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cemya

Crowfall Combat - What Does The Pvp Elite Think Will Happen?

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Now that Kick starter has ended and we are into the agonizing wait part, I thought I'd ask how people think PVP will play out in Crowfall, based on what we know.  In particular, these factors that to my knowledge no one has ever mixed together before:

 

1. Friendly Fire

2. Realistic projectile physics - e.g. you fire an arrow at Player A, but if Player B runs between in-flight it can hit them

3. Player collision (including players being able to "push" others and likely skills that block such passage)

4. Destructive Environments

5. No "Fire-Hose" healing

6. Shallow stat curves (meaning even well-equipped veterans can be taken down if outnumbered by new players)

 

I tried to leave out things we don't know yet about aiming/targeting, etc.

 

I do not consider myself an elite PVP person, but I know there are some people out there who do.  People whose guilds go from game to game dominating through sheer skill.  

 

A lot of that past experience - it seems to me - may go out the window with Crowfall.  For example:

 

Focus Fire!

This ancient responsibility of the group leader may run into trouble if the mass fireballs land on your own melee classes as well

 

Stack!

Tactics that rely on people forming a ball (either to maximize buffs or make opponent targeting of squishy classes difficult) may no longer be possible, or at least will not work the same way.

 

There may be others.

 

What do the elite say?  The hard core?  The ones who disdain any activity that does not involve skull-crushing mayhem?

 

The floor is yours...

Edited by cemya

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I think there are some key inconsistencies in the features and statements made about the game thus far. Things like friendly fire and collision are supposedly going to make combat more complex, yet without an applicable targeting method, and features like double jumping and Wildstar movement conflicting directly with the use and significance of collision, it's hard to say how relevant they will be.

 

I think ACE is going to have to experiment with their features and qualify what actually works together.

 

I'm just hoping the game has a variety of tactics and strategy so we can have the grandeur of some surreal battles. And I'm also hoping the archetype gameplay is significantly different from each other so it offers a lot of unique battle interactions.


a52d4a0d-044f-44ff-8a10-ccc31bfa2d87.jpg          Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes... Than if they're upset, they'll be a mile away, and barefoot :P

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I just want the feel of Total War or Age of Empires on a personal scale as though I was one of the crappy units. I was to crush my enemies in whatever way allows me to employ both individual and group tactics. I want success, in a more even match up, to look like it was earned by the better planned party. Those who moved better, blocked better, timed better, controlled ground better and a number of other things.

 

For one example, holding a gate with a line of tanks and other beefy folks. I loved holding gates in Total War. Ensuring proper units in the right places, sending out cavalry behind their mob, archers on the right walls, and siege engines firing in the right locations. It all had to come together. A single well placed unit could make all the difference.

 

I want to see people choosing to walk more spread out, not always in lines or pods, to avoid AoE damage. I also want to see people need to react when the enemy charges their more vulnerable, yet valuable, specialist players during the loose formation.

 

I want to see players break a line with a pinpoint wedge charge of larger archetypes.

 

There is plenty I want to see, but all good strategy and tactics equates to a hardcore experience for me. Friendly fire and no telegraphs are icing out of the jar.

Edited by Adall

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Friendly fire in an aiming based combat system is HUGE for large scale fights.

 

Everything is suddenly more strategic and small organized groups can destroy big ones.

Anyone who played Darkfall knows this, and I am thrilled to see it happen again.

 

I just hope they won't screw it all up by using low-ranged projectiles (like TERA, where arrows have like 10 meters range.. how stupid) and telegraphs.

Edited by fenrisddevil

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I am so  glad they are having friendly fire and player collision, this is great for a PvP game.

 

I really hope they take away telegraphs as it's a bit unskilled, but so far I like what I am hearing, and this game seems like it will be well balanced, and NOT a boring grind like a lot of themepark and even other PvP games.

 

DREGS ALL DAY BABY!

Edited by rs_navlaan

 EOWWuhQ.png 
 

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I think there are some key inconsistencies in the features and statements made about the game thus far. Things like friendly fire and collision are supposedly going to make combat more complex, yet without an applicable targeting method, and features like double jumping and Wildstar movement conflicting directly with the use and significance of collision, it's hard to say how relevant they will be.

 

I think ACE is going to have to experiment with their features and qualify what actually works together.

 

I'm just hoping the game has a variety of tactics and strategy so we can have the grandeur of some surreal battles. And I'm also hoping the archetype gameplay is significantly different from each other so it offers a lot of unique battle interactions.

IIRC Jtodd said in the one of the recent podcast interviews that the wildstar movement wasn't really working out like they wanted and didn't fit the ability lock style fighting. I think they scrapped it and im thinking (from listening to the interview) that it will be slower and more deliberate. They liked the 1.5s ability action lock from Tera.

 

There's too much unplayed to really say how it will turn out but im sure some people will die and some will lewt. I also do horoscopes.

