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A Comparison Of Crowfall And Camelot Unchained

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Agreed, best case scenario they'll complement each other for many years to come.


Best case they both succeed and developers realise they can make a successful MMO without copying WoW.


Realistically that'd just mean a decade of CU and CF clones.

David Sirlin's Balancing Multiplayer Games should be mandatory reading for all gamers.

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Cool list but probably too perfectionistic. You can't say that there won't be seasons in the CU. They can add it as Christmas event and I bet they will. And saying that it all will be on one map is also quite confusing. Their islands will shatter when they are besieged and will connect to the besieging factions islands.



To those who want to simplify it: Camelot Unchained and Dungeon Defenders Unchained actually can use same engine very well. It is actually very similar just in Camelot there are not orcs but other real playears on the opposing side. Crafting etc. is there for distraction when no battles are going on. And only the interesting mechanic in CU is interaction of skills. And there are not defensing towers too.


Crowfall is completely new genre with a lot more unique mechanisms (than just one) that we have never seen before .

Edited by ChosenOfCastle

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#19 is the difference between the two....and the reason that 99% of us are backing Crowfall.


Player Looting!!  either partial loot, or 100% full loot!!


Camelot...Its just another KareBear PvE MMO, that are a dime a dozen.


Crowfall....just by the Player Looting element, makes the game different and exciting to lots of MMO gamers who have been waiting for a game like this.


Player looting brings so much more to the gameplay that you can possibly understand, unless you have played a full loot game, you have no idea.


I believe, that there is really no comparison to Camelot to Crowfall.  There are two completely different games entirely.  Sure, they may look the same, run the same, classes the same.....but once you put in full loot vrs no loot.....it changes everything.


In other words....Crowfall = PvP......Camelot is PvE




In my mind Player Looting is not a core PvP decision making element, because it is inherently a dangerous/volatile dynamic for a game and it's community.


I make this assertion without having any trouble with Player Looting being in a game in PVP.  But consider "Player Looting" from the perspective of that volatile nature, like a chunk of unstable C4:


If the game is "balanced" for PvP . . . . yes I'll agree, Player Looting adds spice to PvP.


IF the game is "not balanced" for PvP it turns into one facet of a forest fire that burns a game/community out.  What you'll have left (as an example) would be the few at the top of the "imbalance heap" pumping out the old, tired, not-very-clever-anymore excuse that "playor-loot-zors makes the game!  Real men/women realize that, everyone else is care-bear-zors!".


In short, I would rather argue that Player Looting is an icing dynamic (IMO).  Certainly OK to have, adds consequence to losing PvP fights, etc.


But Player Looting doesn't work as you've promoted IMO unless things are running well enough overall that it provides the proper feedback to the dynamic (e.g. positive, not negative).  That means it's constructive deployment hinges on things more foundational.


My opinion anyway.

Edited by Bramble

“Letting your customers set your standards is a dangerous game, because the race to the bottom is pretty easy to win. Setting your own standards--and living up to them--is a better way to profit. Not to mention a better way to make your day worth all the effort you put into it." - Seth Godin

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Biggest things that seperate the games imo are


Combat - tab target vs action... tried and true albeit boring system vs potential fun but it could be a catastrophe


Performance - 500+ vs 200... already proven 500+ engine vs unity issues, 200 if were lucky


Building - little blocks vs prebuilt pieces... blocks = more options but doesnt look as refined


Progression - standard single character vs passive account wide... passive could be great or not, wont know until its been tried for a while, potentilly less attachment to your character


World - persistant vs temporary... Persistant could have better community with the same ppl all the time, but temporary could fix the big reset problem and add excitment to the beginning and end of campaigns


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I am looking forward to both. However, I'm afraid both have missed the lessons from the best pvp game ever in EvE Online. Hopefully I'm wrong.


Players need to have a sense of investment. Guilds and alliances need to build/upgrade/protect their sovereign territory. The days of capturing the same keeps over and over again are over, and will not hold peoples interest for long. Loot/consequence matters! Goons just got ejected from Deklein after nearly a decade of owning that land. Real investment, not fake point to point overnight keep trading.

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