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Jihan

Non-Combat Pose (Sitting)

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The simple dynamic of sitting down to regen added a lot of emergent gameplay to Shadowbane, and I'd like to see it revisited.

 

If someone was sitting down, it meant two very important things: their defenses were lowered, and they would not be able to move or attack until a standing-up animation completed.

 

It's very hard to have a not-completely-consensual conversation with someone who is standing up and ready to run or fight at the press of a button. You can kill them, but you can't negotiate with them (unless they're predisposed to negotiate); they'll almost certainly push buttons rather than chat. If they're sitting down though, you have a little bit of a captive audience- someone's much more likely to be willing to talk if their options to fight or flee are severely penalized.

 

This allows you to have much longer discussions at swordpoint which can lead to mutually agreeable non-violent outcomes - tribute, terms of departure, and so on- which would never happen in a game where a player can always choose to fight instead of talking.

 

Some of my very best Shadowbane memories are of encounters that started with the words "Fir'khanim SIT DOWN if lak want to live!" Please enable a similar mechanic in Crowfall so that I can make people take off their shoes and dance instead of just killing them.


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The simple dynamic of sitting down to regen added a lot of emergent gameplay to Shadowbane, and I'd like to see it revisited.

 

If someone was sitting down, it meant two very important things: their defenses were lowered, and they would not be able to move or attack until a standing-up animation completed.

 

It's very hard to have a not-completely-consensual conversation with someone who is standing up and ready to run or fight at the press of a button. You can kill them, but you can't negotiate with them (unless they're predisposed to negotiate); they'll almost certainly push buttons rather than chat. If they're sitting down though, you have a little bit of a captive audience- someone's much more likely to be willing to talk if their options to fight or flee are severely penalized.

 

This allows you to have much longer discussions at swordpoint which can lead to mutually agreeable non-violent outcomes - tribute, terms of departure, and so on- which would never happen in a game where a player can always choose to fight instead of talking.

 

Some of my very best Shadowbane memories are of encounters that started with the words "Fir'khanim SIT DOWN if lak want to live!" Please enable a similar mechanic in Crowfall so that I can make people take off their shoes and dance instead of just killing them.

Seems to be the trend?   


Maybe it not about the happy ending. Maybe it's about the story.

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The simple dynamic of sitting down to regen added a lot of emergent gameplay to Shadowbane, and I'd like to see it revisited.

 

If someone was sitting down, it meant two very important things: their defenses were lowered, and they would not be able to move or attack until a standing-up animation completed.

 

It's very hard to have a not-completely-consensual conversation with someone who is standing up and ready to run or fight at the press of a button. You can kill them, but you can't negotiate with them (unless they're predisposed to negotiate); they'll almost certainly push buttons rather than chat. If they're sitting down though, you have a little bit of a captive audience- someone's much more likely to be willing to talk if their options to fight or flee are severely penalized.

 

This allows you to have much longer discussions at swordpoint which can lead to mutually agreeable non-violent outcomes - tribute, terms of departure, and so on- which would never happen in a game where a player can always choose to fight instead of talking.

 

Some of my very best Shadowbane memories are of encounters that started with the words "Fir'khanim SIT DOWN if lak want to live!" Please enable a similar mechanic in Crowfall so that I can make people take off their shoes and dance instead of just killing them.

How much time can a legendary hero to get up? 0.5 seconds (or less) if you are wearing light armor? 3 seconds if wearing a full plate?
 
The first case nullifies the  "not be able to move or attack until a standing-up animation completed" mechanic. Perhaps a unsheathe mechanic could work better combined with the sitting one.
 
Overall i agree with the idea.

With only poison in my veins!


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Seems to be the trend?   

 

I think there's a significant difference between "slaughter is bad and scary" and "slaughter is a useful tool but I'd like to have more tools in my toolbox than just that one", but you are of course free to disagree.


Official "Bad Person" of Crowfall

"I think 1/3rd of my postcount is telling people that we aren't turning into a PvE / casual / broad audience game." -

Tully

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I think there's a significant difference between "slaughter is bad and scary" and "slaughter is a useful tool but I'd like to have more tools in my toolbox than just that one", but you are of course free to disagree.

 

Yeah, definitely a way to open up discourse with players of opposing teams, instead of just blowing your load on sight. People on these forums are way too quick to cry gonzo.

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The simple dynamic of sitting down to regen added a lot of emergent gameplay to Shadowbane, and I'd like to see it revisited.

 

If someone was sitting down, it meant two very important things: their defenses were lowered, and they would not be able to move or attack until a standing-up animation completed.

 

It's very hard to have a not-completely-consensual conversation with someone who is standing up and ready to run or fight at the press of a button. You can kill them, but you can't negotiate with them (unless they're predisposed to negotiate); they'll almost certainly push buttons rather than chat. If they're sitting down though, you have a little bit of a captive audience- someone's much more likely to be willing to talk if their options to fight or flee are severely penalized.

