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snowmizer

The Dregs....exploits For Large Guilds?

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My big fear, is that the Dregs, or other campaigns, will be able to be exploited by 2 large guilds working together. Now, i dont know how these Campaigns will run ( how your guild gets into one, and who you go against).....but i hope they keep this possible scenario in mind...

 

Guild A joins a Dreg Campaign....

Guild B joins the same Campaign...

 

Guild A and B work together, guaranteeing that Guild A wins the Campaign, by never attacking Guild A, and crushing anyone who joins the campaign ( along with Guild A)

 

Guild A, who has no real opposition.....Pulls as many resources out of the Campaign as it can and wins.

 

And on another Campaign, on their alts, Guild B wins and loots everything, with Guild A's alts doing the same thing.

 

My question is, how can this be prevented?  Totally random chances of joining campaigns?  ( although ive read, that you can join any campaign you want at any time, but get more rewards the longer you have been in the campaign...preventing jumpers from coming in at the last minute and getting full rewards)

 

If this possible scenario of Guild A and B working together isnt prevented....it will be exploited to the maximum!!!

 

And if you think the campaigns will be too big for 2 guilds to just dominate it...that is a question that needs answers, but some guilds, and i wont mention names, but we all know who they are, have hundreds of players.  Also, whats to stop a bunch of medium sized guilds from doing the same thing??

 

Thoughts??

 

snow-miser-o.gif

 

this will definitely happen.. if this is anything like Shadowbane we'll likely eventually end up seeing the campaigns develop into US vs EU vs ASIA. In Shadowbane it got really bad trying to fend off the zerg of Asian guilds/nations that band together against anyone else besides Asian guilds.


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lol ok.. I wonder if I'll still be able to steal directly from people's inventories.. hrmmm

;)Twitch - Twitter

RIP DOC GONZO

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My big fear, is that the Dregs, or other campaigns, will be able to be exploited by 2 large guilds working together. Now, i dont know how these Campaigns will run ( how your guild gets into one, and who you go against).....but i hope they keep this possible scenario in mind...

 

Guild A joins a Dreg Campaign....

Guild B joins the same Campaign...

 

Guild A and B work together, guaranteeing that Guild A wins the Campaign, by never attacking Guild A, and crushing anyone who joins the campaign ( along with Guild A)

 

Guild A, who has no real opposition.....Pulls as many resources out of the Campaign as it can and wins.

 

And on another Campaign, on their alts, Guild B wins and loots everything, with Guild A's alts doing the same thing.

 

My question is, how can this be prevented? Totally random chances of joining campaigns? ( although ive read, that you can join any campaign you want at any time, but get more rewards the longer you have been in the campaign...preventing jumpers from coming in at the last minute and getting full rewards)

 

If this possible scenario of Guild A and B working together isnt prevented....it will be exploited to the maximum!!!

 

And if you think the campaigns will be too big for 2 guilds to just dominate it...that is a question that needs answers, but some guilds, and i wont mention names, but we all know who they are, have hundreds of players. Also, whats to stop a bunch of medium sized guilds from doing the same thing??

 

Thoughts??

 

 

snow-miser-o.gif

If that's the case I'll go play a different campaign and have no desire to be part of either guild, because that sounds booooooring.

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LotD put together an alliance in Warhammer that crushed a 1200-1300 person Goon guild.  So, I disagree.

How'd it work out for them in GW2?  Oh yeah, the titan alliance humilated them and the goons and the DaoC guys and everyone else too.

 

What we really need is a new word for "meta zerg" so people who can only think in terms of in-game tactics will stop interjecting with irrelevancies like friendly fire.

Global guilds that have thousands of players online 24x7 will dominate this game and turn it into a defacto PvE game unless the design team thinks carefully about the meta guild dynamics.

Edited by kroked

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this will definitely happen.. if this is anything like Shadowbane we'll likely eventually end up seeing the campaigns develop into US vs EU vs ASIA. In Shadowbane it got really bad trying to fend off the zerg of Asian guilds/nations that band together against anyone else besides Asian guilds.

"will definetly happen" is a bit much. There will be multiple worlds all with different rule sets. Perhaps on some worlds it will be easy to accomplish but on FFA worlds, you could most likely escape such over bearing guild domination. Going even further... ACE could have some tricks up their sleeve to solve some of these issues. We'll just have to wait and find out.  B)

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How'd it work out for them in GW2? Oh yeah, the titan alliance humilated them and the goons and the DaoC guys and everyone else too.

 

What we really need is a new word for "meta zerg" so people who can only think in terms of in-game tactics will stop interjecting with irrelevancies like friendly fire.

