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Greatest Flaw Of Crowfall?

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The greatest flaw has to be all this p2w poorly made socks they're pushing on us, VIP subs, how dare they?! And you even have to pay for the game, huge flaw right there, can't imagine something more p2w than having to pay for the entire game, like basically if you don't buy the game you have 0% chance of winning making it literally 100% p2w!!!

 

I laughed so hard at this.  I also like how they directly addressed the whole p2w thing in the streams.  Most of the kickstarter benefits are temporal, which is really the opposite of p2w.  You pay to get access to something early that anyone can eventually get and it doesn't give you any real advantage on the field. 

Edited by Niveus

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Believe me, if you were working on a grand project, you'd appreciate the opinions of your customers and fans.

Not only does it give you a new point of view, it will let you know which feature to test first, what to ask, what to expect.

 

If they did not want that, they would not open a forum.

 

Besides, it is far easier to fix things while they are in planning phases, than after they are an integral part of the entire system.

 

Your example of a "One year old" is good. What if it was born with a heart defect? Should the parents wait and see if it's a good child before deciding to fix his heart?

If I was working on a grand project, I would personally not want the opinions of my customers and fans. I would do it old school and make the vision I had like they used to and actually finish making the game before the majority got their hands on it.

 

This game is a tech demo (Pre-alpha). How can there be flaws in it?

 

You ask what if the child had a heart defect. A heart defect doesn't make a person good or bad. My example had nothing to do with the health of the child, but moreso with the character and development of the 'person' not the body. We aren't our physical factors, we are our souls.

 

Its like these people whining about wanting EK's changed. LOL the game isn't even in ALPHA. Reading a post on something varies greatly from how it is.

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The Greatest Flaw of Crowfall will most likely fade or change with each campaign. Adjustments to rules and how world's work could almost seem like a patchless-patch that keeps correcting itself.

 

Start angry? End Happy? Well, I'm sure everyone will figure it out in the end.

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I have a feeling they will be adding more archetypes as time progresses, either pre or post launch, but that's just a hunch (though I believe I read somewhere that it was a possibility).

 

My only personal reservation at this point so far would be the combat system. I don't want Wildstar telegraphing. Tera's system is ok, I actually kind of like it though I think ranged attacks would have to be adjusted. That being said it has been stated that combat was a work in progress and by no means has it been finalized.

 

Also, there should be friendly fire on every campaign.

Being able to adapt in alternatives later doesn't really solve the lack of a core feature. The game and how it plays in general tend to be designed around the core character selection, few designers prepare battle simulations bases on units they didn't factor in at an initial level.

 

The fact that we got two human knights as our only tank/defender classes, and the lack of a shield and spear Soldier is even more telling.

 

This core unit identifies the true nature of strategy on a battlefield, using intelligently and inspired choices in equipment and strategies engendered by that identity are fundamental to the design mindset.

 

Beyond that, looking at how loosely they've evaluated combat choices and their emphasis on duplicating knight archetypes with no indication of the core battlefield unit, I can only assume they have no appreciation for natural battlefield strategy.

 

Little remarks to the effect of reigning in Centaur movement speed and such only weaken the expectation of deep archetype diversity and strategy emphasis. They've yet to make any commitments or statements on Fae wing teases, their initial demo is full of Wildstar, from telegraphs to double jumps to dodge based defense, and all of it is lack luster.

 

They're all only small pieces of a puzzle, but just because they can change directions doesn't mean they are gonna arrive at a good destination. I had hoped to see a good direction embellished to greatness, not watch as they try to recover from a grave detour in direction. Honestly, it feels like the original combat FAQ and the demo were generated by completely independent labor.

 

Anyway, it might all be fixed, but that doesn't mean it's above reproach, the most significant design decisions are made early on to determine the shape and behavior of gameplay, pretending like the game is going to be okay just because theirs time to change is a fallacy, the game is in its infanthood, and if you drop it on its head too many times it will lose its potential. Early development is the foundation for all future work, if they lay it poorly, the game will forever suffer its initial shortcomings.

Edited by BahamutKaiser

a52d4a0d-044f-44ff-8a10-ccc31bfa2d87.jpg          Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes... Than if they're upset, they'll be a mile away, and barefoot :P

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I laughed so hard at this.  I also like how they directly addressed the whole p2w thing in the streams.  Most of the kickstarter benefits are temporal, which is really the opposite of p2w.  You pay to get access to something early that anyone can eventually get and it doesn't give you any real advantage on the field.

 

How is that the opposite of p2w? What is your definition of pay to win? I'm fine with VIP, but head starts can be pay for advantage. See, for example, Archeage head starts, which are certainly worse than anything I've seen Crowfall suggest. In my opinion, giving backers one-month advanced access to Minotaurs is one form of pay-for-advantage. As I spelled out in other threads, I think having Minotaurs is likely to "give you an advantage on the field." It seems that you would deem such a thing pay-to-win given your post.

 

Additionally, "temporary" advantages almost certainly will compound and manifest as real, permanent advantages in a game designed around winning by beating other players. For example, giving one risk player ten extra troops to start the game is certainly temporary, but necessarily impacts the whole game. Giving the other players ten extra troops after a few turns may seem like it "evens things out," but I argue that, if during the first few turns the first player has pressed the advantage and become Uncle Bob, it is meaningful to the game. Certainly any analogy has its shortcomings, but I'm trying to elicit some nuanced discussion about these types of temporary advantages.