 

This allows you to have much longer discussions at swordpoint which can lead to mutually agreeable non-violent outcomes - tribute, terms of departure, and so on- which would never happen in a game where a player can always choose to fight instead of talking.

 

Some of my very best Shadowbane memories are of encounters that started with the words "Fir'khanim SIT DOWN if lak want to live!" Please enable a similar mechanic in Crowfall so that I can make people take off their shoes and dance instead of just killing them.

Do you think players should be able to sit down and regenerate on any spot of the campaign map though?


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Do you think players should be able to sit down and regenerate on any spot of the campaign map though?

 

The devs talked about warmth and food, so I guess you need to be fed and have a heat spot nearby to regenerate health.

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The devs talked about warmth and food, so I guess you need to be fed and have a heat spot nearby to regenerate health.

 

I would assume that the fire is only necessary in Fall/Winter and only during the night time in Fall.

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Do you think players should be able to sit down and regenerate on any spot of the campaign map though?

The place don't matter that much if you have the materials to make a bonfire or if you had some prepared food in your inventory. It's a risk you choose to take or not. More important is: how much time is needed to regenerate the health pool?

Edited by hilkmkz

With only poison in my veins!


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I would love a sit mechanic...  Risk vs Reward.  If you sit down, you may get ganked!! 

I get the very strong impression that simply existing is the only requirement for the 'may get ganked' risk...

 

Maybe something like screaming 'Ransom!' in local in Eve?  If the other dude agrees, you've got a little bit to try and convince him where neither of you can attack the other.  Course, others can still come screaming in.  Is the dude actually wanting to ransom his life, or is he just waiting for friends to arrive?  Are your friends who are on the way more powerful than his friends?

 

Most of the time, I expect things to end with the drawing of daggers and people dying in a gurgling rush of blood.  :3


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I actually would like to see three states, with a time to transition between them all.

 

Surrender/Parlay/Peace/W.e - this is the "sit" you are suggesting.  Cannot move (or can only move extremely slowly), and cannot act, can only talk.  I actually think this could, for the sake of just the look/feel, be a hands up, standing straight, not prepared to move stance, rather than a sit, but that's more a style thing than a mechanical thing.

 

Mobile - this is the non-combat state that still allows freedom of movement.  This is the fastest state, and would both be the optimal state for traveling or for fleeing a fight.  However, abilities cannot be used in this mode, so it is still a way to show "I'm willing to negotiate" without completely surrendering to the enemy, like in the previous state.  Visually, I imagine this as having your weapon sheathed and your body in a more active, loose pose.

 

Combat - standard combat state, slower than mobile, but obviously still fast enough for combat to be fun.  This one I think is pretty obvious to people.  It would be the default mode in most other MMOs.

 

 

This mechanic would have to introduce time to move from the Surrender stance to the Mobile stance, and then again a time delay to draw or sheathe weapons from Mobile to Combat, or vice versa.

 

Benefits:

  • Not only does this work for a "nobody move" situation, it also means that setting up an ambush can give you an advantage over a very mobile group, as you'll be able to get an ability or CC in before they can even transition to a combat mode and respond.
  • Whenever you're moving through the world, you then have the interesting choice of "do I want to get there quickly, or do I want to be prepared to fight?"
  • There's just something cool about the idea of that "quickdraw" moment in stories/movies/whatever that isn't generally emulated in games.  This would allow that.

Cons/Difficulties/Potential Issues

 

  • Balancing the transition speeds between these 3 modes would be tough
  • Do we make draw-speed a skill?  I'd love that, but again, the balance would be tough to decide
  • How do we give the Mobile state enough speed to be a valid choice, but not so much speed that it's like dancing around Combat people and too hard to hit
  • Really, it's all just unforeseen implementation and balance issues.  I can't think of any other obvious drawbacks to this system.

 

All of that said, I totally agree with OPs idea.  Sit/StandInPlace/whatever we call it, I would love to see that be a state, and then hopefully make all three :)

Edited by theDoctor

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I suppose centaurs would have the advantage of never sitting?

 

Also I think the heavier your armor the longer it should takes you to get up.  To a tank wearing really heavy armor, a short delay on combat might not matter as much.

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The devs talked about warmth and food, so I guess you need to be fed and have a heat spot nearby to regenerate health.

 

Even better, combine them. You have to sit down at the fire/heat spot to regen health and you have to sit to eat a meal. This would also be an easy way to keep people from ducking behind cover and eating their roasted pig in three seconds flat then rejoining the fight with an extra 10% hp or whatever. I'm not sure what rout they are planning to go for the food system but I really don't want to see pigchuggingbehidrocks.

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And even if they opt to not have sitting be something that affects gameplay, I hope they allow it for RP purposes.  Sitting on benches and chairs in taverns, etc.


"Food for the crows..."    Nobuo Xa'el

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