 

Edit: things like physics damage and voxel will really change the way combat is approached. if they do it correctly players will constantly be looking at terrain to gain an advantage outside of their abilities.

Edited by Dirtbag

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I agree with Adall.

 

I hope to see a different type of PVP. 

 

Rather than the usual garbage you see in other games where people are going for kill counts and personal glory, I want to see Tactics and strategy where every player is a chess piece used to counter an opponent.

 

The guilds that are organized, focused and have players that know their individual role as part of a whole will be the guilds that will be hard to beat.

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The guilds that are organized, focused and have players that know their individual role as part of a whole will be the guilds that will be hard to beat.

 

 

This!


The Shipwrecked Pirates

www.thesaltymaid.com

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I agree with Adall.

 

I hope to see a different type of PVP. 

 

Rather than the usual garbage you see in other games where people are going for kill counts and personal glory, I want to see Tactics and strategy where every player is a chess piece used to counter an opponent.

 

The guilds that are organized, focused and have players that know their individual role as part of a whole will be the guilds that will be hard to beat.

Same here. Thats actually one of my main concerns with this game is that the Dev gives us all these tools, ie Action based Combat, siege warfare, risk v reward based gameplay and the players will just turn it into another zerg filled castle flip fest. Seen it too many times before in so called team based PvP games.

 

I just hope its not unreasonable to expect the player base to properly use the tools given us and make and enjoy the combat the way it was designed.

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I just hope they won't screw it all up by using low-ranged projectiles (like TERA, where arrows have like 10 meters range.. how stupid) and telegraphs.

 

I'm pretty sure ranged classes having short range in TERA was intentionally done for balance reasons.

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While some old tactics will be made obsolete by friendly fire and other things what makes a good hard core PvP leader is the ability to assess a situation and adapt to it.

 

These skills will be just as applicable, if not more so, in CF.

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I agree with Adall.

 

I hope to see a different type of PVP. 

 

Rather than the usual garbage you see in other games where people are going for kill counts and personal glory, I want to see Tactics and strategy where every player is a chess piece used to counter an opponent.

 

The guilds that are organized, focused and have players that know their individual role as part of a whole will be the guilds that will be hard to beat.

 

This!

 

I am also very sick of kill counts, kill to death ratios, and things of that nature being glamorized in other games as well.  I don't want people who have a superiority/god complex and "Me" mentality being encouraged to be the douchebags they naturally are and showing up on some kind of leaderboard somewhere.  Those type of people kill my enjoyment of games like this.  Not because I'm a crappy player or that they are necessarily better than me, but it just doesn't encourage teamwork, cooperation or community-building.

 

I want to see tactics and strategies being rewarded and as Kell said have every player be a chess piece and part of a larger group/goal and only the guilds/groups get the glory and not the individual.

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IIRC Jtodd said in the one of the recent podcast interviews that the wildstar movement wasn't really working out like they wanted and didn't fit the ability lock style fighting. I think they scrapped it and im thinking (from listening to the interview) that it will be slower and more deliberate. They liked the 1.5s ability action lock from Tera.

 

There's too much unplayed to really say how it will turn out but im sure some people will die and some will lewt. I also do horoscopes.

 

Edit: things like physics damage and voxel will really change the way combat is approached. if they do it correctly players will constantly be looking at terrain to gain an advantage outside of their abilities.

That's pretty much what I expected, but I saw statements about Wildstar movement as recently as the reddit AMA... I hate to tell designers that it was already apparent that it doesn't fit just from mechanical deduction, but I guess they get a better conclusion from actual demonstration.

 

Don't get me wrong, i want there to be some really radical movement in Crowfall, but it should be class or equipment locked, just like cavalry combat or shield operation or flight would be, not everyone should have an effective block, not everyone should be fleet of foot, not everyone should cast magic spells and knockback foes with battle cries (or anyone for battle cries...)

 

Unique behaviors are the key to creating roles outside the cheesy confines of trinity games.


a52d4a0d-044f-44ff-8a10-ccc31bfa2d87.jpg          Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes... Than if they're upset, they'll be a mile away, and barefoot :P

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I think the combat will end up being similar to black desert in how it plays maybe slightly slower.  Hopefully without the fx gluttony. 

 

I truly believe they are going to make individual requirements for PvP a little on the lower side to satisfy their biggest fanboi groups. 

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I just hope they won't screw it all up by using low-ranged projectiles (like TERA, where arrows have like 10 meters range.. how stupid) and telegraphs.

 

 

hhmmm, now that you mention it.

you're right. In the gameplay footage we see the frostweaver use a ranged skill and that thing had like a 10m range.

 

That would be really disappointing if that was the case in the end. =/

 

 

I can understand max range for straight flying magic projectiles, but stuff like arrows should arc and have a "natural" range.

Edited by freeze

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