 

Letting backers have Minotaurs one month in advance may be a small enough advantage to be stomached, I just want to continue dialogue regarding it, instead of seeing many fellow posters suggest there are no advantages to be bought. Note that I am not necessarily even against said advantage, since it want Crowfall to adequately monetize their game.


Mic MWH, Member of Mithril Warhammers since 2003,


Hammers High! http://www.mithrilwarhammers.com

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Awwww....

 

 

This is what I was getting at, Todd!  I <3 SB!  

Divine favor, gone. You have angered the gods.


☆ We are in a positive posting drought, so just post. Be the change you want the forums to be. Go wild. Just follow your positive posting star. ☆
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ok....

 

let yer olde Doc settle this Question once and for all..

 

what IS the "greatest flaw in Crowfall?"

 

simplicity itself...

 

we ain't playing it right naow!

 

/thread

 

 

Your wit is astounding. Far superior to the first reply to this thread.

 

Wait why is this thread still open? Are you sure your mod powers are working?

 

Hold on lemme try

 

/thead

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nah...i leave it open so folks can have the Conversation...

 

not my style to "lock" a Thread unless the OP asks, or there's some Reports about it...

 

/shrugs

 

and yeah....the first Post did make the Point, but then went on to fall for the "trap"

 

but i digress...

 

 


FIQw0eP.png

let the Code build the World and it's Laws....let the Players build the rest...

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Well I think there are a few flaws

  • The effort vs reward.  It is what keeps us power gamers interested.  They have passive leveling, What is there that we can do to show us, the more effort we put in the more we get back?  What is there to make us want to do campaigns?  Are resetting instances every few months really going to keep us occupied?  I am really afraid the game will be to shallow without "uncle BoB".  They have done a double whammy to get rid of "uncle BoB".  They took out the power curve almost totally and made instances reset.  I think they should have left us more of a power curve.  The resetting instances and different rule set would have taken care of uncle BoB. 
  • Game has been neutered to simplicity and not sure we have any depth.  If my days are filled with farming mats and running caravans all day, then I don't know if there is enough content to keep me from being bored.  Occasional pvp because everyone wants pve is not my picture of an ideal game.

Those are a few of my concerns....On paper their game sound fun.  I have not seen any flare yet.  other then trying to mold the game around getting rid of the "uncle BoB" dilemma what is so different about this game over every other flavor of the month?  I want more depth and some effort vs reward.  Risk vs Reward is not the only thing players like.  PvE guys like PvE because they have to put effort in to get major loot.  PvP guys like to put effort in to get ahead and own.  The groups are not really that far apart in their play style (they just have different objectives).  I guess what I am saying is they only did not make this game with no "uncle BoB", they may have made it too casual.  Casual to the point people may quit logging in to play because the rewards are not worth the effort.

Edited by nakawe

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Well, I'd have to say, procedural generation will probably become boring, VERY fast. I know it saves on costs, a lot, but I fear that after a campaign or three, it will start feeling, well, boring.

 

I really don't understand this point to be honest, how are procedurally generated worlds going to become boring? Playing on new worlds every campaign in comparison to playing on one or two maps that don't change for many years? Not sure I follow.

Edited by mode13h

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Your wit is astounding. Far superior to the first reply to this thread.

 

Wait why is this thread still open? Are you sure your mod powers are working?

 

Hold on lemme try

 

/thead

You forgot the r in thread. Doc wins.

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My concerns, based only on what I have read in the forums is this:

 

First - EKs will be dead zombielands where nothing roams, no raw materials can be gathered, and no one will be able to build anything on them due to lack of available resources. Or, massive guilds will hold all the "places to be" and the Lone wolf that just wants to be a crafter, wont be able to support growing his EK big enough due to shortage of materials. (remember - speculation, I hope I am wrong).

 

2nd - EK instances crashing all the time due to over loaded servers of 400k+ (went small here)  instances of EKs. (1 per account).

 

(Space reserved for more later)


Lamdred Al'Ker - OTG

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Why would you assume nothing roams the EK? Just because there's no resources doesn't mean there's no flora or fauna. For all you know there could be mobs to fight.


a52d4a0d-044f-44ff-8a10-ccc31bfa2d87.jpg          Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes... Than if they're upset, they'll be a mile away, and barefoot :P

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Why would you assume nothing roams the EK? Just because there's no resources doesn't mean there's no flora or fauna. For all you know there could be mobs to fight.

 

I hope you are correct. They did say something about being able to "learn the game" in the EK, so I assume there will be mobs. It would also be nice to have very small amounts of resources to gather for learning how to craft.  (after all you have to craft gear somehow without going into a campaign).


Lamdred Al'Ker - OTG

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I hope you are correct. They did say something about being able to "learn the game" in the EK, so I assume there will be mobs. It would also be nice to have very small amounts of resources to gather for learning how to craft.  (after all you have to craft gear somehow without going into a campaign).

Why?    I never saw anything that said you could learn the game in the EK ( not sure how that would be possible as the game is in the campaigns )  unless it was just a tutorial.    Could you provide the source and the link where this was advised?


Maybe it not about the happy ending. Maybe it's about the story.

RIP Doc Gonzo "to anyone...speak your mind...defend your position...be prepared for an Argument and enjoy the process of the discussion...that's all part of any good Forum experience"

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