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toxophile

Will Swg Ever Have A True Successor?

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Felt compelled to swing by here and say hello.  Very much looking forward to seeing a lot of folks from SWG in CrowFall. Maybe even some of the old Galactic Senate peeps? :)

 

To toss my two cents in, I don't think there will ever be a game as sandboxy as SWG was originally built as - but I think CrowFall can get awfully close in terms of sheer immersive strength.  It's also obvious the team is dedicated to building that "old school" style game that so many crave, and I can't wait to play it and get myself thoroughly stomped.

Not to 'dis Crowfall or anything, but I don't see it coming anywhere close to SWG. Not even the same planet. Yeah, the crafting looks to be pretty cool, but that is about it. Even if the EK turns out to be a decorator's paradise, it can't come close. Again, this isn't a dig at CF. It's just not in the same space at SWG was in, and wasn't meant to be. It's a pvp sandbox with moba elements in it. Can you imagine the detonation of hate on these forums if the dev's announced they were adding a Dancer Discipline with a half dozen motion-captured dances?! lol......


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Yeah as highly as some of us think of SWG, I wouldn't ever want another game to be tagged as the "successor'. I wouldn't wish that pressure on anyone. Even SWTOR which was a themepark game through and through and only thing in common was the Star Wars name, suffered a bit from that feeling that it HAS to be made a certain way because its Star Wars game or the next MMO SW game to be made.

 

Like was said before just remember it for what it was and lets move on.

Edited by pang

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Have you played "The Re-population"? It has been cited as being the spiritual successor to SWG (Built on the same engine as SWTOR ironically enough), It is on Steam Early Access, and i have attempted to play a few time but cant seem to "get into it", and it runs really bad and is buggy, but has loads of potential.

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Have you played "The Re-population"? It has been cited as being the spiritual successor to SWG (Built on the same engine as SWTOR ironically enough), It is on Steam Early Access, and i have attempted to play a few time but cant seem to "get into it", and it runs really bad and is buggy, but has loads of potential.

 

Runs really bad and is buggy? Definitely sounds like the spiritual successor to SWG launch...

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It's also very early in development still but I log in periodically just to check updates and they just did a pretty major overhaul of the UI.  I definitely feel a bit of SWG in it in regards to things like the skills and what not.

 

Out of everything released since SWG this one feels the most like it and has the most potential imho.

Edited by advion

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The repop just doesn't grab me like swg did. I don't know what it is but even with all the options for gameplay it just doesn't feel alive to me.


(づ ˘ ³˘)づ

Hug it Out

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Repopulation reminds me of Fallen Earth.  An attempt at sandbox with no foundation.   Sand is nice in that you can build so much with it but you can't forget the box that holds it all in.  With SWG we had a pre-conceived notion of what the SW universe was all about.  We had seen the movies, read many (some all) of the books, ate the breakfast cereal, and camped outside the theater when episode I came out (we did not do this for ep II or III... fool me once Lucus).  But I digress.  SWG had a foundation and you can not build something from scratch and expect it to succeed SWG.


Just imagine a smiley after everything I say.  Works out best for us all.

 

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"Will SWG ever have a true sequel?"

No. The idea of a virtual world is a fondly-remembered, but dead concept. Star Citizen may come close, but only if it fufills the massive scope of its ambition.

Edited by Psyentific

Hardcore gamer & tabletop enthusiast. Enjoys roleplaying, pretending to be stupid, and one-sided fun.

Goodposting 101: How to Keep the Forums Clean

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I wonder, when did Role-Playing Game go from being a MMORPG to being an MMO - create a custom appearance for a generic character that is exactly the same in every way but appearance as any other character of the same class game?  Oh that's right, when MMOs started copying Dungeons and Dragons with WoW instead of being like MUDs

 

Developers make excuses till their blue in the face as to why MMOs these days lack the vastness and the openess of MMOs pre-WoW, they say "graphics today means that you can't have large empty open worlds anymore" which is BS excuse, computers then had just as much trouble running those games as computers today have running games with high level graphics.

 

I'll tell you what the problem is ...

 

Money people forcing developers to make games according to what they think will maximize profits and lazy game designers who are incapable of coming up with not only original ideas, but able to design complex and dynamic game systems.

 

There are too many fanboys of game development in the development industry and not enough 'real' developers.

 

What is a Game Designer who is a fanboy?  Someone who copy+pastes their favorite childhood game, re-skins it then morphs it to appeal to the demands of the money person.

