and will bring its own unique skills to the table. 

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Paladins & Templars are both hybrid magic/melee classes. That is, that they're classes that are equipped to fight in melee, on the front lines, but have access to limited spellcasting.
 

Functionally, the only difference is that a Paladin is a defensive caster while a Templar is an offensive caster.

To couch it in Shadowbane terms, the Crusader had a spammable heal, a large percent-based heal, some self-buffs and one of four group buffs. A Templar, on the other hand, had a quick-casting DoT, a large damage/atk speed buff, health drains and drain-over-times, and single-target debuffs. Both wore heavy armor, but the Crusader favored a shield and one-hander, while the Templar had his signature Burning Greatsword.

Edited by Psyentific

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Paladin's in Crowfall will have only a 1h mace or a 2h maul...the picture they released it is hard to really tell which, but there is no shield. So if it is 1h mace and no shield I am a little...er...confused.

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Hard to speculate at this point since we've seen so little so far, curious to know more becouse I usually play a Templar or Paladin-type in most RPG's/MMO's.

 

 

 

Paladins & Templars are both hybrid magic/melee classes. That is, that they're classes that are equipped to fight in melee, on the front lines, but have access to limited spellcasting.
 

Functionally, the only difference is that a Paladin is a defensive caster while a Templar is an offensive caster.

To couch it in Shadowbane terms, the Crusader had a spammable heal, a large percent-based heal, some self-buffs and one of four group buffs. A Templar, on the other hand, had a quick-casting DoT, a large damage/atk speed buff, health drains and drain-over-times, and single-target debuffs. Both wore heavy armor, but the Crusader favored a shield and one-hander, while the Templar had his signature Burning Greatsword.

 

I think this is the most accurate guess we can make at this point.

 

Even though we've not seen the Templar with a shield, it's possible one of it's promotion classes will get one: Not unlike the Knight promoting into a Sentinel and getting access to a bow, trading in his shield. It's also most likely that the (Knight) Crusader will rely on a two hander, like a Templar, thus also dropping his signature shield: That's 2 out of three promotion classes where the Knight gets rid of an iconic piece of kit. 

Looking at this, it's not unreasonable to think it possible one of the Templar's promotion classes will gain access to a shield: The Paladin would make a good candidate here. 

 

Then again, from the class symbol, you could argue the Templar and all it's promotion classes get their avoidance from dodging/evasion.  

 

In conclusion, what could we possibly expect when we compare the Templar and the Knight possible promotions to Paladins or Crusaders respectively: 

> A Knight with a two hander who gains a Templar-like style of play, only tougher, but more mobile?

> A Templar who gains a Knight-like style of play, only more mobile, but not as durable as the Knight?  

 

Then where do archetype abilities come in? Like access to spells or special attacks? 

 

No idea personally, but looks like there are some interesting possibilities. 

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I personally don't think they will cross classes like that.  I think that if you want a sword and board tank you go knight, if you want a 2h tank you go Templar. 

 

I would be willing to bet that no matter which promotion choice you make for the knight you will still have the shield and his block ability. 

 

I just feel like they are making it so when you see that human sized archetype across the battlefield and it has a shield its a knight if it doesn't then its a Templar.  It seems like they are going to stick with that easy to recognize your opponents base archetype thing, but the promotion path might be more subtle.  

 

I mean you can pick out a Legionnaire or a Stalker rather easily, so why not the same for the knight/templar and the rest of the archetypes?

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Well the build of the characters will give them away. The knight is the meatiest of the humans. The Templar seems to wear more form fitting armor that is half plate.

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Give me ret or give me death.

If one of the specializations is anything like the Retadin, PLEASE don't give it the same treatment WoW gave them until halfway through TBC. (yes protadins were worse but they got fixed like two patches earlier than ret) Don't make them unplayable and unable to do their job for so long that people on the WoW forums would literally try to argue that Paladins shouldn't be able to DPS because "they're paladins, they're healers man!"

YEAH BRUH LET ME JUST STAND IN THE BACK AND HEAL YOU WITH THIS PLATE ARMOR AND AND HAMMER TWICE AS BIG AS YOUR HEAD

Then again, you guys seem to not have primary healer classes, so you probably won't fall into this trap.

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From watching playtesting I see that sin from multiple confessors can build-up quickly.
I'd like for paladins, as holy warriors, to have the passive ability to shed some of the sin cast upon them onto nearby enemies, especially hunger-infested enemies. We could call the ability Impute.

Edited by chancellor

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If there is one, make it an aura bot. You heard me, a god damn aura bot. 

Isn't Legionnare already gonna be an aura bot?

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