Global guilds that have thousands of players online 24x7 will dominate this game and turn it into a defacto PvE game unless the design team thinks carefully about the meta guild dynamics.

I was actually part of the Titan Alliance in GW2, and you're right in that only a group of equally dedicated guilds could have stopped that monstrosity, but that was largely due to the rule set and winning conditions in GW2. There were no guild winners. It was all for the server which meant that those that could organize their server the most efficiently would likely win. Also, while skill came into play on occasion, much more important was having enough coverage to stay organized across 4 different maps 24/7. That took an unreasonable amount of players to accomplish.

 

In Crowfall they're not pitting server against server. They'd pitting guilds against guilds. Some guilds may try to roll out with 1200 person mega-zergs, and if that happens alliances can be formed with the goal of not winning, but just stopping them from winning. Or, you could just roll into a different campaign and make the game less fun for them. Those mega-Zerg guilds don't have a great reputation for maintaining their player base through the long haul though. Usually their numbers drastically drop off around the 3 month marker, and the more marked their player base is by the rest of the guilds on the server the more casuals you can pick off of their ranks. No one likes being faceless-meat-toon-#-1247. Adding on to that, other large scale guilds like to pit themselves against guilds that size for the challenge, so there are some naturally occurring counters as well.

 

So dependent on the rule set, yeah... larger guilds may be annoying, but the comparison to GW2 and the Titan Alliance isn't fair because in that game it was server glory which encouraged selflessness. In this game it will be guild glory, and no one of consequence that has a chance at the top spot will set aside their odds to hand another guild the win, or at least not frequently enough to matter in the long haul.


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We did the same in Archeage.  Alliance's can be made but are difficult to keep.  I believe the expression is "herding cats".  I really hope this game turns out a better crowd than AA.  That game seemed to really bring out the worst in people.

 

That game was doomed before it started.  An incredibly toxic community just made it worse.

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Were they spread out over several hundred servers, fighting on different sides, in different campaign modes for worlds that inevitably end? I'm not saying zergs will be a massive problem sweeping through the game, just that you might find yourself with the unlucky 6 month campaign against a guild of diehard people with 2000 members that actually make up 66% of the server alone.

I think your big guilds will concentrate on a single server each.

That way, they can dominate the most easily and bring home the most stuff after the campaign.

The big guilds will likely stay separate at first, either by agreement or scouting before they commit many toons, but once they have gear sets and strong reliquaries they will gravitate toward the tournament campaigns, with the biggest rewards.

My hope is that Crowfall will have niches for many playstyles and guilds.

 

More bodies will probably always be an advantage, like better stats, gear or skills.

 

The Dregs, having the best resources and quickest turnover rate, will attract those guilds who can crush most opposition.

Edited by chancellor

I think the K-Mart of MMO's already exists!  And it ain't us!   :)

 

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I agree these are valid points, however we are unsure how much our characters need. No doubt if a guild leader researched it enough he could evenly distribute rations and say "If I have 3000 people, I need this much wood, this much food hunted, this many animals breeded and a castle of this size erected come fall" then harvest the resources of the planet for his guild only (obviously splitting into groups for "farming", "hunting", etc) and completely take all resources from other players. Do I think we will see this immediately no, but history repeats itself to those who are being ignorant to the facts we have from other games.

Well, let's say a guild actually DOES that and checks how much resources he needs to keep a 1000+ unit army. Okay, that's cool.

 

 

Now imagine if those people start dying, they start dropping their resources. Their items are starting to degrade. Their food is getting dropped, robbed, stolen, fought over.

 

Suddenly those rations he prepared for the army is getting immensly decreased at a very high rate.

The more you bring people with you, the more uncertainty and amount of errors you have to count for. That's the nature of an army.

 

Not to mention, imagine if another guild buys like 200+ guys from that zerg and they start suddenly attacking their own guild or selling materials for other guilds. :D Don't you just LOVE the chaos factor?

 

I dunno, considering all these systems, i just don't see a zerg really working. Since that tactic, while probably valid in many situations still, in most cases they just shouldn't do it. :P Too many uncertainties. 

 

And yes, everything might go to poop but with the system in place, i personally think we are off to great start. :) The thing is; people think the worst right off the bat. While it's healthy, in a sense, but thinking about how that can be remedied is also very helpful for both people AND the devs. That's the way i see it, at least. :3

 

I know i will infiltrate a huge zerg guild and start selling/stealing resources. >:) Since monitoring something like that is near impossible. :D

 

Edited by Torguish

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