 

What is a Game Designer who is a 'real' designer?  Someone who looks expanding on ideas, mashing ideas and coming up with completely new ideas.

 

Problem is there are too many designers and no real designers.

 

If you can't design and want to get involved in game development, there are many other paths you can pick.  It's a good thing design tech schools are getting more and more picky with who they let in now.  You have to prove to them you have a head of a designer, not some collecting stamps who is like "me want to make games!", ESPECIALLY the fighting game fanboys, I swear the industry is full of those guys, funny thing is they can never make fighting games because programmers and artists just scowl at them when they ask, because they do all the hard work.


My hubris is the size of a 2 by 4 nailed to the side of a YF-12 jet barrel rolling into a volcano piloted by a Tyrannosaurus Rex.

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I role-play in every MMORPG so the RP is always there for me.

 

Good point. Though sandbox is much more suitable for that kind of gameplay. Themeparks are... restricting, rigid. And lots of them does not bother deliver immersive story to compensate for that.

 

I always thought it is much more fun to perceive game from character's standpoint. And when you play a good sandbox you don't have to make yourself see game that way, the very gameplay mechanics suggests that.


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If it will be better, then... But point about developers moving from world simulation to virtual toys was valid for too long. So few games have 'living' environment.

 

As for SWG at first I was with everyone about how good it is, etc. After playing SWGEmu I can vouch: still good. Well, except for one server, but that's another story. So I'd separate nostalgic rambling from what SWG really is. Not was, still is. That's my take on this now.


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If it will be better, then... But point about developers moving from world simulation to virtual toys was valid for too long. So few games have 'living' environment.

 

As for SWG at first I was with everyone about how good it is, etc. After playing SWGEmu I can vouch: still good. Well, except for one server, but that's another story. So I'd separate nostalgic rambling from what SWG really is. Not was, still is. That's my take on this now.

is that one server Bloodfin?  ive heard stories about bloodfin

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I did have some fun on the EMU. The only thing that killed it was the sub 1k population (if you're lucky a couple dozen total on at the same time). SWG's strength was in it's community and it's market. It's difficult to run a show when all of the people around you are just doing it all themselves too. But I suppose if you had a large guild that all played together, that could be cool. I keep an eye on the Repopulation, but it looks as though they are still a couple years away from being ready.


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is that one server Bloodfin?  ive heard stories about bloodfin

 

Sorry, did not see you answer earlier. Yeah, it is. I did not witness anything firsthand but I was duly warned by my friends not to join that one. So I did not.

 

 

I did have some fun on the EMU. The only thing that killed it was the sub 1k population (if you're lucky a couple dozen total on at the same time). SWG's strength was in it's community and it's market. It's difficult to run a show when all of the people around you are just doing it all themselves too.

 

No argument here. From Coster's articles I imagine the scope and I must concur.

 

'Star Wars Galaxies' is a game where my tactics 'I will come back later and it will be better' that worked with almost every MMORPG failed me utterly. :)

 

 

But I suppose if you had a large guild that all played together, that could be cool. I keep an eye on the Repopulation, but it looks as though they are still a couple years away from being ready.

 

That's my case. At first I had experience similar to yours...

 

Well, actually first time I run SWGEmu I bumped into an SWG veteran that gave me means of transportation and offered help. I thanked him and refused, being impressed how friendly people on Basilisk are. But game was totally incomplete with some missions on Corellia were sending you to open sea, for example. I decided not to continue. Later I started again and community was good too, but everyone were going about their own business. I played for some time, but left due to being busy with RL. At the moment I have a bunch of friends that invited me to Awakening. When I finish with my business I'll join them. They say server is fine and Jedi unlock is mystery - like it was at start.

 

While community is much smaller it is much more passionate and driven then ever before - that's my opinion. Smaller, yes. But still good.


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I wonder if we could rustle up 200 or 300 people willing to play SWG full time? We'd split into two or three guilds, and use both factions too partake of the Galactic Civil War, and just start playing. We could even time our starts so everyone is on the same footing. I bet the people already there would love to see more faces. Man, to be able to play a CH or a BE again, heh.


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I sincerely hope so. Like I said: I have some things to sort out before I'll join SWG, but I plan to work on this.

