Jump to content
Search In
  • More options...
Find results that contain...
Find results in...
Jihan

Currency, Crafting, And Unit Of Account

Recommended Posts

So we know there will be no NPC merchants to buy or sell unwanted items. There's a strong implication that there will be no "coin" as such, and that all commerce will be based on exchange of usable items.

 

Path of Exile went this route and it works very well: there are nearly 20 different "currency" items in the game, each of which has a different use in the crafting system. Exchange rates among these different currencies have stabilized and are relatively well known, so there's little confusion if someone is offering an item priced in Exalts and you'd rather pay in Divines.

 

PoE currencies work as "money" because they fill most of the standard economist's definition of what makes a good currency: they are portable, divisible, durable, and fungible. They are sufficiently rare to make them valuable, but the supply is sufficient to provide for a tradable surplus beyond what is needed for immediate consumption.

 

Large chunks of granite would not make good money: stone fails the "portable" test. You cannot easily carry enough granite to make a worthwhile trade for a valuable item. It's also not easily divisible if you need to make change. (Unless you're playing a game where the stacking system allows you to easily break bulk materials down into smaller resource stacks.)

 

What do we think would become the currency or currencies of Crowfall? There are a few obvious choices: rare/valuable metals, gems, and thralls. I suspect we'll see all of these used as trading resources to one degree or another, but here are some initial thoughts:

 

* If each thrall is unique then thralls will not make good money. If thralls are fungible (every Tier 2 Forgemaster spirit is functionally identical) then they should make a good top-end currency.

 

* Stone, wood, and metals may make decent low-to-mid value currencies if stacking and unstacking is easy and lossless. Portability becomes a major concern though.

 

* From the "lapidary" discipline mentioned in the Character Development blog, we know gemcutting will be a thing. Gems make a great currency because they're high value relative to their encumbrance. We'll probably see other small, valuable items along the same lines; something that's lightweight, valuable, and easily stackable and unstackable will probably end up being the unit of account in the Crowfall economy.

 

I like the points you make, though I would like to say that a possible currency would be woods/stones/metals, but based on their purity, rarity, level of difficulty to acquire, uses applicable, etc. Now, if we are able to trade items as currency per se, then even weaponry, armor, food supplies and what not could become currency. From something I was reading over, weaponry and gear will not be permanent as with most mmo's, such as you can use a battleaxe for years and it never breaks or goes bad. The gear will break over time, and new gear will have to be acquired. This could open the door to weaponry and armor and other miscellaneous gear being used as currency.


8Xk1ctm.png

Viris colratha dath sethicara tesh dasovallian. Soluris veh za jass.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

barter :

exchanging surplus for demanded items.

 

what I would really like to see is either one of these two:

1) for a non-crafter to make an offer to a merchant of whatever you have on hand.  Currency, materials, or items.  

2) or have merchants able to set price in commodities in addition to currency. 

 

the first might be a bit unrealistic given that the shop owner would have to approve the transaction, so if they are not online it would turn into a long complicated process.... 

 

but the second,  It would be awesome to see shops set up selling needed items and took mats as payment.  Even having multiple ways of paying based on whatever the shop owner needed.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

what I would really like to see is either one of these two:

2) or have merchants able to set price in commodities in addition to currency. 

 

but the second,  It would be awesome to see shops set up selling needed items and took mats as payment.  Even having multiple ways of paying based on whatever the shop owner needed.  

 

Can you imagine having to set that up though? For each and every item.

 

1 Sword for either; 2 Pigs, or 1 Chicken, or 3 Sparrows, or 1 Partridge in a Pear Tree, 

1 Chainmail Helm (Poor Quality) for either;1 Pig,or 1 Horse, or 3 Sparrows, or 1 Sword (Iron, good quality with Healing Burst enchant).

 

I really don't understand what's wrong with plain old simple currency. Heck, I'm even in favour of letting players mint it themselves!

Edited by M0rdred

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Can you imagine having to set that up though? For each and every item.

 

1 Sword for either; 2 Pigs, or 1 Chicken, or 3 Sparrows, or 1 Partridge in a Pear Tree, 

1 Chainmail Helm (Poor Quality) for either;1 Pig,or 1 Horse, or 3 Sparrows, or 1 Sword (Iron, good quality with Healing Burst enchant).

 

I really don't understand what's wrong with plain old simple currency. Heck, I'm even in favour of letting players mint it themselves!

you wouldn't need to set that up per item - maybe just a general setting of what mats you accept in payment and the relation to each other:

 

so like i accept: 1 Stone = 2 Iron = 1,5 Lumber and maybe add a multiplier for Quality/Purity Levels

 

then you just set 1 prefered material you want per item - but all other accepted mats are possible as well.

Edited by Pheelon

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So on the Twitter today they said there will be an in-game currency based on game time. Now, $15 in a chunk is much too big to use as a standard currency, but smaller units might be workable. An Hour would be worth about 2 cents and could reasonably be traded for an hour's worth of resource collection. Minutes could be used for smaller transactions.

 

I'm not sure that's exactly what they meant, but I think the idea works.


Official "Bad Person" of Crowfall

"I think 1/3rd of my postcount is telling people that we aren't turning into a PvE / casual / broad audience game." -

Tully

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

They will be selling VIP tokens (worth like a month each) for in-game cash. At least that's how I understood it.

 

Yeah, but the problem is.... like the EK parcel tickets... is how can you have a full barter system and a non-standard monetary system, when they are introducing features/mechanics that will require a standard monetary system?  Basically, everything will be made relative to whatever currency Ace places in the game.  Unfortunately, that doesn't always work out well economically either.

 

For example, the ArcheAge economy is first tied to the price of APEX (their VIP token), set by the players, and secondly by the price of worker's compensation potions (for extra labor points to use in gathering and crafting).  Several parties have manipulated both the APEX and Worker's Compensation prices to extremely high prices, which over-inflated everything else in the economy and it's too costly to craft because of the high labor cost.


> Suddenly, a Nyt appears in the discussion...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is why I keep shouting about the need for a standard currency, I really do not get why everyone is so doe-eyed about barter. Let the players mint this currency, sure but at least give us the means to standardise. 

 

As to inflation, good for those players! It shows they understand market forces. I'd like to see that in Crowfall too, the ability to inflate and deflate through control of the resources needed to mint. If other groups do not specifically target the monopolies and hoarders, then it's their own fault that they cannot afford anything (and ultimately bad for the monopoly as they will not be able to sell anything any more either). It's just a legitimate tool of economic warfare.

Edited by M0rdred

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would expect VIP tokens to be high-end currency, at best.  We're talking about something worth $15 USD here.

 

Even if they do let us mint coins (here's hoping!), things will be really volatile for a while because no one will know the true intrinsic utility value of things.  Those who play during beta will have a head start on this.

 

If they won't give us mints, at least we can use ingots.  I expect the metals will have the best all-around versatility, and will come in a variety of types that most people can easily rank without having to go to an external currency exchange website.

 

How many coins do you think you would be able to mint out of a single ingot?  Looking at historical coin weights vs. ingot weights, I think that it should be at least 1000 coins/ingot.


soli deo gloria

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would expect VIP tokens to be high-end currency, at best.  We're talking about something worth $15 USD here.

 

It won't matter... EVERYTHING will be priced to the current in-game value of the VIP tokens.  Having no central AH and player shops spread out across multiple EKs, will make it difficult for anyone to really control the market 100%.


> Suddenly, a Nyt appears in the discussion...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is why I keep shouting about the need for a standard currency, I really do not get why everyone is so doe-eyed about barter. Let the players mint this currency, sure but at least give us the means to standardise. 

 

 

Personally, I am for the barter system due to an item in hand and tradeable and that has a use beyond just as a currency has more value to me than something that only has a singular usage. If they are going to let us populate the EKs as we wish, then why not let the world kings decide what goes in those worlds? I understand the currency, whether they go the way of copper, silver, and gold coins as other games have, or if they just set up gold, or what not, will have value of its own as simply currency. I see no problem to a currency, but why not allow a currency and barter system to exist?


8Xk1ctm.png

Viris colratha dath sethicara tesh dasovallian. Soluris veh za jass.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have no problem with this, my fear is in there only being barter and no standard currency. 

 

coins, even raw materials... something will fill the void.  In https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=13f1-w8IPsY .... at about min 32 they talk about using metal for this purpose. 

 

There will have to be something to fill the void.  How else will a players be able to buy and sell their inventory items with an NPC shop...   The shop owner can't be online to manage everything.

 

Will shops need to have an inventory of some currency type item to make transactions possible?... hmmm, maybe.  Will there be shops that focus on purchasing materials from gathering player? .... there needs to be for people who prefer to be gatherers rather than crafters.  

 

Guilds will have to set up multiple types of shops to make a town functional.  Sure eveyone needs basic equipment, but a shop owner focused on weapons will not be interested in purchasing the same items as a light armorer.  I like the idea of having the shop owner define what items are more important to them in trade.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Will shops need to have an inventory of some currency type item to make transactions possible?... hmmm, maybe.  Will there be shops that focus on purchasing materials from gathering player? .... there needs to be for people who prefer to be gatherers rather than crafters. 

 

Yes, I hope. I'd love to see player owned npc purchase order vendors, with a supply of player minted coins, wanting to buy specific resources/materials from other players.  Right next to the finished goods player owned npc vendor, selling finished items for sale for those very same coins.

 

In fact, I'd say we have to have purchase order vendors to make the players vendor system work.  This would do much to empower Gatherers economically speaking.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes, I hope. I'd love to see player owned npc purchase order vendors, with a supply of player minted coins, wanting to buy specific resources/materials from other players.  Right next to the finished goods player owned npc vendor, selling finished items for sale for those very same coins.

 

In fact, I'd say we have to have purchase order vendors to make the players vendor system work.  This would do much to empower Gatherers economically speaking.

 

I endorse this idea. Buy / sell orders were one of the best things about Eve marketplaces.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I endorse this idea. Buy / sell orders were one of the best things about Eve marketplaces.

 

Yeah, I'm sure they're thinking something like this, but I went ahead and tossed it into the suggestion box just in case.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm in favor of the "minting"

Tie that in to how rare the metal is and the ability to melt down the minted coin back

into something usable for crafting so the coin would have a useful value beyond just currency.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It is a risky way to do currency, as people need to familiarize themselves with what items to use, but besides that it works perfectly fine.

I would actually prefer because, if you look at GW, the first one, they used these Armbraces to price really rare items or large quantities of items. The money was so devaluated compared to the difficulty of gathering these armbraces that they became a really high end currency.

 

It is also fascinating to watch an economy build on it's own. It can give the oppertunity for large groups of players to band together and influence the markets to gain an edge in-game.


"Nearly all men can stand adversity, but if you want to test a man's character, give him power." - Abraham Lincoln

A solid quote, I'd say.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...