 

To this day I see no better place to establish something interesting, in a vein of previous official SWG. But people need community, otherwise it's just fails. I do not think we'll need more then 200-300 people you mention, just those really interested in playing SWG as much as it was back then.


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I think the concept of "Virtual Worlds" is dead because all people want these days is "COOL LOOKING GRAPHIX", although we have the technology ..

This is the situation from my perspective and what I think is the case by what I've observed.

 

  1. Console market is bigger therefore more money, but consoles are cheap hardware with tech which is comparatively 5 years behind PC's in their mid range today so developers have to compensate and what we get on Steam is the leftovers from that rather than a real effort to bring out a game which takes advantage of the superior power of a PC.
  2. Impassioned lazy development teams who are mostly designers and artists as programmers would rather work for companies where they get better pay because there are so few programmers they are given the freedom to be picky with their jobs once they acquire a resume, effectively making the majority of programmers working at game studios these days as interns who for all accounts and purposes have no idea how to optimize a game, reverse engineer a game engine so they can optimize it for that game by removing legacy things from middle ware development kits etc.
  3. An industry more concerned with selling products via hype and appealing to the press who in turn appeals to minorities and social justice warriors, rather than an industry focused on appealing to fans or listening to the ideas of veteran game designers who know what their talking about.
  4. Everyone trying to emulate Blizzard without being like Blizzard by attempting to approach appealing to casuals in their own way and completely missing the mark because they fail to understand the subtle design approach which Blizzard takes with all their games to achieve this, Blizzard does it via their game design, not via the features and contents of their games.
  5. An industry that wastes an incredible amount of money on unnecessary gimmicks and flashy things, such as outsourcing CGI studios and paying them stupid sums of money to make cut scenes and hiring expensive voice actors just to "look as good" as Blizzard.
  6. The 3 Big Words:  Clash of Clans (Previously Farmville), Call of Duty, League of Legends (Previously World of Warcraft)
  7. Fanboys become Game Designers become Bad Game Designers high on and blinded by their own inner fanboy (The Street Fighter obsessives are the worst).
  8. Forced minimum system regulations for MMOs to broaden the potential customer base which results in neutering the potential of an MMO due to forced restrictions so they can cator to people with budget off the shelf computers and not just people with $3000+ gaming rigs, as marketing groups think that most people who play MMOs are the kind of people who want to play video games on a DELL desktop or laptop with a low end graphics card in it.  Combine that with people wanting "pretty looking game", then you have a recipe for no virtual world, but instead a series of lobbied rooms with doors or a very tiny game world.
  9. More people are now playing multiple games rather than being dedicated to a single game, prompting a market response to produce games which can deliver a whole experience in small chunks, rather than games which are full of depth and require a lot of time and dedication.
  10. The market is now more competitive than ever combined with a much greater chance for success than during the 90s and 2000s where unless they were front page on a magazine their company was guaranteed to go bankrupt by the end of the year because their games barely sold.  This combined with what is stated above, encourages developers to focus more on delivering instant gratification games, clones or something artsy so it will stand out and people will notice it, rather than try and make something new to cater to a new audience.
  11. Everything being made now is just a graphical upgrade of something which has been done before but no one knows about it because as said above, unless their game got featured in a magazine or you were told about it by a friend in the 90s or 2000s, no one knew about it, case in point, if Shadowbane was made today, it wouldn't of had the same fate as it did when it was made in 2003 for example.
  12. And the worst and likely the biggest problem, developers for the most part these days follow single minded and narrow idea paths, rather than thinking big and dreaming big, because their lead to think that doing those things is silly and can lead to financial failure.
  13. And even today Games based on IP, although they are guaranteed to get funded for the development, their hands are tied, on one end of the spectum they have the fans screaming one thing, they make one mistake the fans will hang their reputation.  On the other they have the IP owner making sure they don't make them and the IP look bad.  All the while they're design decisions are either altered by someone else for the purpose of sales or restricted for the purpose of cannon.  Bad games based on IP are a result of either a lack of freedom to follow the design choices someone wants to make combined with the botched resulting decisions because they couldn't make them and they lacked the talent or imagination for a creative alternative, or re-skinning an existing game or copying another game and using the IP as a vehicle to sell a bad game.  Unfortunately despite everything that has always happened in the past, the past repeats itself frequently.
Edited by Psyctooth

My hubris is the size of a 2 by 4 nailed to the side of a YF-12 jet barrel rolling into a volcano piloted by a Tyrannosaurus Rex.

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